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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Scully View Post
    Prideful gear will be ilv 550, so next season pvp gear will be king again against all but the tiny minute fraction of players sporting full heroic pve gear. As a mainly pvp player I think its fair for heroic gear to shit on everyone, takes infinitely more effort and skill to obtain than 10 games a week. Just cause it says pvp on the gear doesnt mean it should automatically kill everyone
    Nope. PvP geared people with equal skill should always win from PvE geared people. No matter what. Which will be back again with the 550 ilevel gear, hopefully. It's always been like this, except for in MoP. Then again, you still think it only requires 10 games a week, which says to me you've played before MoP, so you should know better.

    It requires at least 13 wins to get all your points, so on average 26 games. 26 games is the bare minimum to get all your points, and that's when you're in the LFR bracket of PvP: casual. If you're at proper rating, it requires 15+ wins, so on average 30 games. The average game, including queue time, is about 7 minutes in 3v3. That's 3,5 hours of non-stop PvPing in order to get this week's points for gear.

    Now you may say: but a full SoO clear takes way longer! Well sure, it takes about 5-6 hours once you have it on farm. But at least you get the 50% extra valor buff for all your characters on that realm once you reach the maximum. This is not the case with Conquest points, and it's silly.

    Edit: I do agree it's a bit weird that everyone, even with the lowest rating can get max PvP gear. But the people with low rating won't be a problem for fully geared heroic people anyway, since they're bad. But the rating restriction removal was needed in order to get it as balanced as possible. Imagine how unbalanced PvP would be if we still had the old system. Yeah, let that sink in. Weapons at 1800+ and shoulders at 2200+, if you didn't have those two things, it'd be impossible to win against somewhat equal skilled players.

    Having gear differences in PvE (LFR < Flex < Normal < Heroic) doesn't matter. But when you're fighting other players it does.

    Quote Originally Posted by Baracuda View Post
    I think in the future we might have the same ilevel gear but pvp gear will have 70 strength and 40-50 pvp strength while pve will have 100 strength.
    I sure hope so. It would be about time we went back to TBC/WotLK/Cataclysm when it comes to PvP vs PvE gear item levels.
    Last edited by Seditian; 2014-02-05 at 12:02 PM.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    Nope. PvP geared people with equal skill should always win from PvE geared people. No matter what. Which will be back again with the 550 ilevel gear, hopefully. It's always been like this, except for in MoP. Then again, you still think it only requires 10 games a week, which says to me you've played before MoP, so you should know better.

    It requires at least 13 wins to get all your points, so on average 26 games. 26 games is the bare minimum to get all your points, and that's when you're in the LFR bracket of PvP: casual. If you're at proper rating, it requires 15+ wins, so on average 30 games. The average game, including queue time, is about 7 minutes in 3v3. That's 3,5 hours of non-stop PvPing in order to get this week's points for gear.

    Now you may say: but a full SoO clear takes way longer! Well sure, it takes about 5-6 hours once you have it on farm. But at least you get the 50% extra valor buff for all your characters on that realm once you reach the maximum. This is not the case with Conquest points, and it's silly.

    Edit: I do agree it's a bit weird that everyone, even with the lowest rating can get max PvP gear. But the people with low rating won't be a problem for fully geared heroic people anyway, since they're bad. But the rating restriction removal was needed in order to get it as balanced as possible. Imagine how unbalanced PvP would be if we still had the old system. Yeah, let that sink in. Weapons at 1800+ and shoulders at 2200+, if you didn't have those two things, it'd be impossible to win against somewhat equal skilled players.

    Having gear differences in PvE (LFR < Flex < Normal < Heroic) doesn't matter. But when you're fighting other players it does.



    I sure hope so. It would be about time we went back to TBC/WotLK/Cataclysm when it comes to PvP vs PvE gear item levels.
    Are we just completely ignoring the fact that most PvP'ers conquest cap through 2v2 to support your argument or?

    Or that the 13 wins you mentioned to get conquest capped would mean you're about ~1850 rating, which you said is the 'LFR' of PvP? Literally anyone can clear LFR, they don't even need hands. I'd say 1,850 is more the Normal of PvP.

    Also the 50% W/L ratio you mention, most people dump MMR and speed cap through 2's. This 3.5 hours (pmsl) to cap is absolutely ridiculous, I can cap characters in 1 hour so how you're taking almost 4 times that blows my mind.

    An extremely exaggerated post claiming acquiring PvP gear is even remotely comparable to obtaining heroic PvE gear.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Borgiest View Post
    PvP isn't about gear..its about skill
    Hahahahaha

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Anzen View Post
    Are we just completely ignoring the fact that most PvP'ers conquest cap through 2v2 to support your argument or?

    Or that the 13 wins you mentioned to get conquest capped would mean you're about ~1850 rating, which you said is the 'LFR' of PvP? Literally anyone can clear LFR, they don't even need hands. I'd say 1,850 is more the Normal of PvP.

    Also the 50% W/L ratio you mention, most people dump MMR and speed cap through 2's. This 3.5 hours (pmsl) to cap is absolutely ridiculous, I can cap characters in 1 hour so how you're taking almost 4 times that blows my mind.

    An extremely exaggerated post claiming acquiring PvP gear is even remotely comparable to obtaining heroic PvE gear.
    It's not exaggerated. Just because you know nothing of PvP, doesn't mean I'm exaggerating. You can get 2200 points per week via PvP, even on 0 rating. You just need to win an RBG game as well. Since winning is not really probable, you need 3 more games in order to get maxed.

