Simcraft Results Inquiry

[Rothi92]

*Forgot to mention in title, this is for ELEMENTAL*

Hi all,

I have been playing PE/EB for a while during progression because I enjoy it, but recently decided to switch to UF. When I run my sims for UF

(Reforge Amount 5000/Step 500/Plot Reforge Haste and Mastery/Scale Int+Crit+Haste+Mastery/25k Iterations)

EDIT: Okay, I tried to post an imgur pic of my result, but since this is my first post, the site isn't letting me. I'll try again in comments later. I'm sitting at 40% Haste/70% Mastery and the sim is saying the highest point of my DPS is with 1500 more haste.


Now, my question is why in UF would I prefer haste over mastery? I thought the generalized rule when specced for UF was Mastery. I'm obviously going to do what the sim says, I'm just curious as to WHY it would possibly want me to have so much haste.

Thanks for your time.

[Zixan]

Simcraft for Elemental has be pointing people to haste over mastery for single target for a while.

The thought structure is, haste is better with PE for pure single target. But after you get into any scenarios involving AoE, Cleave, or any mix of that, you end up getting way more dps by using mastery. Using a full mastery build isn't but 0.8% to 1.2% behind on single target. but, over 9%-14% increase on AoE. Seeing as there are very few pure single target fights, haste's single target increase it somewhat discarded.

[Rabb]

Purely guesswork here, but that haste value probably gets you another lightning bolt cast in within the debuff timeframe of UF, but like Zixan mentioned above, mastery is not far behind haste, and since most fights in SoO have some cleave, mastery would be an overall winner. You also didn't list the type of fight when you ran your sims.

Just recently I was looking to make my Chain lightning as close to a 1 second cast time with the LMG proc as I could (just because) and I had to drop down to around 20% haste to get to that cast time. It wasn't especially viable for an all-fights spec because of crit being wasted on Lava Burst, but it was just something to mention in case you wanna pad meters on an aoe heavy farm fight. I know what I'm doing next heroic siegecrafter 25m.

[Bllets]

The values of haste and Mastery switched often for me as Ele, but in the end I decided to focus more on mastery and let our warlock, hunter, rogue, etc. focus on ST and I would rule the meters on fights where the value on mastery increases.

[jimmyolsen]

1) For Single Target haste has always been better than Mastery, regardless of talent choice, once you approach BIS. UF benefits from more casts going off, and typically mastery is high enough that over time the difference between 78% mastery and 83% mastery is minimal.

2) There is little pure sustained single target damage in this instance (Juggernaut and Klaxxi are the only ones, though you could argue Thok since the bats die fast), and as such a balanced, or slightly less effective mastery build (less than 2% worse) have been the preferred approaches. Furthermore, some of the non-cleave add fights require burst rather than sustained (like adds on Malkorok, mines on Siegecrafter, or the WW adds on Garrosh), which lends itself further to more mastery.

3) How significant was the rise in damage? 1500 more haste would put you very close to the flame shock tick that occurs at 45%. This is an insignificant difference for most purposes and shouldn't be considered a "break-point" the way Affliction/Healers have to worry about them, but it often coincides with an uptick. If the difference between adding 1500 haste and staying where you are is 400dps of your 300k, there's no point in doing it. If it's 3k dps, 1% might be worth considering.

[Anzen]

Without giving the typical "Mastery > Haste on AoE and how most fights are AoE etc", Mastery doesn't always beat Haste on AoE. You must remember that Haste indirectly buffs Mastery (more casts = more mastery procs), whereas Mastery doesn't buff Haste so you have these two equations working against each other and across all gear levels you will find Haste and Mastery will constantly be overtaking each other. Plus you'd be surprised at just how little DPS you actually lose by being GCD capped (if you was worried about stacking Haste for this reason).



^ My current SimC stat weights for moderate AoE.