60% of Americans value privacy over security

[Laize]

"You agree to let us use your data however the fuck we want."

"Yeah sure whatever! I gotsta update mah statuses!"

What's your point? Just because someone is a moron means it's right to give the NSA carte blanche to hoover in all the data they can?

Doesn't work that way, and even if it's legal NOW (which there's only recently an actual case contesting its constitutionality) then it won't be for long.

[muffinss]

What's the point in having freedoms if we are going to throw them away in the name of fear, paranoia, and safety? To have freedoms one must have risk. If we are not willing to accept risk's to have our freedoms then we might as well go without freedom and live in a dictatorship

[Deleted]

They went out and bought an assault rifle they don't really know how to use and put it under their pillow.

I doubt it, select fire rifles are super expensive. A M-16 lower will cost you over 10 grands.

No they don't. 71% of online adults use Facebook.

Voluntary versus forced.

[Payday]

Doesn't work that way, and even if it's legal NOW (which there's only recently an actual case contesting its constitutionality) then it won't be for long.

Oh but it does. And on that day, you may finally have a leg to stand on in this argument.

[Fahrenheit]

Don't really care about my privacy in terms of government intrusion, I've nothing to hide, the worse they'll find out is that I go on heterosexual porn sites from time to time for a rub and tug when my wife is away... hardly earth shattering.

[Laize]

Oh but it does. And on that day, you may finally have a leg to stand on in this argument.

Well if it's ruled unconstitutional (again) then we'll have our answer, won't we?

[Nobleshield]

I find it a little more disturbing that there are 40% of people who seemingly are willing to give up their privacy (and who knows what other rights) to be kept safe from the boogeymen that the government says are out to get us.

Anyone who thinks that "If you have nothing to hide why do you care" is a valid excuse isn't thinking enough. Even if you trust the government today (which I don't), having all of these things on the books just opens the floodgates if in 20 years or more some insane madman becomes elected (because that's never happened in history, right?) and finds all these laws that allow spying on people or other vague things that can be used against political enemies.

[Payday]

Don't really care about my privacy in terms of government intrusion, I've nothing to hide, the worse they'll find out is that I go on heterosexual porn sites from time to time for a rub and tug when my wife is away... hardly earth shattering.

Versus the private company, who in most or all cases is actually the one collecting this data from you, THEN turning around and systematically targeting you specifically with it. Not just getting pinged with a keyword. Double dip. Way more nefarious.

Well if it's ruled unconstitutional (again) then we'll have our answer, won't we?

If it is ruled that way by the only body with authority to do so, yes.

[Laize]

Don't really care about my privacy in terms of government intrusion, I've nothing to hide, the worse they'll find out is that I go on heterosexual porn sites from time to time for a rub and tug when my wife is away... hardly earth shattering.

Not caring about what data the government collects or what it could do with data it collects (without a warrant) just because "You have nothing to hide" is an incredibly dangerous opinion to hold.

You won't care right up until the point when it's too late to care.

- - - Updated - - -

If it is ruled that way by the only body with authority to do so, yes.

Well, you know full well federal courts of appeals are fully qualified to judge matters of constitutionality.... and the only federal court to judge the case has ruled it illegal.

So I'm not sure what you're saying.

[Lothaeryn]

So because I posted last night bragging about the yummy steak I had for dinner, I should have to live naked, in a glass box? That's totally balanced and not the kind of reaching for straws bullshit you would expect somebody to go for if somebody had just pointed out how stupid their views are.

Theres a difference between useless information such as "I had a yummy steak" and critical ones such as "my mother has cancer" which can be directly used against you at any time. I shouldn't have to fucking outline it for you what companies and security agencies are looking for, however. That should be obvious to anyone who isn't gullible enough to believe that their government isn't spying on them already.

What exactly is strawman when the government has already proven my point? They HAVE and are spying on their own citizens, they have and will use the information about you in whatever way they want to.

If you think that because some third party company who has no association with you whatsoever is going to give you their "solemn word" that they won't disclose your information to others, gladly be my guest. I bet you wouldn't have said anything to a random guy on the street though, he's too much of a security risk than the giant ass corporation that has info on almost everyone in your local community...

You wan't to keep your privacy? stop fucking talking to anyone, stop posting your information online and thinking "well its a secure site, no one could possibly abuse their position and disclose information about me to someone I don't want it disclosed to!".

Otherwise shut the fuck up and move along, you are being spied upon whether you like it or not, you can actually be aware of that fact and do what you can to keep what little privacy you have left by not using social media, or you can accept the fact and just hope that no one screw you over with the information you let them obtain easily through the internet.

The only place a man is truly safe from scrutiny is within his own thoughts, the choice to say anything is the willful acceptance of revoking one's right to privacy.

