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  1. #21
    The Patient MattLinkTV's Avatar
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    I can't recall using CC at any point at all in MoP.
    And that's a shame.

  2. #22
    Brewmaster Kae's Avatar
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    I just feel like that the way MoP dungeons were tuned you got two kinds of groups:

    - Groups that were average to decent who were easily able to run through the majority deciding CC was pointless

    - Groups that were below average and wiped a few times while trying to run through without using CC because they barely know about it.

    I don't think there were many groups that did use CC in MoP 5-mans, because the groups who were smart and skilled enough to consider the possibility of CC wouldn't have needed it, and the groups who were unskilled enough that might have needed CC wouldn't normally think of doing it because it's a concept usually over the heads of most sub-par players (mostly due to CC not being used in most instances or even raids since TBC)

    I imagine the groups that used CC were in a very small minority, and were mostly made up of the first type of group just being overly cautious, but they would have been just fine without it.

  3. #23
    Not even solo LFD have I seen a single CC in MoP. Not that I really care...

    Still,
    Cata 4.0 heroics minus the raped healers, thanks.
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  4. #24
    The most CC MAY of been needed for, was Glintrock. I say maybe because I leveled my Monk the first half of 5.0 as tank, then switched back to my Mage, and by the time my mage rolled through, people had enough gear to pull all of them without needing to CC. The rest was just "Don't pull too many", there was never a need to CC.

    If the counter-argument is, "At some time, some place, some one might of needed CC, there for, he's not wrong." then I don't know what to tell you... needing CC because you don't know how to stand out of the way of Sha trash breath, or pop a cooldown/move away because DPS is AoEing all the adds that explode that will die at the same time doesn't make the content hard, it just mean the skill of the player is low. If I change the difficulty of the game to "Hard", it's not telling the game, "I'm terrible."

  5. #25
    Mechagnome Edoran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necrot View Post
    I can't recall using CC at any point at all in MoP.
    And that's a shame.
    This. Oh, how I miss the challenge of a heroic Shattered Halls run as a bear druid in a group with a priest, two hunters, and a boomkin. (i.e., no mage, just unreliable traps)

  6. #26
    Epic! Warlord Booty's Avatar
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    Nothing in this game has EVER "NEEDED" CC, but it sure as hell made things a shit load easier. Less deaths, less wipes etc.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    Your experience is not everyone's experience. Just because you managed to brute-force your way through every dungeon trash pack & boss doesn't mean the rest of WoW did.
    When talking about LFR/LFD, I think it's everyone's experience. Even raids you don't CC trash.

    Even in challenge modes you bearly CC anything at all, cause why spend time CCing and finishing one mob before another when you can dps both/all and do it faster. Requires more dps and good healing though.

  8. #28
    I've SEEN CCs in MoP dungeons, but never had a need for them, they're usualy just used for fun. In fact, using CCs costs you more time because it's quicker to just AoE it all down.

  9. #29
    I never needed CC like sheep or hex in LFD. Saying 'your experience is not everyone else's' is just unconstructive BS used to deflect the point that you can't really argue with. Something more constructive would be saying which areas in dungeons required CC.

    Stun/silence CC is useful for some parts, like the casters at the start of nizam.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord Booty View Post
    Nothing in this game has EVER "NEEDED" CC, but it sure as hell made things a shit load easier. Less deaths, less wipes etc.
    The Burning Crusade

    If you did heroics back then, and not end game geared. You NEEDED CC...

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Socialhealer View Post
    well i did and i dinged 90 after about 16 hours, everyone was at an all time gear low of quest greens/blues, everyone barely made the heroic ilvl requirements and we had zero wipes zero deaths, all of my groups we're 100% pugs i did not queue with anyone from my guild/server after about 5 hours i was nearly full 463.

    i cannot see how people needed CC celestalon looks to be a bit of a scrub, some easy faceroll 5mans incoming in WoD then (at least for me).
    He's not an encounter designer, so I'm thinking his opinion is moot either way.

  12. #32
    Epic! Warlord Booty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monstercloud View Post
    The most CC MAY of been needed for, was Glintrock. I say maybe because I leveled my Monk the first half of 5.0 as tank, then switched back to my Mage, and by the time my mage rolled through, people had enough gear to pull all of them without needing to CC. The rest was just "Don't pull too many", there was never a need to CC.
    Yeah, I'd frog the one on the side we didn't go to. Half the time that mob would be deathgripped in anyways. Since I PVP'd a lot, it was just second nature to CC things, use stuns and interrupts etc. To me, it is all the same thing.

    My brothers are always talking about how everyone should have to do battlegrounds to learn their classes, since that's really the only time you use a bunch of your abilities.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Maggibesti View Post
    The Burning Crusade

    If you did heroics back then, and not end game geared. You NEEDED CC...
    Like I said, it only made things easier. If we didn't CC, yeah, someone died. There were wipes. The wipes usually meant killing half the mobs or all but one. I never had an end game geared tank, but 2 tanks that knew what they were doing.

