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  1. #301
    We pay 15$ per month on top of the 60$ for every expansion plus side pets and mounts i think they make enough money

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    So, the first part of your post.... you're saying that they have in the past year discontinued a subscription based service for a game? Tell me more.
    For a game whose subscriptions weren't generating significant revenue. That's what you're missing here. Everyone else is going F2P because they want to attract enough users to make a transition to subscriptions more profitable than microtransactions, not because microtransactions are more profitable. If Blizzard is still making money off of WoW subscriptions there is no reason for them to go F2P!!! My point was that if WoW was genuinely failing to produce revenue through subscriptions they would already have gone F2P. They're not going to do it just because everyone else does, because their executives aren't idiots.

    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    Also, subscriber loss is currently more massive than it has ever been. Wait, just wait till you see the losses coming up. That revenue stream is drying up and a free to play game pulled in more than WoW did in all it's revenue streams combined last year.
    Actually it stabilized considerably over the last couple of quarters, but we'll see how it goes. If the MoP/WoD transition behaves like the Cataclysm/MoP transition subscriptions will gradually decline until the month before WoD is released. Then they'll spike for a few months before plummeting once everyone hits max level. Then they'll stabilize and plateau before gradually declining until the next release. Just because the stream is drying up ever so gradually doesn't mean it's completely tapped out.

    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    They need to draw as many people to the game (or back) to maximize microtransactions.
    Why? Honestly, is the kind of person who is unwilling to pony up $15 a month for access to everything in the game also the kind of person who is going to shell out $5 for yet another freaking pet??? The alternative is to go to a pay-to-win strategy like SWTOR, and I guarantee that will only serve to alienate existing subscribers. SWTOR could afford to do this because they didn't actually have any subscribers. It's much easier to go F2P when you have nothing to lose from it.

    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    The best way to do that is to go "hey, look that game you didn't want to sub to is now free!" "...and hey, how would you like a max level character for 29.99 to start off with?" WoW has way more brand recognition than any of the six games on top of it in that list. Nobody is in a better spot to take the top of that list in 2014 than activision.
    More tech startups than you will ever know went bankrupt in 2000 following that train of thought. This is the kind of thinking that went into AOL's purchase of Netscape and even the subsequent AOL-Time Warner merger. Everyone needed to buy ISPs and browsers because the Internet was a money machine just begging to pay out. No one stopped to consider why it was a money machine or how to get it to pay out. The business plan you're laying out is essentially:

    Go F2P
    Emphasize Microtransactions
    ???
    Profit

    The ??? is what you need to fill in because so far, $230 million from fans who are so enthusiastic about a game that they're still paying $15 a month just to play it does not indicate that the general population would generate the revenue required to offset the $700 million that Blizzard would be throwing away by going F2P. When the revenue from microtransactions starts to outstrip the revenue from subscriptions I'm pretty sure that Blizzard will change its tune. Until that happens predictions about an imminent transition to F2P are just wishful thinking.
    Quote Originally Posted by CandyCotton Marshmallows View Post
    People need to get over the gear color (and themselves). It doesn't matter, and it shouldn't matter what other players have either. Worry about your damn self. Live your life by that. If you want to concern yourself with someone else, then worry about HELPING them, not putting them down or making sure you stand out as better than them.
    Maybe the game would be better with more low DPS nice guys and fewer high DPS jerks? -- Ghostcrawler, Twitter, 6/29/13

  3. #303
    Quote Originally Posted by Ronduwil View Post
    Actually it stabilized considerably over the last couple of quarters, but we'll see how it goes.
    Stabilized? It's lost subs for the entire past year. ...and they pulled release date shenanigans to save the 3qt numbers in front of blizzcon. Like I said, you'll hear the 4qt 2013 number soon. That will be the wake up call for most of the denial crowd.

    Again, a F2P MMO probably made more than the blizzard flagship in 2013. There is no way the current model sticks this year for WoW.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronduwil View Post

    Why? Honestly, is the kind of person who is unwilling to pony up $15 a month for access to everything in the game also the kind of person who is going to shell out $5 for yet another freaking pet??? The alternative is to go to a pay-to-win strategy like SWTOR, and I guarantee that will only serve to alienate existing subscribers. SWTOR could afford to do this because they didn't actually have any subscribers. It's much easier to go F2P when you have nothing to lose from it.
    Why? Because some game you never heard of made almost a billion dollars doing it, that's your proof. The gaming community does not want to commit to subscriptions any more, it's a fact. WoW has nothing to lose.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronduwil View Post
    More tech startups than you will ever know went ...................................................................................
    This isn't a start up, it's not the dot comm bubble, this is the highest profile MMO out there in a marketplace that has changed to a product model that is making billions without the marketing that activision could bring to it.

