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  1. #101
    The Lightbringer judgementofantonidas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    How would it take twice the time to get a full run?
    assuming you are a dps that is twice the que time JUST to get in, not counting whether you may leave because you got into a craptastic group.



    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    Few changes are of the kind that favours everyone, before this change people would do exactly this. The result was that unless they got a run with the progress they wanted they wouldn't join at all, the group would take ages to get filled, if at all. While this was great for the people who actually could take advantage of it it is better for LFR/LFD in general to have a higher completion percentage
    move to mother russia? I am not interested in what is good for EVERYONE. I am interested in quick clean completion of content that I am forced to run with sub-standard players so that I can move on to more, or content that I do not have to interact with such players.





    There is no bad RNG only bad L2P

  2. #102
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    again. you feel that someone not wanting to wait for you to do your job correctly is being an idiot, when on the flip side of the coin they think that you qued as a healer in dps spec is being an idiot.
    No, I'm more opposed to the excessive lashing out rather than disliking the fact that someone isn't doing what they should. If you want to kick someone for doing it, do that. There's no need to throw a total bitch fit about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    assuming you are a dps that is twice the que time JUST to get in, not counting whether you may leave because you got into a craptastic group.
    No it isn't. If you don't accept the queue when it pops because it says 2/4 bosses down you'd have to leave the queue and get into it again and hope for better luck the next time. You'd be in the queue AT LEAST twice regardless. So no.

  3. #103
    The Lightbringer judgementofantonidas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    No, I'm more opposed to the excessive lashing out rather than disliking the fact that someone isn't doing what they should. If you want to kick someone for doing it, do that. There's no need to throw a total bitch fit about it.
    if you do not tell people why you are removing them from group they will go right on happily screwing up because they think that everyone else is the problem.

    the rest was not worth responding to.





    There is no bad RNG only bad L2P

  4. #104
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    if you do not tell people why you are removing them from group they will go right on happily screwing up because they think that everyone else is the problem.
    There's a huge difference between "Sorry, you're just not good enough" and "OH MY GOD YOU F***ING MORON GET THE SHIT OUT OF MY FACE"

    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    the rest was not worth responding to.
    You don't have to, it's indisputable fact

  5. #105
    The Lightbringer judgementofantonidas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    There's a huge difference between "Sorry, you're just not good enough" and "OH MY GOD YOU F***ING MORON GET THE SHIT OUT OF MY FACE"



    You don't have to, it's indisputable fact
    some people express themselves differently than others. any one particular way is not the only acceptable way. sorry, but if you are a dps and pulling less than someone in your class naked should then you will be told. if you are being a shit stick you will be told that. if your delicate sensitivities are so easily bruised then maybe hello kitty island is more your speed.


    again. your opinions are far from fact.





    There is no bad RNG only bad L2P

  6. #106
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    any one particular way is not the only acceptable way.
    The fact that there is more than one acceptable way does not make all of them socially acceptable

    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    again. your opinions are far from fact.
    It is a fact that if you leave the queue and queue again you have queued twice. In this particular case, my opinion is indeed indisputable fact.

  7. #107
    Bloodsail Admiral Madkitty's Avatar
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    honestly part of me wants to know what dungeon and what the tank was before i comment (and if heirlooms involved).
    because when I was leveling my priest, running as disc, you never need to heal, even if u do i think you can nearly full health them in one cast, because i've healed (at least the lower level') dungeons as shadow, if the tank is respectful. and by respectful i mean to the point you aren't spamming and if a cc hits the healer you don't die in a few seconds of no healing. (heck i think there may be some dungeons were a feral, ret, enhance could keep a group up)
    so if the tank is geared, even with an oom healer he shouldn't really of died if he knew what he was doing.

  8. #108
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    I feel bad for you in regard to the party being so rude but, as others have said, this may have been averted completely if you had been paying attention.

    You did apologize which is fair enough imo, they should have moved on and left it there. People are so used to mass pulling everything in the dungeon these days that when the slightest thing go awry, people lost their shit, which is ridiculous. I am in favour of the debuff however, it stops people from mass /leave when anything does go wrong, especially if you're DPS and are forced to wait a good while between queues. The alternative is to end up like Flex raids, when after one wipe everyone fucks off.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Noomz View Post
    So I get a 30 minute debuff, I get a punishment, for leaving a group that treated me like shit. Where is the sense in that?
    Went both directions, even from the most charitable reading. Not paying attention while leveling is a poor excuse.

  10. #110
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    The debuff is more aimed toward fixing the potential problem of people leaving just because they random an instance they don't like or a raid that is already in progress. If the group is too much for you, just get yourself kicked.
    The sad truth is this is the best solution... Assuming you haven't downed a single boss.

