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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Can you stop talking about things you know nothing about? Please?

    Illidan Spent more time Working against the Legion in WCIII than he did working for, and he pretty much went back to working against the Legion again shortly after.

    Also

    Saying Draenei are equal to Man'ari Eredar is kind of like saying Vrykul are like Humans, you can link them together, but there's a pretty big difference.

    But you are right about one thing:


    - - - Updated - - -



    Monks are brand new, look at monk representation compared to DK representation

    Oh, I would suggest you actually read a little bit into this subject as well, Warlock=/=Demon Hunter, in fact Paladins and priests are FAR closer than Warlocks and Demon Hunters.
    werent the G1(generation one) paladins just priests in plate? didnt play WCII so i am not really sure.
    there is like 3 generations death knights and 2 generations of paladins.

  2. #42
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    werent the G1(generation one) paladins just priests in plate? didnt play WCII so i am not really sure.
    there is like 3 generations death knights and 2 generations of paladins.
    Taken from Wowpedia:
    "The Holy Order of Northshire Clerics, led by Archbishop Alonsus Faol, was devastated during the First War. Seeking to create an order that would suffer less attrition in battle, Faol recruited noble knights (to train in the ways of the Light) and members of the priesthood (to train in martial combat). In Alonsus Chapel in Stratholme, Uther the Lightbringer was appointed the first of the paladins. He was followed by Saidan Dathrohan, Tirion Fordring and Turalyon (candidates recommended by Alonsus Faol himself) as well as Gavinrad the Dire (a candidate proposed by Lord Anduin Lothar). The Order of the Silver Hand was thus born."
    The Human and Dwarf Paladins today are really the same, they just lack the 'Order of the Silver Hand' tag.

    Blood Knights, Sunwalkers, and Vindicators function a little bit differently, but to the same effect.

    Whereas the first order of Death Knights were made from the souls of Shadow Council Orc Warlocks placed the corpses of Stormwind Knights.

    The Death Knights of the Scourge came originally from jaded and bitter Paladins of the Silver Hand, later they would also be reanimated Warriors and Paladins.



    So basically, all it takes for a Priest to become a Paladin is a little bit of Sword training. Warlocks and Demon Hunters, while they share some visual similarities, are completely different (A Warlock can't just pick up glaives and become a Demon Hunter.)

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    So basically, all it takes for a Priest to become a Paladin is a little bit of Sword training. Warlocks and Demon Hunters, while they share some visual similarities, are completely different (A Warlock can't just pick up glaives and become a Demon Hunter.)
    Technically they can.

    We can all agree Illidan is the proto-demon hunter right?

    All Illidan was was a mage who forsook the arcane for demonic power in order to fight demons. That right there is exactly what warlocks are, with the implication being that fel power corrupts and will always eventually lead to a reversal of fortune for the warlock where their soul will end up enslaved by the demonic forces they seek to control.

    There really isn't a lot to separate demon hunters from warlocks. I'd go so far as to say that demon hunters are Nelf Warlocks, capable of enslaving demons and normally using a main and off-hand weapon. At this point it would be a flavor text - much of which was removed in WotLK - like the difference between a Priest of The Light and a Priest of The Fallen Shadow are there but for gameplay purposes both are just classified as "holy."

  4. #44
    The Patient Arberian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly View Post
    Technically they can.

    We can all agree Illidan is the proto-demon hunter right?

    All Illidan was was a mage who forsook the arcane for demonic power in order to fight demons. That right there is exactly what warlocks are, with the implication being that fel power corrupts and will always eventually lead to a reversal of fortune for the warlock where their soul will end up enslaved by the demonic forces they seek to control.

    There really isn't a lot to separate demon hunters from warlocks. I'd go so far as to say that demon hunters are Nelf Warlocks, capable of enslaving demons and normally using a main and off-hand weapon. At this point it would be a flavor text - much of which was removed in WotLK - like the difference between a Priest of The Light and a Priest of The Fallen Shadow are there but for gameplay purposes both are just classified as "holy."
    I dont agree because the "Demon Hunters" use basically Arcane and Fire . Warlocks do not use mainly Arcane. Demon hutners are more of a union of a Battlemage , Warriors , Rogues and Warlocks with some new Features!!
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  5. #45
    Elemental Lord Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    I dont agree because the "Demon Hunters" use basically Arcane and Fire . Warlocks do not use mainly Arcane.
    Warlocks have Soul Fire, Immolation Aura, Incinerate, and Rain of Fire. You wouldn't consider those fire spells?

