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  1. #1

    Why should we pay money for "free" 80s?

    I can understand the prices on server transfers, so people don't do it all the time and cause too much overhead, although that's debatable since server transfers are queued and don't happen instantly. Then there's also the consideration of how people in games like shooters change servers all the time, far more than in WoW, and they never crash, but I digress.

    Then there's the outrageous prices on name changes and appearance changes, as if changing a couple of values in a database capable of processing millions of entries in a few seconds will suddenly crash the server system.

    Now they're thinking of allowing us to pay real money to insta boost to 80?

    Has anyone stopped to think why? Who is being paid for getting me to 80? Is there some guy behind a monitor who just approves everyone who instantly wants a level 80 character? Level 80 is a value in a database for your character which goes something like this:

    HerpDerp
    Class: Herp
    Spec: Derp
    Level: -5

    You want to be 80? Change that value to 80. You're now 80, boom. No really, it's not much more complicated than that, I can assure you. People want their programs and file systems to be as simple as possible to avoid quadratic, cubed and higher complexity algorithms from bogging down their systems.

    These databases work around the clock as people constantly create and delete alts and level them and whatever, they do it automatically and don't crash, so where is the payment in "paid 80s" going to?

    Aaaah who am I kidding with all these explanations and attempts at rationalization about the principle of this thing, you're probably gonna boil this thread down to "lol 15$ isn't that much it's less than a movie ticket" (no it's not).
    Last edited by Ballantines; 2014-01-20 at 12:37 AM.

  2. #2
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    I don't think you know why they charge for premium services. It isn't because there is overhead or "it might crash the system". It's because, one, they don't have to offer such services and two, they want to avoid abuse of those services. A small fee means people take a minute to think of their race, server, faction, and appearance instead of randomly changing them all the time.

    They're also not talking about boosting to 80 but rather boosting to 90 for real money. Also it's very very unlikely that changing the numeric value of your level in a database magically moves to that level. Obviously code is involved somewhere that grants you the passives and skills that go with each level along with adjusting the scaling of your health and other stats as things change. I'm not saying it's complicated (I've designed stuff like that for fun myself) but it's not someone "sitting behind a monitor".

    If you don't want to buy a level 90 boost (if they end up offering it) then don't. No one is forcing you to. You can level any way you want. In the end, no one is going to really care what you did to level.



  3. #3
    Darsithis, no. They charge money because they want to earn as much as possible in every way people will let them. That they're basically slaughtering the cow that gives them milk on the long run apparently doesn't bother them as long as they can just increase the net worth for a small time.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    I don't think you know why they charge for premium services. It isn't because there is overhead or "it might crash the system". It's because, one, they don't have to offer such services and two, they want to avoid abuse of those services. A small fee means people take a minute to think of their race, server, faction, and appearance instead of randomly changing them all the time.

    They're also not talking about boosting to 80 but rather boosting to 90 for real money. Also it's very very unlikely that changing the numeric value of your level in a database magically moves to that level. Obviously code is involved somewhere that grants you the passives and skills that go with each level along with adjusting the scaling of your health and other stats as things change. I'm not saying it's complicated (I've designed stuff like that for fun myself) but it's not someone "sitting behind a monitor".

    If you don't want to buy a level 90 boost (if they end up offering it) then don't. No one is forcing you to. You can level any way you want. In the end, no one is going to really care what you did to level.
    No the thing is I would kill for a free lvl 90 boost (not literally), but I don't see what exactly is costing them extra to allow us to do it besides add a button that allows us to query our level value in their databases and change it. It's like, is that really so hard to code that you can't just include it in our monthly fee and expansion costs?

    As for passive abilities related to your level, I imagine (imagine!) they're dependancy related, like you reach a certain value and a clause statement unlocks them for you, except, that already exists in the game code, all it has to do is not explode when it realizes you suddenly went from 1-90 instead of the typical lvl up level by level.

  5. #5
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleth View Post
    Darsithis, no. They charge money because they want to earn as much as possible in every way people will let them. That they're basically slaughtering the cow that gives them milk on the long run apparently doesn't bother them as long as they can just increase the net worth for a small time.
    They're a business. Every business charges for extras. Honestly I don't get why everyone gets so up in arms about the smallest fees of optional and premium services when it comes to Blizzard. They're a freakin business! They never said "we'll never, ever charge for services, don't fear, loyal fans". If they had, I'd get it, but that never happened.