  4. #304
    The Lightbringer Haidaes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dilbon View Post
    Oops sorry, I remembered wrong, it was Crossfire that was almost a billion.
    Which still is mind boggling for me...

  5. #305
    Epic! Miuku's Avatar
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    Thank you gamers for essentially ruining gaming.

    Ya'll make me so proud.
    :: We are cows - proud and true. Come on Tauren - Moo Moo Moo!

  6. #306
    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    Why? Because some game you never heard of made almost a billion dollars doing it, that's your proof.
    And Blizzard has made over $10 billion with its subscription based model. What are you trying to prove?

    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    The gaming community does not want to commit to subscriptions any more, it's a fact. WoW has nothing to lose.
    There were $713 million counter-examples to that argument in the first three quarters alone. Apparently Blizzard doesn't even need to go F2P to make money off microtransactions.

    Quote Originally Posted by thelightthatstrays View Post
    This isn't a start up, it's not the dot comm bubble, this is the highest profile MMO out there in a marketplace that has changed to a product model that is making billions without the marketing that activision could bring to it.
    Instead of a proliferation of web sites and startups we have a proliferation of F2P games and microtransactions. The actors may be different, but the show is old and tired. If F2P is so successful why does Microsoft have assets totalling $142.43 billion while Red Hat is still at $2.9 billion? Ask any computer scientist which is the better operating system and Linux generally wins hands down, so it's not the quality. It's the fact that 0 multiplied by 10 million = 0. Microtransactions only go so far.
    Quote Originally Posted by CandyCotton Marshmallows View Post
    People need to get over the gear color (and themselves). It doesn't matter, and it shouldn't matter what other players have either. Worry about your damn self. Live your life by that. If you want to concern yourself with someone else, then worry about HELPING them, not putting them down or making sure you stand out as better than them.
    Maybe the game would be better with more low DPS nice guys and fewer high DPS jerks? -- Ghostcrawler, Twitter, 6/29/13

  7. #307
    Legendary! Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by loki504 View Post
    you think server transfer doesn't cost blizzard anything? some on you can do better. everyting they do its going to cost them money. how much no1 know. but even if 1 guy is doing transfers all day its still going to cost them money. people don't work for free for blizzard.
    Pretty sure they dont have some guy in a room manually performing all the server changes, race changes, and name changes. Im sure its done automatically by computer which doesnt cost Blizzard a dime since those computers are running whether someone get a transfer or not

  8. #308
    Where do they get these numbers? I wonder if this includes time cards on the store.

    For perspective, this is about $30 per current player. So like everyone bought at least one mount or transfer or something in 2013, averaged out (of course in reality some people are making lots of microtransactions and some are making none). Or like, two months worth of subs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Smece View Post
    I never thought these numbers could be so huge.
    Is it finally time for WoW to go ftp? -sorry if this is already posted.
    Irrelevant to the FTP argument. But remember, WoW has what 7 million subs? Times $15 times 12 months... $1.3 billion per annum*. So the cash shop is only 17% of their total income.

    *Probably less due to different payment options in Asia and the fact not all those people sub for the whole year, this is just an estimate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  9. #309
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    Pretty sure they dont have some guy in a room manually performing all the server changes, race changes, and name changes. Im sure its done automatically by computer which doesnt cost Blizzard a dime since those computers are running whether someone get a transfer or not
    And the software maintaining that process just fixes itself every time a patch breaks it, right? The computer it runs on automatically ensures it's always running the latest OS patches and incorporating the latest security updates. It also periodically upgrades itself as needed. Computers don't cost a dime, and that's why we all have dozens of them laying around.
    Quote Originally Posted by CandyCotton Marshmallows View Post
    People need to get over the gear color (and themselves). It doesn't matter, and it shouldn't matter what other players have either. Worry about your damn self. Live your life by that. If you want to concern yourself with someone else, then worry about HELPING them, not putting them down or making sure you stand out as better than them.
    Maybe the game would be better with more low DPS nice guys and fewer high DPS jerks? -- Ghostcrawler, Twitter, 6/29/13

  10. #310
    Epic! Miuku's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronduwil View Post
    And the software maintaining that process just fixes itself every time a patch breaks it, right? The computer it runs on automatically ensures it's always running the latest OS patches and incorporating the latest security updates. It also periodically upgrades itself as needed. Computers don't cost a dime, and that's why we all have dozens of them laying around.
    I've said it before and I'll say it again - the level of addiction and completely blind, mindless Blizzard defence on these forums is equal to some of the worst drug addicted people I have met in my life.

