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  1. #1

    Why free 90 and 90 boost is NOT pay to win at all

    A lot of talk here regarding the free 90 with WoD purchase and how it's a "slippery slope" (a term used literally every expansion since vanilla, lols) and "pay to win". I genuinely fail to see how this is pay to win in any shape or form.

    Pay to win would be the gear that makes your character great. The gear that makes your character..win? How many rated BG's have YOU won with a fresh 90 in sub 500 ilvl gear that you have no idea how to play? How many WoL rankings have YOU gotten with a fresh 90 in sub 500 ilvl gear that you have no idea how to play?

    You're getting a level 90 character with awful gear. You're not winning much of anything, and will probably die trying to kill Gulp Frogs on the Timeless Isle. So how exactly are you paying to win? What exactly are you winning? There is no aspect in this game in which you are going to dominate anything with a free 90 boost, unless you put your own effort into the character post boost. That means..you didn't pay to win anything..

    Nothing. You're winning nothing.
    Last edited by Master Guns; 2014-02-01 at 08:11 PM.
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  2. #2
    A level 1 challenges a boosted 90 to a duel. There you just paid to win.

  3. #3
    High Overlord
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    You skip from level 1 to level 90 in the press of a button.

    That is in MY opinion pay to win. End of discussion.
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimbolt View Post
    You skip from level 1 to level 90 in the press of a button.

    That is in MY opinion pay to win. End of discussion.
    The content Blizzard (and most sane people) care about is WoD content. The boost makes WoD content available to new players, instead of having to drudge through 90 levels of content that they aren't interested in. Completely logical.
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  5. #5
    Herald of the Titans naturetauren's Avatar
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    Let me give you a list of what is not pay 2 win:

    Even a boost to lvl 100 is not p2win.

    Honor/arena cap is not p2win. You dont get rating, you only buy time.

    +100% honor and rep gain is not p2win. You only buy time.

    Being able to buy tokens to instantly complete quests.

    Being able to blacklist 2 more bgs.

    Being able to buy all flight skills in one button.

    I mean the only thing you win is time skipping.

    Being able to respecc for free for one month.

    Totally not p2win, more like p2skip or something. Like you know, illegal servers have to get money..
    OP spells at Ashran? Based on faction population? Yes, WODs gonna be the most awesome expansion ever! Propably gonna hit under 4 million sub mark.

  6. #6
    High Overlord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    The content Blizzard (and most sane people) care about is WoD content.
    Why? Why would people not like to learn about the characters in the universe they are likely to spend several months in? Questing and leveling is supposed to be about the adventure, learning your class, meeting other characters and exploring the game world.

    Apparently blizzard themselves hate the experience and instead of enhancing it, they are simply removing the experience.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimbolt View Post
    You skip from level 1 to level 90 in the press of a button.

    That is in MY opinion pay to win. End of discussion.
    and you get no loot and aren't done leveling and get to waste time running pointless shit to get to the 'real' game (you know... where the content updates are). And when the xpac drops you'll still have to finish out 10 more levels.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimbolt View Post
    Why? Why would people not like to learn about the characters in the universe they are likely to spend several months in? Questing and leveling is supposed to be about the adventure, learning your class, meeting other characters and exploring the game world.

    Apparently blizzard themselves hate the experience and instead of enhancing it, they are simply removing the experience.
    Because..they don't want to? Not everyone cares about game lore and things in the past. A LOT of people don't. The main thing here is WoD. Simple as that.
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  9. #9
    High Overlord Pedrolo's Avatar
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    There is always an OP class every patch. They do so because people have to change to the good class at every moment. So people has to level up alts to make gaming and sub time longer. If you can bost to 90 the class that is OP at the moment you dont have to losse time leveling it, so you gear the character faster than someone who has not paid a bost, so you are in advantage.

    Paying gives you an advantage over people who don't pay, so, P2W.

  10. #10
    Stood in the Fire
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    Paying Blizzard to avoid doing part of the game is pretty much the definition of play to win kid.

  11. #11
    Sorry, but no, that's completely false and irrelevant.

    The only question here is "does this service give me an advantage over others in high end content". That's the only form of P2W in a game like WoW. Free Warforged epics with the bush of a button and transaction - pay to win. Free 90 toon that is either naked or in greens - not pay to win. Simple as that. You are GETTING NO ADVANTAGE OVER ANYONE IN ANY PART OF THE END GAME, AT ALL. You are NOT paying to win anything.
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  12. #12
    To win the game you need at least a level 90.

    So Buying a lvl 90 is pay 2 win.

    You can close this thread. Wont even read it.

    Thank you.