    If you HAVE killed a boss, you can leave without penalty! (You have to have killed a boss though; you can't leave if you enter a group already on the second. This works for LFR as well)

  11. #111
    Epic! Doorsfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    Ignoring is not fixing.
    Duly note - I am not ignoring the issue.

    I put weight in actual solutions that fix what affects me - instead of going after some idealistic, naive approach of changing everything and everyone.

    You don't see me creating threads about how awful LFD or anything of the likes is. Because i don't have that issue.

    Must be coinsidence. Or perhaps i am actually not suffering from the issue, because i fixed it for my own part.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    The fact that there is more than one acceptable way does not make all of them socially acceptable

    It is a fact that if you leave the queue and queue again you have queued twice. In this particular case, my opinion is indeed indisputable fact.
    Your opinions can't be fact. For they are just that - Opinions. That you even attempt to distinguish them as fact - is delusion.

    And you seem only strengthening my point that you seemingly strive after litlle in the ways of achieving and solving - more then picking a fight.

    Focusing on "X/Y/Z is wrong" and doing nothing PRACTICALLY to solve it - is just to champion vengeance and make yourself a victim.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    No, I'm more opposed to the excessive lashing out rather than disliking the fact that someone isn't doing what they should. If you want to kick someone for doing it, do that. There's no need to throw a total bitch fit about it.
    .
    Neither is there a need to champion vengeance or trying to "fix" things - when it is out of your hands.

    Yet you do it. Your logic is inconsistent, at best. Had i not known better, i would argue that you are just picking a fight.
    Quote Originally Posted by OzoAndIndi View Post
    Great, now I have to purposely try to write as boring as possible.
    Don't treat me like the sea, oh so salty and mean - a-ha-ha, ha-ha..

  12. #112
    You should understand, that Deserter Debuff has only one purpose - the prevent people from starting too many dungeon instances at once. Tank and heal - are those people, who can "start" dungeon instance. I.e. imagine there are 10x more DPSers and 2x more heals, then tanks, waiting in a queue. And dungeon is started only when tank/heal (depending on who is demanded more) enter queue. While players are waiting in a queue - Blizzard has no obligations to them (cuz players may do quests, dailies, pet battles - any other activities, while waiting in queue), but once instance is started - Blizzard has an obligation to end it, no matter how, cuz waiting for players inside instance with nothing else to do - isn't very interesting thing. That's why players inside instance has some priority to get tanks and heals. And now imagine, that you are tank. You enter a queue, start instance and leave it, then enter queue again, start another instance, leave again. And what will we have? Ton of started instances with players, waiting inside for ages?
    Sorry for my bad english.
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  13. #113
    I have no clue what you 're trying to say.

  14. #114
    Epic! Doorsfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    I have no clue what you 're trying to say.
    An epidimy of leaving Healers and Tanks - Because every single one of them is out to have every single DPS be stranded in a instance.

    Where did i put that tinfoil hat...
    Quote Originally Posted by OzoAndIndi View Post
    Great, now I have to purposely try to write as boring as possible.
    Don't treat me like the sea, oh so salty and mean - a-ha-ha, ha-ha..

  15. #115
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doorsfan View Post
    Duly note - I am not ignoring the issue.

    I put weight in actual solutions that fix what affects me - instead of going after some idealistic, naive approach of changing everything and everyone.
    Yes, you are ignoring it. You're saying that the best solution is to ignore it, that not problem solving.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doorsfan View Post
    Your opinions can't be fact. For they are just that - Opinions. That you even attempt to distinguish them as fact - is delusion.
    It is not fact because it is my opinion, my opinion just aligns with fact in this matter. This would be obvious to anyone who isn't just on a witch hunt. You talk a lot about lack of logic or things not being arguments, the truth is that you're just unable to see it because you're basically frothing at the mouth just trying to jump at people.
    Last edited by Lohe; 2014-02-02 at 08:15 PM.

  16. #116
    Epic! Doorsfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    Yes, you are ignoring it. You're saying that the best solution is to ignore it, that

    It is not fact because it is my opinion, my opinion just aligns with fact in this matter. This would be obvious to anyone who isn't just on a witch hunt. You talk a lot about lack of logic or things not being arguments, the truth is that you're just unable to see it because you're basically frothing at the mouth just trying to jump at people.
    You must be willfully ignorant of my points. I literally suggested playing with friends. Problem solved. And it's NOT ignoring the issue.
    It's finding a solution to the issue - Your issue being playing in Toxic Groups -> Do not play in one.

    And now you fulfill exactly my point. Somehow you are become the victim to someone "frothing at the mouth just trying to jump at people" - When i in fact have only presented counter-arguments and sheer logic for you to respond to.

    Which simply boils down to that you are being very emotional and inconsistent - in face of simple arguments laid bare.
    Quote Originally Posted by OzoAndIndi View Post
    Great, now I have to purposely try to write as boring as possible.
    Don't treat me like the sea, oh so salty and mean - a-ha-ha, ha-ha..