    They're not "slaughtering the cow that gives them milk". It's a ridiculous statement that is just a way to avoid any real discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ballantines View Post
    No the thing is I would kill for a free lvl 90 boost (not literally), but I don't see what exactly is costing them extra to allow us to do it besides add a button that allows us to query our level value in their databases and change it. It's like, is that really so hard to code that you can't just include it in our monthly fee and expansion costs?

    As for passive abilities related to your level, I imagine (imagine!) they're dependancy related, like you reach a certain value and a clause statement unlocks them for you, except, that already exists in the game code, all it has to do is not explode when it realizes you suddenly went from 1-90 instead of the typical lvl up level by level.
    It's not costing them extra to do it. The point is that it's an optional service that they're not just going to give away for free. Imagine it - no more leveling at all, not even for new people. Buy the game and instantly boost to level 90 on all toons for absolutely nothing. In less than 10 minutes you could have 10, no wait, 20, nah, 30 new characters, all level 90!

    Imagine the gold you could make selling off their gear...or the ease at which you could hide illegal in-game transactions if you could just create level 90's every few minutes.



  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    I don't think you know why they charge for premium services. It isn't because there is overhead or "it might crash the system". It's because, one, they don't have to offer such services and two, they want to avoid abuse of those services. A small fee means people take a minute to think of their race, server, faction, and appearance instead of randomly changing them all the time.

    They're also not talking about boosting to 80 but rather boosting to 90 for real money. Also it's very very unlikely that changing the numeric value of your level in a database magically moves to that level. Obviously code is involved somewhere that grants you the passives and skills that go with each level along with adjusting the scaling of your health and other stats as things change. I'm not saying it's complicated (I've designed stuff like that for fun myself) but it's not someone "sitting behind a monitor".

    If you don't want to buy a level 90 boost (if they end up offering it) then don't. No one is forcing you to. You can level any way you want. In the end, no one is going to really care what you did to level.
    Darsithis we both know that isn't the only reason why they charge. There is a easy way to restrict everything you said, with a cap. For example you can only change servers 1-2 times a year for free. You can't really abuse the system then.

  7. #7
    actually there is a guy behind a monitor who approves and inputs the new value, his name was Stanley and he likes to push buttons for a living and though some people might consider his job soul reaping, Stanley relished every moment of it.

    Joking aside, im pretty sure it's to put a sort of dampening effect on spamming way to many level 90s and rerolling every patch cycle hrm.

  8. #8
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theendgamelv3 View Post
    Darsithis we both know that isn't the only reason why they charge. There is a easy way to restrict everything you said, with a cap. For example you can only change servers 1-2 times a year for free. You can't really abuse the system then.
    That's one way to do it. As I said in another post they're also a business in the business of making money. I don't see anything wrong with that.



  9. #9
    Ok here's another thing Darsithis, take for example hair style change. Why didn't they make that a paid money feature? After all, they coded new barbershops, an achievement, a new interface and allowed us to directly change features on our character without paid intervention.

    Why take all that pain and make it free, but make us pay money for a freakin "level me to 90" button?

  10. #10
    The Patient Dairios's Avatar
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    Honestly, I'm all for a purchased boost to 90. I've got 5 90's, and 4 more 85+ characters, and two below level 70. It's lost it's appeal to me to level 1 - 90 at this point because I've done it so much. Everquest 2 is doing the same thing, and it's not killing them. You can buy an 85 character that comes geared, bagged, and has mounts. But it's not financially feasible to buy 10 of them, they're costly. Like I imagine Blizzards will be as a deterrence against just outright buying your way to 90 on a new server/account.
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  11. #11
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ballantines View Post
    Ok here's another thing Darsithis, take for example hair style change. Why didn't they make that a paid money feature? After all, they coded new barbershops, an achievement, a new interface and allowed us to directly change features on our character without paid intervention.

    Why take all that pain and make it free, but make us pay money for a freakin "level me to 90" button?
    You're going to compare a hairstyle to 90 levels of leveling? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dairios View Post
    Honestly, I'm all for a purchased boost to 90. I've got 5 90's, and 4 more 85+ characters, and two below level 70. It's lost it's appeal to me to level 1 - 90 at this point because I've done it so much. Everquest 2 is doing the same thing, and it's not killing them. You can buy an 85 character that comes geared, bagged, and has mounts. But it's not financially feasible to buy 10 of them, they're costly. Like I imagine Blizzards will be as a deterrence against just outright buying your way to 90 on a new server/account.
    I'm not. I'm against it. I feel like it cheapens a good part of the game - the level 1 - 90 (soon 100) content. At least, I want to make sure new players can't do it right away. They lose out on so much.



