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  1. #281
    Banned anaxie's Avatar
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    The only way to remove inqu and not just roll it into SoL is to entirely gut the spec and every single ability and rebuild the class from the ground up.

    This is something I find highly unlikely to happen.

  2. #282
    Well they're editing every ability anyway to remove base damage, so why not. Wouldn't be much different from MoP Beta anyway, except they'd have to buff a bunch of abilities and our Mastery by 30% instead of nerfing some of them by a similar amount in every... little... micro-patch.
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  3. #283
    I am Murloc! Huntingbear_grimbatol's Avatar
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    You know what happened in MoP beta? They went along with raid testing 10man and then later 25man and everything was as expected, ret was somewhere in the middle with no major concerns about anything compared to past expansion releases. Then 1 week (roughly) before the beta servers shut down and MoP actually released they decided to shoot us in the face without explanation, nerfed the shit out of our 2h damage scaling and then they figured out 4 months later that we needed a buff to SoL TWICE. We even pointed out to Blizzard devs when they did those changes that ret would need a buff every tier to keep up with other melee (in particular) and the way they scale with gear, the way they replied? "We're aware of that, when it becomes a problem we'll have a look at it." Not only did they KNOW what they were doing they did it on purpose for some unknown reason and that's not the first time they've cocked up classes at expansion releases, remember Rets in 3.0 or 3.1 whatever when we had Seal of Blood and we basically went around 3 shotting people in pvp the second week of WotLK? Then came a hotfix that made us pretty much useless until ICC where 100% crit on Exorcism, Tiny Abomination in a Jar and a bloody Legendary made us not fall to the bottom, on top of that the legendary and trinket in ICC basically double dipped from our passive so we could get 2 stacks per attack. This "bug" stayed all the way up to Dragon Soul when we started seeing rets with the famous Tentacle Sword, I remember when I had 8 of those things up at the same time and we were destroying everyone... for a week. Then they decided after 5 years (roughly) that something that's been in the game suddenly was deemed a "bug" and they hotfixed it and ret got shot down to bottom, again.

    So when people talk about "it's fine if Inq goes, they can rebalance / rebuild ret again. They're already doing so many number changing things." it infuriates me. Yes, they CAN do it. So forgive me if I don't have faith in blizzard to properly make ret as good as it is today, their job is extremely hard and I won't blame them for a lot of the mishaps that's happened. That said when ret is SO good today why on earth would you want to risk it being changed from the ground up again? More to the point, why would blizzard risk that?

    This isn't about pointing blame to blizzard or ghostcrawler or people on mmo-champion or wherever making suggestions and so on... This is about trying to preserve the way ret plays right now, change Inquisition or don't but let it stay. If ret is so sensationally boring for you to play then removing Inq as a button you have to use and manage isn't going to make it more fun, instead maybe ADD a new button for us to hit every 10-20 seconds that WOULD make a impact on how we play for the next idk 10 seconds or something.

    /rant over.
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  4. #284
    Quote Originally Posted by Huntingbear_grimbatol View Post
    This "bug" stayed all the way up to Dragon Soul when we started seeing rets with the famous Tentacle Sword, I remember when I had 8 of those things up at the same time and we were destroying everyone... for a week.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1u0fZEYsnSc ???

    I wish there was a single thread to discuss retribution about reading 3 different threads with the same arguments/topics is a headache.

  5. #285
    Stood in the Fire Zabannith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by etsumii92 View Post
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1u0fZEYsnSc ???

    I wish there was a single thread to discuss retribution about reading 3 different threads with the same arguments/topics is a headache.
    Agreed, even tho I started this thread as well, I think we should take this all to the 6.0 thread , this was more asking people if they were worried blizz was going to nerf us into the ground when patch drops... not if inq should or should not stay that it seems to have evolved into.

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  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by nyc81991 View Post
    I read a post from Celestalon that they are shelving Seal of Faith. It will interesting to see what they add in its place. Hopefully it will be something more useful for Retribution.
    Just saw it.

    We put Seal of Faith back on our Shelf of Ideas That Have Potential But Aren't Ready For Primetime Yet.

    Sounds like they haven't given up on the idea that Ret Paladins heal. Will have to see what gets put in place before passing judgment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Huntingbear_grimbatol View Post
    You know what happened in MoP beta? They went along with raid testing 10man and then later 25man and everything was as expected, ret was somewhere in the middle with no major concerns about anything compared to past expansion releases. Then 1 week (roughly) before the beta servers shut down and MoP actually released they decided to shoot us in the face without explanation, nerfed the shit out of our 2h damage scaling and then they figured out 4 months later that we needed a buff to SoL TWICE. We even pointed out to Blizzard devs when they did those changes that ret would need a buff every tier to keep up with other melee (in particular) and the way they scale with gear, the way they replied? "We're aware of that, when it becomes a problem we'll have a look at it." Not only did they KNOW what they were doing they did it on purpose for some unknown reason and that's not the first time they've cocked up classes at expansion releases, remember Rets in 3.0 or 3.1 whatever when we had Seal of Blood and we basically went around 3 shotting people in pvp the second week of WotLK? Then came a hotfix that made us pretty much useless until ICC where 100% crit on Exorcism, Tiny Abomination in a Jar and a bloody Legendary made us not fall to the bottom, on top of that the legendary and trinket in ICC basically double dipped from our passive so we could get 2 stacks per attack. This "bug" stayed all the way up to Dragon Soul when we started seeing rets with the famous Tentacle Sword, I remember when I had 8 of those things up at the same time and we were destroying everyone... for a week. Then they decided after 5 years (roughly) that something that's been in the game suddenly was deemed a "bug" and they hotfixed it and ret got shot down to bottom, again.
    This is why I'm not buying WOD day one release. Cause a lot of bad changes usually happen a week before release. Some happen a week after release. This happened in Cata and MOP, when I'm in front of SW, dueling players to gauge my classes performance. The week before an expansion is released they usually release the patch that gets the game ready.

    Day 1 game releases are bad. I'll give a month or so of release to see if it's worth my time. I certainly don't want another MOP Ret experience.
    So when people talk about "it's fine if Inq goes, they can rebalance / rebuild ret again. They're already doing so many number changing things." it infuriates me. Yes, they CAN do it. So forgive me if I don't have faith in blizzard to properly make ret as good as it is today, their job is extremely hard and I won't blame them for a lot of the mishaps that's happened. That said when ret is SO good today why on earth would you want to risk it being changed from the ground up again? More to the point, why would blizzard risk that?
    Ret is SO good? Who, What, When, Where, Why?

    With all the numbers being changed, you really think that something like Inquisition is going to screw up their math? They're constantly readjusting numbers. Inquisition only exists to give Ret Paladins some difficulty in their dps. Not something fun. NOT FUN.

    There are better ways to add complexity to the spec without something as mindless as refreshing a buff. Inquisition was a lazy design decision.

    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    The only way to remove inqu and not just roll it into SoL is to entirely gut the spec and every single ability and rebuild the class from the ground up.

    This is something I find highly unlikely to happen.
    Removing inquisition isn't something that's going to be added difficulty for Blizzard. Remember, stat squish is going to change a lot of things around. All Inquisition did was buff Holy damage and gave us 10% crit. Sanctity Aura used to give us Holy Damage boost, and Conviction was a talent that gave us crit. Just not as much as Inquisition does, and were passive.

    When developers watch the numbers coming in from the beta, they'll be constantly playing with all talents, as they always do.

  7. #287
    Moderator Malthanis's Avatar
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    Hey guys, we're going to kick all WoD Ret discussion over to this thread.

    Closing.

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