Preventing PvP on a PvE Realm: No More "Accidental" Flagging

[Stir]

PVE =/= no pvp ever, for the record. None of what you mentioned in your OP is griefing.

When Superman's gaming experience is negatively influenced by someone else for no good reason other than that person enjoying that kind of gameplay, then it is griefing because Superman got griefed. It's really that simple.

[-Superman-]

PVE =/= no pvp ever, for the record. None of what you mentioned in your OP is griefing.

PvP on a PvE server is not needed, and is therefore unnecessary.

- - - Updated - - -

When Superman's gaming experience is negatively influenced by someone else for no good reason other than that person enjoying that kind of gameplay, then it is griefing because Superman got griefed. It's really that simple.

Thank you for having a brain and breaking it down for others.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

And more insults *Babybear server*. This is why PVPers get more negative attention. Because they condescend.

When you start building servers and making constant changes just because you were slightly annoyed... and your post doesn't really counter my main point at all, or even address it. Stay on topic please.

[Jilor]

I would say... be more careful? I do apologize though. As said I've only ever known PvP realms, so the idea of someone playing a game about alliance vs. horde and not wanting anything to do with "warcraft" is beyond me.

The thing is, I'm not different in my preference for PVP over PVE. The vast majority of my toons are on PVP servers. I have 3 90s, 1 86, 2 85s, 2 80s on PVP realms and 2 90s on a PVE realm (both were fully leveled on a PVP realm) that I only went to for progression purposes (found the right guild and everything). Even when I play on that PVE server, I willfully engage in PVP. But that's not at all what the suggested function is about. This function is made for people other than you and I. And above all, it's made for people who probably are considerably less experienced. I've been playing since Vanilla and know my way around PVP if I have some reason I need to avoid it. But not everyone has. And not everyone is interested in what you and I are. It's a very big game with a very big customer base and thus, there will always be options that aren't made with you or I in mind.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

When Superman's gaming experience is negatively influenced by someone else for no good reason other than that person enjoying that kind of gameplay, then it is griefing because Superman got griefed. It's really that simple.

This is actually false, according to the definition of the word.

[Puri]

I actually feel -- even on a PvE realm -- that world bosses should be one area of contention suitable for being flagged. I don't see how it's fair to the faction that tags a world boss first, that they automatically get rights to it while the opposing faction gets to sit there and watch. World bosses should come at a consequence imo... may the better faction win.

It's great that you feel this way, and luckily there are PVP realms directly made for you.
I feel that I should not take any PVP action on a PVE server if I don't want to.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

PvP on a PvE server is not needed, and is therefore unnecessary.

- - - Updated - - -



Thank you for having a brain and breaking it down for others.

PVP and raiding is never actually "needed," but you act as if people are hacking your PC to make you hit them or something. You can manually flag on a PVE server, so, again PVE=/=no pvp ever.

[Deathgoose]

PVE =/= no pvp ever, for the record. None of what you mentioned in your OP is griefing.

Except, that it is: https://us.battle.net/support/en/art...assment-policy

Zone or Area Disruption

This category includes language and/or actions intended to disturb groups of players or areas of the world, such as:
Disruption of player events or gatherings.
Excessive use of in-game sounds or visuals.
Excessively casting spells with noticeable effects in crowded areas.
Impeding or blocking access to an NPC, doodad, doorway, or any other area of the world that a player would normally be able to access.

And in this case, it is done with the expressed intent to trick the unwary into being flagged.

[Tucci]

I can't help but think of the people who completely refuse and avoid any kind of pvp, whether it be accidental or needed for a quest, and then go so far as to complain about it on forums as the anti-social of the anti-social, lol. Massively Multiplayer game but "Don't touch me!".

[Giscoicus]

This needs to not happen. PvPers do not have an option to opt out of PvE entirely. Leveling through BGs? Not even comparable to leveling in dungeons. Hell you can't do much without doing some PvE. The fact thy they only flag when they choose to is already more than enough with the PvPers not having equal opportunities for leveling and whatnot.

This is simple a player skill issue. Don't be a twat and flag yourself if you don't want to. If I'm trying to fight somebody on the isle, my AoEs will get neutral enemies to attack me and hostile enemies agro me. Unless Blizzard is okay with letting me fight another player under Orods with 0 chance of getting attacked, this needs to not happen.

[PetersenIII]

About damned time. EVE Online, regarded largely as one of the most hard core of hard core and unforgiving games added a 'saftey' mechanic like two years ago. Glad to finally see the softest of soft core games do something that should have been done when it launched.

[Stir]

This is actually false, according to the definition of the word.

Gods; the 'definition' train is here again.
If we go by the definition of 'grief,' then it is a response to loss. Mourning is a kind of grief. I don't believe we're talking about that.
No; we're talking about grievances. Hardships experienced or caused. If you willingly cause a situation that will frustrate other people, you cause them mild grievance. Ergo: It is griefing. It is only NOT griefing when they are consenting to the action; willingly participating in the event.

I can't help but think of the people who completely refuse and avoid any kind of pvp, whether it be accidental or needed for a quest, and then go so far as to complain about it on forums as the anti-social of the anti-social, lol. Massively Multiplayer game but "Don't touch me!".

'Massively Multiplayer Game' does not equal 'Everyone has the right to screw me over as they see fit.' What it means is: 'I can play with other people over the internet!'

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Except, that it is: https://us.battle.net/support/en/art...assment-policy


And in this case, it is done with the expressed intent to trick the unwary into being flagged.

Except, not. Thats a post on harassment, not griefing.

