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  1. #21
    The Lightbringer prwraith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shanattah View Post
    I'd not bring a cat as was mentioned above, very few pugs don't have either a paladin or a shaman. I usually stay at the stable master until the group is full if I pug on one of my hunters and bring pets accordingly
    yea 9 times out of 10 they need attack speed in my experience.
    Hate people who read https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ and immediately think they're debate kings.

  2. #22
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by prwraith View Post
    yea 9 times out of 10 they need attack speed in my experience.
    Same, atk spd/cast spd always needed.
    Mostly switching between Physical Vulnerability and atk speed now.

  3. #23
    But the damage of all pets is same right? As long as they're specced ferocity?

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by ptsunami2911 View Post
    But the damage of all pets is same right? As long as they're specced ferocity?
    yes. but in case if u use tall strider or boar, they will do slightly more damage due to the debuff they bring.

  5. #25
    BM is, if you can play it, probably the superior spec. As Tobin said tho it's much less forgiving and requires some finesse (pet on assist just won't work out well), but it's no less powerful than SV single-target, not quite as RNG-dependent (beyond the trink), and much stronger AoE/cleave if you can handle the pet positioning.

    Survival is equal or better single-target, much more fun to play in most people's opinion (my own included), but is more RNG-finicky and cleave is kinda bad while the AoE is okay.

    I don't think the whole "pets are buggy" arguments holds water when talking for SV - BM, sure, it fucks you 140% up as BM, but as SV you'll still be less than viable without your pet.
    Bring the pets mentioned above, if you got all buffs, have a Spirit Beast for Spirit Mend (bind it to your healthstone or something) or a Tallstrider for Sunder-AoE if you're 10-man particularly.

    As you saw on the Malkorok parses above, BM is very competitive single-target (or well, mostly, pretty easy to pad some Beast Cleaves on adds).

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...32#Azortharion is the top BM parse that's under 10% add dmg (and is not exploited or whatever the fuck gives ppl sub 1 min killtimes)

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=7821&e=8056 is the top SV parse that's under 10% add dmg.

    4k DPS diff, approx. the same killspeed - the SV parse had 33% less RPPM trink procs, though - so in the very top percentiles, SV is prolly better with some RNG mixed in. Maybe (my BM burst was awful on my parse tho). On the other hand, Derp is in mostly BiS gear and I had a normal WF trink for my parse.. So pretty much equal in the end with BM winning if you're really good I guess.
    BM is a much stronger cleave/burst AoE spec:

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...astery_Hunter/
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...rvival_Hunter/

    Should be nuff said.

    TL;DR Survival is fine for most encounters, BM is far ahead on its niche encounters (Burst-AoE/Cleave/Single-target with Cleave). Single-target play what you want. BM is pretty unforgiving, SV is not too bad.
    Last edited by Metaphoric; 2014-02-10 at 02:18 PM.

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  6. #26
    SV damage is steady if u keep up ur rotation ok. but as my personal preference i love BM more. In the end play whatever u like and u will put up the better DPS .

  7. #27
    Personally play what you like. I have been LOVING marksmanship. The procs are a ton of fun, especially if you talent into thrill of the hunt. Spamming free multishots is a blast :-)

  8. #28
    The Patient Thotor's Avatar
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    SV is easier to play, stronger until high ilevel gear. Relies heavily on proc which can be problematic when you want a controlled burst.
    I personally find it boring. There is little focus management and no timing required.

    BM is harder to master (at least for me!). Requires a high ilevel to be competitive.
    It has very high controlled burst potential.

    I think starting as SV is probably the best and then later you can try BM and look at which spec you prefer.

  9. #29
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    Attack speed (hyena/serpent) is only brought by two melee specs, frost DK and rogues (which are kind of rare, I often find my rogue is the only rogue in LFRs), and cast speed is only brought by boomkins/spriests (even more rare). Those are definitely two must haves.

    Crit is brought by WW monks, mages, and feral/guardian druids, so that can be rare too.

    After that, I go with AoE sunder, and whatever my particular group may be missing...for me it's a corehound, in case our shaman has to sit, for BL, since we have no mage.

  10. #30
    Enhance Shaman and Elemental Shaman bring attack and cast speed buffs, respectively.
    "When in doubt, slap it with your big Penance." - Naér, Stormreaver

  11. #31
    No one has really characterized the specs so I'll do that here (IMO obviously, and yes I'm generalizing quite a bit to focus on distinction between classes):

    BM: Plays more like a traditional melee spec (big nuke and cds with some other buttons to push here and there), but your pet is actually the one in melee allowing you to run around freely. Gameplay revolves around managing CDs and using nukes.