  17. #117
    Dungeon deserter can suck. So does DCing in a BG and logging back in to a pvp deserter debuff. I wouldn't worry too much about it, just quest for a while. 30 minutes goes pretty fast.

    The tank in your dungeon was pretty dumb. When I tank, I always check what spec my healer is, and that he's got mana, and that he hasn't afk'd and is in range to heal me before I start pulling stuff.

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by Doorsfan View Post
    How is that Selfish and childish? The person is actually entitled to his own form of fun if he pays for it.

    It is only common decensy to try and care for others - But if they perform sub-par or are random players to you, you don't owe them any recognition.

    You can't owe someone you don't know recognition - Also, Childish is not a valid insult to throw at X thing.
    Because it IS Childish and Selfish.

    It's like waking up one day and deciding "hey, i wanna go play some basketball!" so you go down to your local basketball court and there are some people there looking for one more person so they can have even teams and play a game and you say you'll join them.

    Then you demand they always pass you the ball so you can be the one to score every time and if they don't, you quit, because "you only wanted to play to score, and if you arent scoring you arent having fun".

    It is the exact same shit children do. When they don't get their way, they have a hissy fit and refuse to keep participating. A lot of people actually have enough respect for others to not do things that deliberately screw them over. Some people, like that poster i originally quoted, and apparently you as well, think you're the center of the universe and only your own enjoyment matters at all.

    If you have no problems being a dick to everyone else, that is your problem, and your lack of friends in your life will be the inevitable result, aside from shitty friends who are just as shitty as you. You don't HAVE to be a decent person, that is true. But you also don't HAVE to be a selfish prick all the time either.
    I like ponies and I really don't care what you have to say about that.

  19. #119
    The OP was partially at fault, but the larger problem of short tempers/quick kicks/rudeness/too much attention to meters, etc. in dungeons and LFR is the larger issue. It's kind of a community problem that won't be easy to fix. I've heard Blizz is working on some sort of ranking system (gold stars or points, maybe "likes" for being friendly in a run) for that kind of thing to try to help and I'm curious to see how it works out if implemented.

    The meters thing and people thinking it's the end-all for lfr is what really drives me bonkers. So I can sit on Nazgrim in SoO and dps him the whole fight, not touch an add, dps through defensive stance, and if Recount says my dps is high in the meters I'm apparently doing a good job. Just an example but that kind of thing happens all the time. The meters can be a good tool sometimes, but it's way overused just like gearscore was a while back.

  20. #120
    Epic! Doorsfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dasani View Post
    Because it IS Childish and Selfish.

    It's like waking up one day and deciding "hey, i wanna go play some basketball!" so you go down to your local basketball court and there are some people there looking for one more person so they can have even teams and play a game and you say you'll join them.

    Then you demand they always pass you the ball so you can be the one to score every time and if they don't, you quit, because "you only wanted to play to score, and if you arent scoring you arent having fun".

    It is the exact same shit children do. When they don't get their way, they have a hissy fit and refuse to keep participating. A lot of people actually have enough respect for others to not do things that deliberately screw them over. Some people, like that poster i originally quoted, and apparently you as well, think you're the center of the universe and only your own enjoyment matters at all.

    If you have no problems being a dick to everyone else, that is your problem, and your lack of friends in your life will be the inevitable result, aside from shitty friends who are just as shitty as you. You don't HAVE to be a decent person, that is true. But you also don't HAVE to be a selfish prick all the time either.
    The issue however - is that this person paid for his entertainment.

    He has the equal rights to enjoy the game in his own way - whatever way that is, lest it be a banable offense which breaks the ToS.

    Being selfish is not equal to being childish. Being selfish can just be the realism of not getting emotionally involved with stuff that you have no interest in.

    And it's still a standing fact that you don't owe allegiance to someone you don't know. At least not in a Random Dungeon - in a Video Game.

    Beyond this - you preach hypocrisy. Your selfish reasoning becoming the justification to why he himself should not be selfish.

    And still, wether the person be Childish or not - Does not make it a legitimate argument to throw at people at the end of the day. It perhaps is valid in different context - But when the person legally agreed to use of a product that he/she funded himself or through others money?

    Throwing a hissy fit - Yes, childish. Refusing to participate - Not so much. It could might as well be self-worth. Lest you consider every single "grown-up" to be a person who MUST bow down to others projected values of you.

    Also - Your argument is yet again inconsistent. If it's only my issue being a dick to people - Why do you pain it out to be an issue for others? Not that it's less true - But it's still a contradiction of action versus argument.
    Last edited by Doorsfan; 2014-02-02 at 08:43 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by OzoAndIndi View Post
    Great, now I have to purposely try to write as boring as possible.
    Don't treat me like the sea, oh so salty and mean - a-ha-ha, ha-ha..

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