[Giscoicus]

PVP and raiding is never actually "needed," but you act as if people are hacking your PC to make you hit them or something. You can manually flag on a PVE server, so, again PVE=/=no pvp ever.

Pretty much this. And the servers are not built for "no PvP ever" they are flag at your discretion. And they are called Normal/RP

- - - Updated - - -

Gods; the 'definition' train is here again.
If we go by the definition of 'grief,' then it is a response to loss. Mourning is a kind of grief. I don't believe we're talking about that.
No; we're talking about grievances. Hardships experienced or caused. If you willingly cause a situation that will frustrate other people, you cause them mild grievance. Ergo: It is griefing. It is only NOT griefing when they are consenting to the action; willingly participating in the event.

'Massively Multiplayer Game' does not equal 'Everyone has the right to screw me over as they see fit.' What it means is: 'I can play with other people over the internet!'

You do realize the term griefing was developed to be separate from grieving, right? Grieving is mourning. Griefing is tied to games.

[Jilor]

So many people in this thread seem oblivious to the fact Blizzard doesn't cater to each and every one of us on an individual level. They are trying to make the game better for groups of people. If you really enjoy PVP, PVP servers aren't going anywhere. For example, if Blizzard only catered to me, we'd still have 40 mans, with a couple 20 mans per expansion just for something extra to do, there would be attunements to raids and likely heroic dungeons, there would be no gear catch up mechanics, every server would be PVP only, and I'd probably eliminate a number of Quality of Life features that I'm just not a fan of since I feel like a number of them have done substantial damage to community and accountability. But I have a feeling most people here would hate all of that or at least most of those things. So, aren't you glad Blizzard can see the bigger picture? They aren't removing your option, they're keeping your option and giving more options to OTHER PEOPLE.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Gods; the 'definition' train is here again.
If we go by the definition of 'grief,' then it is a response to loss. Mourning is a kind of grief. I don't believe we're talking about that.
No; we're talking about grievances. Hardships experienced or caused. If you willingly cause a situation that will frustrate other people, you cause them mild grievance. Ergo: It is griefing. It is only NOT griefing when they are consenting to the action; willingly participating in the event.

A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game who deliberately irritates and harasses other players within the game, using aspects of the game in unintended ways

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griefer

Sorry, you are wrong mate. While it might be griefing to use large mounts in front of a mailbox to try and get flagged(not mentioned in the OP), it is NOT griefing to kill enemy NPC or leaders(mentioned in the OP).

[Puri]

This needs to not happen. PvPers do not have an option to opt out of PvE entirely. Leveling through BGs? Not even comparable to leveling in dungeons. Hell you can't do much without doing some PvE. The fact thy they only flag when they choose to is already more than enough with the PvPers not having equal opportunities for leveling and whatnot.

This is simple a player skill issue. Don't be a twat and flag yourself if you don't want to. If I'm trying to fight somebody on the isle, my AoEs will get neutral enemies to attack me and hostile enemies agro me. Unless Blizzard is okay with letting me fight another player under Orods with 0 chance of getting attacked, this needs to not happen.

What? I don't even know what you want to say?

I don't think you understood what the feature will bring: You can completely opt out of PVP on a PVE realm. But of course you still can flag yourself PVP on a PVE realm if you want to. If you have to rely on other people who accidently flag themselves to do PVP, and then claim they have to 2lp, I think we have different definitions of fair play.

[Deathgoose]

Except, not. Thats a post on harassment, not griefing.

...that's your argument? Seriously? Not that the action specified is specifically called out as not allowed, but you're going to quibble over what it is called?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griefer

A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game who deliberately irritates and harasses other players within the game, using aspects of the game in unintended ways

But, okay, fine, let's pretend that the two are not synonymous. Then we'll just do a find/replace for the word "griefing" in this thread and replace it with "harassment", because that will totally change the context of everything.

[Giscoicus]

So many people in this thread seem oblivious to the fact Blizzard doesn't cater to each and every one of us on an individual level. They are trying to make the game better for groups of people. If you really enjoy PVP, PVP servers aren't going anywhere. For example, if Blizzard only catered to me, we'd still have 40 mans, with a couple 20 mans per expansion just for something extra to do, there would be attunements to raids and likely heroic dungeons, there would be no gear catch up mechanics, every server would be PVP only, and I'd probably eliminate a number of Quality of Life features that I'm just not a fan of since I feel like a number of them have done substantial damage to community and accountability. But I have a feeling most people here would hate all of that or at least most of those things. So, aren't you glad Blizzard can see the bigger picture? They aren't removing your option, they're keeping your option and giving more options to OTHER PEOPLE.

And like I said, why don't PvPers have the same options? Leveling via PvP is awful, can't get certain reputations up without PvE thus blocking us from crafting recipes and whatnot. You can't even get to level 10 without PvEing unless you get carried around exploring. Letting PvErs say no to any PvP from square 1 is ridiculous and they aren't offering the same opportunity to PvPers simply because somebody would get sad I can stand on my low level alt anywhere in the game as long as I'm flagged because that let's me bypass certain things.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

...that's your argument? Seriously? Not that the action specified is specifically called out as not allowed, but you're going to quibble over what it is called?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griefer

A griefer is a player in a multiplayer video game who deliberately irritates and harasses other players within the game, using aspects of the game in unintended ways

But, okay, fine, let's pretend that the two are not synonymous. Then we'll just do a find/replace for the word "griefing" in this thread and replace it with "harassment", because that will totally change the context of everything.

It would change things, a lot actually. I would then ask why you seriously feel "harassed" because someone killed an auctioneer? I could agree its *slightly* annoying.. but HARASSED?