    MM: More like a caster because of Aimed Shot, but still lots of instant filler abilities. I have not played this spec since early-mid Cata, but I don't think much has changed. Gameplay revolves around keeping up your Steady Focus buff (by steady shotting 2x in a row) and changing your priorities for Careful Aim.

    SV: Very much a dot class, but sadly without great multidotting functionality (MS doesn't count IMO). Gameplay revolves around keeping up DOTs and managing focus.

  12. #32
    Thanks ute!
    I guess that helps me make a better decision now(I dont like casters, so byebye MM)
    I can swap b/w SV and BM.

    One more question : The stat priority for all 3 specs is same right? If i'm not wrong : hit+exp>crit>haste>mastery(obv agility first :P)

    So I can use the exact same gear with same reforges/gems/enchants for all 3 specs if i want to swap in the middle of a raid?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, engineering/alchemy are good profs right? I can send materials from my paladin for leveling them

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by ptsunami2911 View Post
    Thanks ute!
    I guess that helps me make a better decision now(I dont like casters, so byebye MM)
    I can swap b/w SV and BM.

    One more question : The stat priority for all 3 specs is same right? If i'm not wrong : hit+exp>crit>haste>mastery(obv agility first :P)

    So I can use the exact same gear with same reforges/gems/enchants for all 3 specs if i want to swap in the middle of a raid?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, engineering/alchemy are good profs right? I can send materials from my paladin for leveling them
    Crit > Haste > Mastery works for all specs - at 570+ iLvls, Haste pulls ahead for Beast Mastery but it doesn't really matter.

    Engineer/Alch are perfectly good proffs, the ones I use too.

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  14. #34
    I've seen some threads that BM's have cleave while have SV has AoE. ..... is there any real difference b/w the 2, that there is a major advantage on using any one spec over the spec on a different bosses?

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by ptsunami2911 View Post
    I've seen some threads that BM's have cleave while have SV has AoE. ..... is there any real difference b/w the 2, that there is a major advantage on using any one spec over the spec on a different bosses?
    There are no fights where SV is truly better, there are more fights were BM is a lot better (this assuming you're just kinda padding everything on HC)

    Immerseus: Equal, perhaps favoring BM, depends on add situation
    Protectors: BM - Cleave fight where BM is much stronger.
    Norushen: BM for the single target and acceptable cleave on adds.
    Sha of Pride: Equal - Bursty AoE but SV has a place here because it's primarily single-target but if you can handle the pet right here, BM.
    Galakras: BM - AoE/cleave fight where BM just wins.
    Iron Juggernaut: Equal p.much
    Dark Shaman: BM - Burst AoE for adds, sustained cleave if you ever tank bosses together.
    Nazgrim: BM - Cleave off boss to adds, leave pet on boss for defensive (if you stop DPS'ing at all)
    Malkorok: Equal, prolly favoring BM cuz pad-cleave on the adds.
    Spoils: BM because cleave/AoE, but only if you master controlling dat pet.
    Thok: Equal/SV -Really- depends on tac, and even then it's kind of equal, maybe favoring SV because pet chasing boss etc, BM pulls ahead on bats tho.
    Blackfuse: BM - Bestial Wrath on every belt, Beast Cleave on mines @ platform.
    Paragons: BM/maybe SV - Keep Beast Cleave up if you're an ultimate scumbag DPS padder, but I'd say equal here as well as it's mostly single-target.
    Garrosh: BM for transition-AoE burst, and phase 1 adds.

    BM has stronger cleave and AoE - SV has semi-terrible cleave but decent AoE - sustained AoE is arguably the same but usually you want the bursty AoE which belongs to BM.
    As you saw on the bosses, you can pretty much play whatever spec and be successful, but it'll be easier to do competitive DPS as Survival - BM is just less forgiving and especially on Spoils, requires some clever pet control.

    BM is, in my opinion a vastly superior spec, but I still reckon most hunters should go SV unless they're willing to handle the cooldowns, the pet control and all the other small things that makes BM, as a pet-centered spec, a little less forgiving. Sustained damage as BM is low, you're entirely dependent on your own ability to keep Beast Cleave up without dropping too many Kill Commands, and your cooldown usage.

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