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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by rootfifth View Post
    A level 1 challenges a boosted 90 to a duel. There you just paid to win.
    No, you have a dumb move. Why would a level 1 challenge a level 90 to a duel and expect anything other than a humilliating loss?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimbolt View Post
    You skip from level 1 to level 90 in the press of a button.

    That is in MY opinion pay to win. End of discussion.
    So, in your opinion, reaching level 90 means you 'won the game of WoW'? Does that mean you'll only level your charcter up to 90 and stop playing them, despite having 10 more levels to go to reach max level, plus all the raids you have at max level, because you 'won the game' when you reached 90? Well, to each their own, I guess.

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  14. #14
    End game content and pvp is where something would be pay to win. You aren't buying meaningful weapons, you aren't buying stat boost potions. You are skipping through something that gets boring really quick to get to the part where you have enough abilities to really learn how your class functions. This isn't a hard game, but continually leveling a bunch of characters does become rather dry, even with heirlooms.

  15. #15
    The conflict exists because different definitions of what "winning" is within this game exist.

    People put a label on what's p2w and naturetauren shows a perfect example of it. The list can go on forever until you get to the barricade where the only definition of win within this game is absolutely nothing, because everything is just a huge time waste. If you don't achieve anything by dinging 90, you don't achieve anything by killing the last boss.

    MMORPG: killing last boss in latest raid on hardest difficulty is not the win within the game.
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  16. #16
    I am Murloc! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    A lot of talk here regarding the free 90 with WoD purchase and how it's a "slippery slope" (a term used literally every expansion since vanilla, lols) and "pay to win". I genuinely fail to see how this is pay to win in any shape or form.

    Pay to win would be the gear that makes your character great. The gear that makes your character..win? How many rated BG's have YOU won with a fresh 90 in sub 500 ilvl gear that you have no idea how to play? How many WoL rankings have YOU gotten with a fresh 90 in sub 500 ilvl gear that you have no idea how to play?

    You're getting a level 90 character with awful gear. You're not winning much of anything, and will probably die trying to kill Gulp Frogs on the Timeless Isle. So how exactly are you paying to win? What exactly are you winning? There is no aspect in this game in which you are going to dominate anything with a free 90 boost, unless you put your own effort into the character post boost. That means..you didn't pay to win anything..

    Nothing. You're winning nothing.
    Your lack of imagination and comprehension demonstrates nothing about the incoming paid 90 boost.

    The WoW community rightly reviles bots, which exist so that botting players don't have to spend their time on honor, mats or gold. A paid 90 boost will exist so that players don't have to spend their time leveling a character. If Blizzard truly feels that leveling is awful, perhaps they should spend some of that oh-so-precious developer time making it fun & relevant again instead of charging players an additional fee (after already charging them for game, expansion, and subscriptions) in order to bypass Blizzard's own failure as game developers.

  17. #17
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    It seems like there are two camps in this discussion:

    The ones that hates the leveling experience
    The ones that loves the leveling experience

    Both camps are stuck in their own mindsets and refuse to nudge. There for the discussion is silly and unnecessary.
    "Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion." - Steven Weinberg, Nobel Laureate in physics

  18. #18
    Lol, I wasn't aware that hitting level 90 was winning the game. Interesting. I guess all of the content past 90 is pointless, because you've already won the game at the point in time that you hit 90? I guess I've on the game 4 times over on 5 toons every expansion. Haha. What a laugh.

    I have leveled 6 toons to level 90. Six. And I hated every single level process past the first one. Because let's be honest, blizzard aren't the best writers, and their quests aren't that fun. So doing it once and experiencing the entire game SIX TIMES is a LOT.

    I welcome a free boost, because I will literally never level another character again.
    Last edited by Master Guns; 2014-02-01 at 08:36 PM.
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimbolt View Post
    It seems like there are two camps in this discussion:

    The ones that hates the leveling experience
    The ones that loves the leveling experience

    Both camps are stuck in their own mindsets and refuse to nudge. There for the discussion is silly and unnecessary.
    That's every two-party system for you.



    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    Lol, I wasn't aware that hitting level 90 was winning the game. Interesting. I guess all of the content past 90 is pointless, because you've already won the game at the point in time that you hit 90? I guess I've on the game 4 times over on 5 toons every expansion. Haha. What a laugh.
    Should've known it was a troll.
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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    So, in your opinion, reaching level 90 means you 'won the game of WoW'?
    You can never "win WoW" no matter what you do, so in your opinion it's impossible for pay2win to exist in WoW?
    Pay2win is not about winning the entire game, it's about buying an ingame advantage for real money. Which instant lvl 90 clearly is.

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