  13. #33
    Well, as rogue I tried used CC before every battle but I realised that CC is useless in MoP 5mans. So then the only usage of CC in 5man was when i wanted to pick pocket mobs before they were lured... well MoP dungeons what that easy that I could do nothing but pickpocket all the time and my companions(100% pugs) owned mobs easily.


    but early Cata dungeons got a lot of CC and ppl wiped much and whined a lot so they changed it :P

  14. #34
    The Patient KonkeroaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Illiterate View Post
    You expect bad players to know about cc or how to use it? It was never needed or used in pandas by anyone.
    I expect bad players to get removed from groups and learn the error of their ways, but I have unrealistic expectations of people.

  15. #35
    The Lightbringer Lovestar's Avatar
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    That also made me go o.O?

    MoP dungeons were face > keyboard, and I'm not meaning to bandwagon or recycle mindless criticisms there. WOTLK release dungeons were slightly-abusive to inexperienced people (like most dungeons), and Frozen Halls genuinely benefited from CC in all but the best groups. Cata release dungeons need no further comment.

    But MoP Heroics? Seriously? I spammed my eyes out using Dungeon Finder to gear up to entry raid level when MoP dropped. We never wiped, not with all the random groups of strangers that the queue gave me. The closest I came to seeing a wipe in a MoP Heroic was when overconfident and/or dumb tanks would pull entire rooms (like the opening of Scholomance) and even then the healer just lol'd and kept the kiting DPS alive.

    For any remotely sane group (tank with sense + healer not on /follow + DPS pressing buttons), MoP Heroics required no CC. Period. Ever.

    Challenge Modes or achievement runs, sure, maybe. But that's a totally different thing.

  16. #36
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raggamasta View Post
    I never used CC in MoP heroic dungeons and never had any wipes either. They are just so easy that a below avarage group can just zerg everything down without a problem. To claim that that these dungeons need some sort of CC and it would be easier for an avarage group is just pure nonsense.
    And you illustrate perfectly what Tziva was saying in the post above yours.



  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord Booty View Post
    Yeah, I'd frog the one on the side we didn't go to. Half the time that mob would be deathgripped in anyways. Since I PVP'd a lot, it was just second nature to CC things, use stuns and interrupts etc. To me, it is all the same thing.

    My brothers are always talking about how everyone should have to do battlegrounds to learn their classes, since that's really the only time you use a bunch of your abilities.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Like I said, it only made things easier. If we didn't CC, yeah, someone died. There were wipes. The wipes usually meant killing half the mobs or all but one. I never had an end game geared tank, but 2 tanks that knew what they were doing.
    Ya that's how our guild's healers recommend learning how to heal.

  18. #38
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maggibesti View Post
    When talking about LFR/LFD, I think it's everyone's experience. Even raids you don't CC trash.

    Even in challenge modes you bearly CC anything at all, cause why spend time CCing and finishing one mob before another when you can dps both/all and do it faster. Requires more dps and good healing though.
    Last time I checked you still have to CC the raid trash before Garrosh on LFR, never mind normal. Same with the raid trash before Nazgrim. It's impossible, 100% impossible to nuke down the shamans as a group. They have to be controlled and killed one by one. And that's just SoO. I can remember back to tons of CC-required trash packs in Cata and Wrath.



  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord Booty View Post
    Nothing in this game has EVER "NEEDED" CC, but it sure as hell made things a shit load easier. Less deaths, less wipes etc.
    Although I guess it was possible to complete without using CC, you would have been an idiot for NOT using it when Zul'Aman was new in Cata.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Pennoyer View Post
    I never needed CC like sheep or hex in LFD. Saying 'your experience is not everyone else's' is just unconstructive BS used to deflect the point that you can't really argue with. Something more constructive would be saying which areas in dungeons required CC.

    Stun/silence CC is useful for some parts, like the casters at the start of nizam.
    And maybe that counts, I use stuns a lot when tanking and getting into position. When that content was current, we pretty much never used stuff like Sheep/Sap/Trap, except maybe on the absolute ugliest of pulls (thinking we might've bust it out on weaker parties on that one 5-pull after the herod clone in scarlet halls.)

    There's other spots off the top of my head: Trash before Taran Zhu in monastery, (the 5 pull that's unkillable until you drop both balls and click on the corpses).

    In today's gear, I don't even need a healer most of the time, and I'm not even a good tank by any stretch of the imagination.

    The Burning Crusade

    If you did heroics back then, and not end game geared. You NEEDED CC...
    Depends on the instance. Steamvaults? nah. Shattered Halls? pretty common. Arcatraz? Half the instance wasn't sheep-able to begin with, and there was little point in CC any of the pulls with demons simply because they were single pulls. Black Morass/Durholde? not really a viable strat. Back then, it was more about carefully dissecting all the pulls in a open area, being careful not to pull pats, etc. Was tedious but fun (for the tank).

    If you look at Shadow Labs, for example, there's basically big open room A with a lot of mobs right out of the gate, there's a pat or two, so you basically got to time your shots/pulls to either get the pats out of the way without pulling the static mobs, or get the static mobs clear of the pat's path without getting the pat.

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