    Just to be clear: 1850 is not the normal difficulty of PvP. I'd say Flex at best. I am ignoring the 2v2 bracket, yes. Because only people who get boosted use 2v2. And if they aren't, they're most likely on higher rating, and thus the games take a lot more time as well. You cannot compare 2v2 boosting with the normal game.

    Besides, at least you don't have to do a lot of work on your alts to get nearly full heroic gear. You just do an alt run in SoO, or take an alt with you in the rest of your core group to gear him up. Tank quitting and you need someone to get tank gear, for example. While in PvP, you have to farm 22k conquest points in order to gear him. Let that sink in. 22000/90, that's 244 arena games. The only upside of it is: you can do it in one week, if you really want to. While SoO requires an insane amount of luck in order to do it in one week.

    Long story short: PvE gear, no matter what level, should never be able to beat PvP gear, when the wearers are equally skilled. Being able to kill more bosses with your gear should be a reward in itself, you shouldn't feel the need to also beat people who specifically gear for that situation: PvP.

    Edit: I would love to get back the rating requirements on gear. But it just doesn't work with PvP because of balance. That's the whole problem, you cannot make it difficult for people to get maxed PvP gear, or the balance will be even worse (who would've thought this was possible) than it is now.
    Last edited by Seditian; 2014-02-05 at 12:19 PM.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    It's not exaggerated. Just because you know nothing of PvP, doesn't mean I'm exaggerating.
    Literally the point I stopped reading. Argue with yourself, I'm not going to be flamed.

    It doesn't take a multi-rank 1 gladiator to work out that literally anyone can cap 1800 in 10 games through 2v2 at low MMR, hell with the amount of teams dumping MMR, you could do it without even facing an enemy team. Everyone knows this; I don't know who you're trying to convince. Your massive over the top exaggerations are only making you look inexperienced yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    I am ignoring the 2v2 bracket, yes. Because only people who get boosted use 2v2
    2v2 is the most played bracket; of course you already know this being the PvP master. The bit I bolded is also probably the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen someone say on the forums.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Anzen View Post
    Literally the point I stopped reading. Argue with yourself, I'm not going to be flamed.
    You saying you're pissing yourself laughing is in no way a flame towards me either, of course. Get over yourself.

  7. #27
    If it's not instanced PvP it doesn't matter.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Anzen View Post
    Literally the point I stopped reading. Argue with yourself, I'm not going to be flamed.

    It doesn't take a multi-rank 1 gladiator to work out that literally anyone can cap 1800 in 10 games through 2v2 at low MMR, hell with the amount of teams dumping MMR, you could do it without even facing an enemy team. Everyone knows this; I don't know who you're trying to convince. Your massive over the top exaggerations are only making you look inexperienced yourself.
    I've never been boosted, nor did I feel the need to get boosted/tank my MMR to get points. So yeah, I'm inexperienced with that. As I've stated in that post: PvP gear is supposed to be easy to get. It wasn't in TBC/WotLK and it was bad. People shouldn't be losing games because of gear, only because of skill. PvP gear being easily accessible should help with this. Unfortunately, MoP is the worst expansion, PvP-wise, so far, so it didn't help much.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is: PvE gear doesn't take more time once you're settled in, but it is harder to get settled in. But just because it's harder to get, it shouldn't be better in PvP. Either way, it doesn't really matter. Fully heroic geared people will still have a very good chance to win vs 550 geared people. Hell, it'll take about 2-3 months for most players to get full Prideful gear, so you won't have to worry about losing for a while anyway.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Anzen View Post
    2v2 is the most played bracket;
    My point exactly. It doesn't count towards titles and mounts for a reason.

  9. #29
    2v2 actually counts for gladiator and mount

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    2v2 actually counts for gladiator and mount
    Unless they changed it back from back in WotLK: nope. Source?

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    Unless they changed it back from back in WotLK: nope. Source?
    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)

    • Beginning with season 7, players will no longer have access to the newest season's weapons or shoulder armor and will not qualify for the Gladiator title/rewards with ratings from the 2v2 bracket alone. Ratings obtained through 3v3 and 5v5 game play will be required for these rewards, while the rest of the newest season's items will remain available to players in all brackets (standard rating restrictions still apply).
    You are correct, it doesn't. Blizzards reasoning was that it's too hard to balance, which is a correct statement. Although they removed rating requirements, they still don't reward the 2v2 bracket.
    Last edited by Cirayne24; 2014-02-05 at 07:28 PM. Reason: Found Blue Post.
    "Clearly every aspect of one's life, from financial stability to social popularity, to sexual prowess can be boiled down to 4 numbers: One's Arena rating" ~ Xandamere

  12. #32
    Stood in the Fire Weightlifter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borgiest View Post
    PvP isn't about gear..its about skill
    Then why is everyone on this forum crying about PvP gear being worse than PvE?

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Weightlifter View Post
    Then why is everyone on this forum crying about PvP gear being worse than PvE?
    Because it's a wish to have skill be the basis of the PvP. Yes, skill will get you to the top of the PvP ladder, but it also comes down to comp and class to help you get there.

    Additionally, to answer you question, in open world PvP, everyone cries because PvE is overpowered compared to PvP gear. But I also assume your question was rhetorical.
    "Clearly every aspect of one's life, from financial stability to social popularity, to sexual prowess can be boiled down to 4 numbers: One's Arena rating" ~ Xandamere

  14. #34

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Borgiest View Post
    PvP isn't about gear..its about skill
    gear >> skill

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