  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Ballantines View Post
    Ok here's another thing Darsithis, take for example hair style change. Why didn't they make that a paid money feature? After all, they coded new barbershops, an achievement, a new interface and allowed us to directly change features on our character without paid intervention.

    Why take all that pain and make it free, but make us pay money for a freakin "level me to 90" button?
    You cannot compare the frickin barbershop to the leveling grind, that's retarded and completely unreasonable.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    You're going to compare a hairstyle to 90 levels of leveling? Really?
    Well I'm talking in the amount of effort they put in that system, and the amount of effort they'd supposedly put in this new system.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Stormtrooperz View Post
    You cannot compare the frickin barbershop to the leveling grind, that's retarded and completely unreasonable.
    It's not about that. Why does changing your facial appearance and color cost money, but hair style doesn't, but making a character at lvl 90 does?

  14. #14
    Keyboard Turner
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    Because people will pay for it.

  15. #15
    Old God MerinPally's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ballantines View Post
    Well I'm talking in the amount of effort they put in that system, and the amount of effort they'd supposedly put in this new system.

    - - - Updated - - -



    It's not about that. Why does changing your facial appearance and color cost money, but hair style doesn't, but making a character at lvl 90 does?
    They've answered this before I believe. It's because they want people to actually make decisions with regards to character creation. Something as simple as a hairstyle change is so minor and just flavour that it doesn't hugely matter. Even then - does it matter? Really? They're a business, they want to make money. They choose what to charge for. And you know what? People will pay for it. And others won't. Same as for every single item ever sold in the history of mankind.

  16. #16
    You don't pay for database editing you pay for time you save.

    * You can level new character on new realm for free but you have to spent your time
    * You can pay X $ but get instant level Y

    Do you have free week? use first option, I don't have free time or don't want to waste it - I pay for this service.

    Same shit as real life - you can go from one side of US to another using your car (wasting few days of your time) or you can pay for airplane and get there in few hours. See the difference :P
    By you logic should we get "free" airplanes just because (in theory) we can just walk where we need to?
    Last edited by Serissa; 2014-01-20 at 01:01 AM.
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  17. #17
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ballantines View Post
    Well I'm talking in the amount of effort they put in that system, and the amount of effort they'd supposedly put in this new system
    It's very unlikely a lot of effort was necessary for level 90 boosts. They already have that in place for the SoR when it comes to level 80s. The point of it all is that they're offering a service that takes place outside of the game (for obvious technical reasons) that is completely optional and allows you to purposely skip content and advance your character 90 levels along with gaining free gear that you didn't actually earn by completing the associated quests.

    To prevent abuse (lots of instant 90's for farming/laundering/harassing/botting) it's a pay-per-use service. That simple.



  18. #18
    Ballantines, you are missing the point with this barber shop thing. Your HAIRSTYLE isn't a source of "content" in the game. It is a little in game gold because, sort of like wearing a tabard, it changes your appearance and nothing else. Leveling to 90, while maybe not as much effort might be involved with adding this button you speak of, would require you to entirely skip all the content. You cannot just compare the effort to add the button to level to 90, but the effort of ALL the content you would skip as well. That is why you pay to lvl to 90 vs not paying for a hairstyle.

  19. #19
    Stood in the Fire Jataai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ballantines View Post
    Ok here's another thing Darsithis, take for example hair style change. Why didn't they make that a paid money feature? After all, they coded new barbershops, an achievement, a new interface and allowed us to directly change features on our character without paid intervention.

    Why take all that pain and make it free, but make us pay money for a freakin "level me to 90" button?
    As Darsithis said it would be abusable, also it would make all previous content irrelevant. The buying 90's is so they can make money obviously, but also so that not everyone does it. Hair styles can't really be compared (well, kinda) because it's a minute character alteration and is purely aesthetic.

    EDIT: It seems in the time I took to delicately write this the question has been answered tenfold, Oh well.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zeras View Post
    actually there is a guy behind a monitor who approves and inputs the new value, his name was Stanley and he likes to push buttons for a living and though some people might consider his job soul reaping, Stanley relished every moment of it.
    I see what you did there!!
    Last edited by Jataai; 2014-01-20 at 01:04 AM.

  20. #20
    If the OP isn't even intelligent enough to realize 80 was the level cap two expansions ago, why even bother.

    Keep it civil
    Last edited by Darsithis; 2014-01-20 at 01:05 AM.

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