    And yeah Warlocks don't use Arcane, and neither do Demon Hunters.

  6. #46
    Lol you realise that the warlock class in wow basically stole the original death knight spell death coil for no apparent reason? and that the warlock class is a stupid mix of demon hunter/mage abilitites.
    Also warlocks use fel which is something entirely different than the shadow magic of death knights.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Can you stop talking about things you know nothing about? Please?
    Was not aware people were not entitled to their own opinions and interpretations of lore and races. Maybe you should visit a gnome, and ask him to use a tractor and remove the pseudoplatanus from your gluteus maximus As for the Man'Ari, it is simply a matter of a redskin option and Blizz unlocking subclasses. Open your mind and try not to take yourself so serious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    So basically, all it takes for a Priest to become a Paladin is a little bit of Sword training.
    Guess we have the proof that Gnome paladins are a sure thing

  8. #48
    The Death Knights are a hero class, which can coexist with the rest of the classes, even with the Necromancers (which I hope they become a regular class someday).

    The same goes for the Demon Hunters or Dragonsworns, which are also hero classes and are compatible with all existing and future classes.

    End of discussion, anything else implies a considerably narrow view...


  9. #49
    Elemental Lord Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northem View Post
    The Death Knights are a hero class, which can coexist with the rest of the classes, even with the Necromancers (which I hope they become a regular class someday).

    The same goes for the Demon Hunters or Dragonsworns, which are also hero classes and are compatible with all existing and future classes.

    End of discussion, anything else implies a considerably narrow view...
    Death Knights fit into the game because there wasn't a necromancer class, or any class that had a necromancy/undead theme. The Death Knight embodied the scourge element of the game. An element that NO class had touched upon.

    Demon Hunters aren't in the same position, because we have a Warlock class. Even worse, we have a Warlock class that has Demon Hunter abilities, armor, and lore. Warlocks encompass the theme of demons and the legion, so there is no open demonic theme for DHs to occupy.

    Dragonsworn doesn't work either because there is no unifying theme to construct a class out of. Every ability we've seen from Dragonsworn is already embodied in existing classes. Also their lore contradicts WoW class structure, since Dragonsworn must be more loyal to their Dragonflight than to the factions.

    Frankly, a technology class is the most logical remaining option. It has none of the drawbacks of the other two concepts.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2014-02-07 at 07:43 PM.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Frankly, a technology class is the most logical remaining option. It has none of the drawbacks of the other two concepts.
    Definitely a Tinker as a regular class is necessary in a world where technology is so important.

    My idea is that there is always room for more classes, no matter that some overlap with others as long as each one meets a well-defined role.


  11. #51
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superman-BladesEdge View Post
    Was not aware people were not entitled to their own opinions and interpretations of lore and races.
    You're allowed to interpret things, you're even allowed to have opinions on things. You're not allowed to hold views that go against established facts, however.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superman-BladesEdge View Post
    As for the Man'Ari, it is simply a matter of a redskin option and Blizz unlocking subclasses.
    Not really. There will most likely NEVER be an option for playable Man'ari as a subrace for the Draenei. Based off from Velen's description of them in the books, it would be a little more than red skin as well. Not to mention Archimonde was a Man'ari and he was Blue.

    As for Gnome paladins, based off from what we know about Paladins in general (Especially Dwarf and Human Paladins) there's no real reason to not have Gnome Paladins, aside from the fact that, of course, they're gnomes.

  12. #52
    Elemental Lord Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northem View Post
    Definitely a Tinker as a regular class is necessary in a world where technology is so important.

    My idea is that there is always room for more classes, no matter that some overlap with others as long as each one meets a well-defined role.
    Except in the case of Demon Hunters they're already in the class lineup for all intents and purposes within the Warlock class. In fact, Demon Hunters are so much like Warlocks that the two classes would cannibalize each other.

    What purpose would DHs really serve as a stand alone class that they couldn't serve as a spec or continued aspect of the Warlock class? We've already established that the only real difference between the two is that Warlocks can't wield the Glaives of Azzinoth.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    You're allowed to interpret things, you're even allowed to have opinions on things. You're not allowed to hold views that go against established facts, however.
    A bit contradictory if you ask me. Also, I may do as I please. If I wish to say the sky is green and not blue, I will do so. Even if no one else agrees with me, I still have the right to do so. I know for a fact the sky is blue, but maybe that day it just felt green.