[Kraenen]

the reason people value privacy over security is because privacy is freedom. yes, nationalists, to be free is to have privacy.

[Deleted]

Don't really care about my privacy in terms of government intrusion, I've nothing to hide, the worse they'll find out is that I go on heterosexual porn sites from time to time for a rub and tug when my wife is away... hardly earth shattering.

You might not care about your privacy, but you might care about the billions of dollars they're basically throwing out the window for the NSA.

[darkwarrior42]

American People: "NSA, you aren't doing anything to stop terrorist attacks so stop spying on us without our permission."

NSA, thinking to themselves: 'we aren't telling you about the attacks we're stopping because if we do, the people we're spying on will know exactly how much information we have on them... not to mention we already have numerous oversight agencies watching us, and anyone involved can call it in as soon as they think we're going over the line... AND we do already require court orders and warrants in most circumstances that involve US citizens...'

American People: "NSA, STOP IT NOW!!"

NSA, capitulating: "Ok, here's an attack we stopped:" *gives general information on attack that didn't happen*

People thwarted by NSA: "Damn, they're in our systems... ok, time to redo all our security and close those leaks so our next attack can go off without a hitch."

American People: "WTF, how did this attack happen? Why didn't you stop it NSA?"

NSA: "..."

Edit: NSA: "Ok, Verizon, since we don't want to piss people off again, could you give us the information you've collected?"

Verizon: "Sure thing"

American People: "OMG NSA, stop pressuring corporations to give you our data!"

NSA: "Wait, it's ok for Verizon to collect this data but it's not ok for us to request it?"

Verizon: *troll face*

[Ielenia]

Anyone one of those 60% that have a facebook account is a hypocrite.

Why? There's a major difference between what I *choose* to make public about myself, and what *someone else* makes public about myself that I didn't want public in the first place.

[Laize]

American People: "NSA, you aren't doing anything to stop terrorist attacks so stop spying on us without our permission."

NSA, thinking to themselves: 'we aren't telling you about the attacks we're stopping because if we do, the people we're spying on will know exactly how much information we have on them... not to mention we already have numerous oversight agencies watching us, and anyone involved can call it in as soon as they think we're going over the line... AND we do already require court orders and warrants in most circumstances that involve US citizens...'

American People: "NSA, STOP IT NOW!!"

NSA, capitulating: "Ok, here's an attack we stopped:" *gives general information on attack that didn't happen*

People thwarted by NSA: "Damn, they're in our systems... ok, time to redo all our security and close those leaks so our next attack can go off without a hitch."

American People: "WTF, how did this attack happen? Why didn't you stop it NSA?"

NSA: "..."

The NSA and TSA are the equivalents of rhino whistles. Rhino whistles that invade any semblance of privacy you might have.

[Payday]

Well, you know full well federal courts of appeals are fully qualified to judge matters of constitutionality....

So why does SCOTUS exist? Can you appeal them?

and the only federal court to judge the case has ruled it illegal.

False. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013...lection-legal/

From a fair and balanced source, even.

- - - Updated - - -

Why? There's a major difference between what I *choose* to make public about myself, and what *someone else* makes public about myself that I didn't want public in the first place.

The NSA is making your private data public now?

[Laize]

So why does SCOTUS exist? Can you appeal them?

You can't appeal SCOTUS. They haven't ruled on the matter, though. And even if they determine a practice to be legal, Congress can still change it.

False. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013...lection-legal/

From a fair and balanced source, even.

Well then... this ruling pretty much guarantees the SCOTUS will have to hear arguments, won't it?

[GoldNSilence]

60% Americans are free thinkers. 40% are sheep.

[Payday]

You can't appeal SCOTUS. They haven't ruled on the matter, though. And even if they determine a practice to be legal, Congress can still change it.



Well then... this ruling pretty much guarantees the SCOTUS will have to hear arguments, won't it?

That's what we want, isn't it? What will you do if they deem it okay? Molon Labe?

[Gheld]

Theres a difference between useless information such as "I had a yummy steak" and critical ones such as "my mother has cancer" which can be directly used against you at any time

Yes, there is a difference.

So it's strange that you said

which are easily countered by Facebook pretty much opening its legs up to the NSA and giving them the information and that info to corporations anyways. If you are dumb enough to disclose ANY information over the internet you forfeit your rights to privacy, period.

without differentiating between people who are cautious about what they disclose over the internet and people who aren't.

Because I'm fairly sure the word ANY encompasses ANY and not anything specific.

EDIT: I mean is this a new method of trolling or something?
Step 1: Make boneheaded, sweeping generalization.
Step 2: When you get called out on it, pretend like you didn't make that sweeping generalization, even though anybody can easily page back and see that you did, accuse the person of making a strawman argument
Step 3: ????
Step 4: Profit.