    I should do a gradu on you people if I go back to studying psych some day.
    :: We are cows - proud and true. Come on Tauren - Moo Moo Moo!

  11. #311
    Quote Originally Posted by Miuku View Post
    I've said it before and I'll say it again - the level of addiction and completely blind, mindless Blizzard defence on these forums is equal to some of the worst drug addicted people I have met in my life.

    I should do a gradu on you people if I go back to studying psych some day.
    The exact same thing can be said of belligerent Blizzard critics on these forums. It's equal to a never ending mob of hatred and vitriol.

    Something something psychology study some day.

  12. #312
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    They won't go F2P.

    Arguably the biggest F2P game, League, with 32 million daily active accounts as of October 2013, made $624mil from micro transactions.

    WoW has 7 million active accounts last I saw, that's roughly $1.26billion in a year through subs, plus another $216mil through micro transactions.

    Going F2P would be a massive loss, even IF active account numbers went back up.

  13. #313
    Stood in the Fire Zolascius's Avatar
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    WoW is already benefitting from the f2p model - they have microtransactions and are making bank without having to toss out subscriptions.

    They probably put Titan on the back-burners because this was working well enough for them.

    Blizz doesn't need to make a good game if everyone is already satisfied with the horse manure they're currently getting.
    WARCRAFT:
    (Spoiler: Teldrassil chopped down to use as makeshift Super-Doomhammer - Wrynn promises vengeance with angrily-worded email, but later concedes that it was a fair trade for Camp Taurajo. A Heroic Anduin murders his father & declares city 'New Orgrimmar' after much meditation with Kalecgos, secedes throne to a humbled Thrall & commits seppuku.)
    ALLIANCE FAVORITISM

  14. #314
    That list is wrong - where's Candy Crush?

  15. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorPunch View Post
    That list is wrong - where's Candy Crush?
    You serious lol? It's a list for online games. MMOs and MOBAs.

  16. #316
    Quote Originally Posted by Ronduwil View Post
    And Blizzard has made over $10 billion with its subscription based model. What are you trying to prove?
    OMG, you don't understand anything do you?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by TranceZiggy View Post
    They won't go F2P.

    Arguably the biggest F2P game, League, with 32 million daily active accounts as of October 2013, made $624mil from micro transactions.

    WoW has 7 million active accounts last I saw, that's roughly $1.26billion in a year through subs, plus another $216mil through micro transactions.

    Going F2P would be a massive loss, even IF active account numbers went back up.
    More OMG. Well, all I can say is wait and see.

  17. #317
    Field Marshal yoma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arikan View Post
    You have to look at it in the context of business earnings/transactions. On a corporate level when discussing earnings of hundreds of millions of dollars something like $25 is nothing by itself. That sum over and over hundreds of thousands of times is what generates the revenue, so each of those are considered a single "micro transaction".

    "I think $25 is too much for a mount so I don't consider it 'micro'" is not the same as "$25 generated funds contrasted against a total revenue of $213,000,000" and the latter is the context for the term.

    Obvious concept is obvious, stop being obtuse.
    So by this logic and definition, unless you buy a NASA space shuttle in-game for around $200,000,000 all transactions are "micro," including expansions, pets, mounts, transfers, race/faction changes, and even the monthly subscription itself. Blizzard should be number 1 on this list. Non-obtuse concept is non-obtuse, stop being witty.
    Last edited by yoma; 2014-01-22 at 06:41 AM.

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by Miuku View Post
    Thank you gamers for essentially ruining gaming.

    Ya'll make me so proud.
    Ruining gaming? I'm curious as to why. League of Legends is hugely popular and tons of people play without paying a cent, same with every other non-sub game on the list. Gaming started in arcades as nothing but microtransactions. Trying to get you to just put one more quarter in that machine to get an ounce more fun out of it. How in the world did a bunch of option purchases ruin anything? There are still games out and coming out soon that won't have anything more than the $60 you paid for it. Play those if you don't like it.

  19. #319
    what's really missing from this discussion is not whether or not they should go ftp with micro transactions or not…but that between subscriptions and micro transactions they are making ungodly amounts of money that far exceeds any staffing /tech costs they incur…even with only 7 million subs…and yet have failed to live up to promises to produce content faster etc.

    Frankly, considering the amount of money they make off the game you're being ripped off.

  20. #320
    Brewmaster Zerkked's Avatar
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    f2p needs to die in a fire.

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