    People look at things and accept them for what they are. I see something, and imagine what more it could evolve into.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avada Kedavra View Post
    /thread imo - seems you have shattered the OP already shaky premise.
    /no, they didn't.
    It's a valid and very real ironic comparison and evaluation.
    Some of the points are *sort of* off, but the meat of it is there.
    I see from your toon list you have a full compliment of 90's...though when I tried to follow the link to your druid to check if it was a guardian, it flubbed.
    So uh...is it just decorative? Or just bugged? Anyways, got tanks who are non warrior?
    If so, maybe it's time to back your train up to the station and change your stance or delete your nonwarrior tanks, non resto druids, other than holy paladins, and healing priests.
    If you can't follow where I am going with this I feel sort of bad...for you, for being even MORE ironic.
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  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly View Post
    We can all agree Illidan is the proto-demon hunter right?
    Before he consumed the Skull of Guldan, sure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly View Post
    All Illidan was was a mage who forsook the arcane for demonic power in order to fight demons. That right there is exactly what warlocks are, with the implication being that fel power corrupts and will always eventually lead to a reversal of fortune for the warlock where their soul will end up enslaved by the demonic forces they seek to control.
    Disagree. Demon Hunters may use the same forbidden magics that demons use, but they are not in league with demons like Warlocks are. Illidan, as a character, may have done this, but he actually became a Demon! This is no more defining of all Demon Hunters anymore than the fact Garrosh used the Heart of Y'sarjj somehow making all Warriors into Old God Spellcasters. They each became something else: no longer a Warrior with just Warrior abilities and no longer a Demon Hunter with just Demon Hunter abilities. Demon Hunters are Arcane Melee spellswords.
    Last edited by Futhark; 2014-02-07 at 08:19 PM.

  16. #56
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superman-BladesEdge View Post
    Also, I may do as I please.
    Go ahead, just don't be surprised when you get flamed for holding completely idiotic and irrational viewpoints.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Go ahead, just don't be surprised when you get flamed for holding completely idiotic and irrational viewpoints.
    Why are you so threatened by me having an opinion and saying whatever I like on subjects? Does it bother you that much that I won't just roll over and agree with the masses who like things just the way they are? Also, people who flame others, rather than just walk away are not mature to begin with, and I am certain I DON'T want to be associated with these people anyway.

  18. #58
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superman-BladesEdge View Post
    Why are you so threatened by me having an opinion and saying whatever I like on subjects? Does it bother you that much that I won't just roll over and agree with the masses who like things just the way they are? Also, people who flame others, rather than just walk away are not mature to begin with, and I am certain I DON'T want to be associated with these people anyway.
    I have a few choice words to describe my feelings about you, 'threatened' is not among them. I'm not bothered either, I just think you are a stupid individual for trying to ignore facts by saying that you feel a different way. I do find it funny, though, that you speak of maturity (or lack of) while simultaneously attempting to defend your lack of facts with feelings.

    I would tell you to stop while you're ahead, but you never were.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Taken from Wowpedia:


    The Human and Dwarf Paladins today are really the same, they just lack the 'Order of the Silver Hand' tag.

    Blood Knights, Sunwalkers, and Vindicators function a little bit differently, but to the same effect.

    Whereas the first order of Death Knights were made from the souls of Shadow Council Orc Warlocks placed the corpses of Stormwind Knights.

    The Death Knights of the Scourge came originally from jaded and bitter Paladins of the Silver Hand, later they would also be reanimated Warriors and Paladins.



    So basically, all it takes for a Priest to become a Paladin is a little bit of Sword training. Warlocks and Demon Hunters, while they share some visual similarities, are completely different (A Warlock can't just pick up glaives and become a Demon Hunter.)
    ok so G1 paladins were priests in plate and knights with some training in the light. then branched off further and became the pallies we know today.
    Blood knights use the light from the sunwell making them basically making them true pallies.
    sunwalkers use sun light magic.
    Vindicaters we dont know much about.

    for me G1 dks were orc souls in human bodies. G2 was arthas who went from paladin to dk without actually dying. G3 is are playable dks and the ebon blade.

    demon hunters have a ritual involved on how the gain their powers. so its different.

  20. #60
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    for me G1 dks were orc souls in human bodies. G2 was arthas who went from paladin to dk without actually dying. G3 is are playable dks and the ebon blade.
    Basically, the one thing I'm unsure of (Considering we haven't had any official response) is whether or the g2 and g3 Death Knights would really classify as seperate groups (at least in the way g1 and g2 death knights do.) considering they both really have the same purpose , they just arrive at point X in different ways (Arthas wasn't the only Death Knight who never actually died, so g2 is more than just Arthas.) It could be a point of future debate, I suppose.

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