How can I get my raid leader to understand?

[Dangg]

We got our shamans kill with a healer dead before the bloodlust using the 8:2 split. On 10, it's possible for a blood DK to solo Kardriss or for two tanks to two-man Haromm and therefore to single-heal it. I also wouldn't recommend it for progression, but if you have awesome tanks and healers, whatever.

It is not necessary to two-heal anything before spoils.

Ok I agree, we used the same strat. Like I've said I would recommend 3 healers.

There are some boss were using 3 healers is worse than 2 in my opinion like Sha, Galakras (damage comes from stuff living too long) and Nazgrim (like Galakras). Spoils of course.

[Deleted]

You didn't 3 heal Shamans and Thok? (I know some do it, but I don't see why at this point)

Only bosses we 3-healed for heroic progression were H Jugg and H Thok. Looking back, I can't honestly see a reason to 3-heal Shamans. Our 2 healers only ever got stressed out healing it because people were being stupid and getting gibbed. The raid damage output is easily managed otherwise.

[Tziva]

I'm mildly amused to see this thread, because a raid I run with (not the one I lead myself, obviously) was doing that for a few weeks. It was really out of character for the raid leader, too, who usually has a pretty solid plan for doing things. It was frustrating, and we wasted a lot of time sampling a bunch of fights and/or discussing strategy, only to move on.

I tossed up a thread on our raiding forums and whined about it and was generally irritating, and now we have a planned progression order. Huzzah. tl;dr bitch about it more

(Seriously, if your guild uses forums, put up a long post rationally arguing your case. Get everyone to discuss, and hopefully arrive at an agreeable plan going forward)

[Dom]

There's no point to testing out bosses. Look at wowprogress stats and read up on strats while considering your comp and the progression order should be obvious.

[mistahwilshire]

Sounds like you basically just need to yell at your raid leader, in whatever seems like the most appropriate and mature way. Bouncing around from boss to boss is an extreme waste of time.

Also just 2-heal Norushen.

2 DPS + Healer
2 DPS + Healer
2 DPS
Tanks/Healers alternate for the rest of the fight and DPS never need to go in again, and just stand around and turret the boss.

We one shot H Norushen back in September with this strat after only one clear through Normal so with your raids gear this should be an absolute cake walk.

I'd strongly suggest arguing against the 3 healers for all fights rule as well because that's ridiculously far from necessary and will hinder your raid significantly.

[Deleted]

Show him this reply:

Dear Zantos's Raid Leader,

You, my friend, are a moron.

Yours Truly,

Frenikk, Draenor EU

not as stupid as someone leaving a guild without a word, right?

[TheRev]

As part of a 2 man RL I can understand the want to let Ur raid SEE the fights Ur first week or two (depending on how many days a week raid) but after that u guys should be strapping in foe the long haul and going at the boss with the full intention of killing that before moving on. Our frst week of H program we put and hr into Imm, noru, and sha.. the next week I wouldn't let them leave until we killed at least Imm.. then Imm and noru.. this week it was Imm noru, sha.. u have to realize if Ur raid has 10N on farm what kind of moral hit Ur raid takes wiping on a boss for hrs. Sometimes it is best to just move on. Sometimes u have to force them to recognize H progression is slow and painful and to suck it up. The way I did it was by letting them see how much easier normal was when they could be putting more effort into heroic kills for heroic gear. After a few kills my raid got the taste for blood again and now they will stay in a fight until I'm content with how much progress we have made, or we get the kill.

On my phone.. too many auto corrects...

[hatchetman240]

If you're a boomie/resto offspec then I have a proper raid team for you.

[Adhemar]

Only bosses we 3-healed for heroic progression were H Jugg and H Thok. Looking back, I can't honestly see a reason to 3-heal Shamans. Our 2 healers only ever got stressed out healing it because people were being stupid and getting gibbed. The raid damage output is easily managed otherwise.

Here's my reason to three-heal shamans, then: adding an extra DPS makes no practical difference to fight mechanics and only results in a slightly faster kill, while having a third healer means you're slightly less screwed if one healer dies to bad (which is exactly what happened on my kill) and have a better chance of recovery if DPS or tanks make similar mistakes.

Is it necessary? Nope. But it hurts very little and gives you an extra security blanket that made our progression easier.

[MisterMine]

Recently we killed Garrosh normal and began to try heroic progression. However, there is a problem. My guilds raid leader keeps wanting to jump from boss to boss. We start working on one heroic boss, then we change after an hour and go to a different. We have seen so far 4 heroic bosses in the first two weeks of trying to progress. It got especially bad when we were making honest progress on the first boss, getting to the third / fourth split phase when the raid leader said "alright, lets go try heroic protectors now". I tried explaining to him that we won't kill anything if we don't put in the time and effort to focus on actually progressing on a boss. He said that we need to see more of the mechanics for the other bosses. How can I get my raid leader to understand that we wont kill any of these heroic bosses unless we actually get to stay on them and actually work on progression so we can get used to all the small things in the fight.

whats up with all the "omg my raid leader dont listen to me QQ" threads lately... i thought this was the raid and dungeons forum , not the "how to deal with other human beings" forum

you know its better to do heroics one at once, everyone knows. what are you trying to find out exactly??
how to tell you raid leader that hes an idiot?? there ill show you : "dear raid leader, ur a fuckin idiot and ur wasting ur whole raid's time"
what else do u want exactly???

[-Psypher-]

As a raid leader for more than two years, that is the dumbest strategy for progression I've ever heard of. My raiders would crucify me if I did that.

[hatchetman240]

As a raid leader for more than two years, that is the dumbest strategy for progression I've ever heard of. My raiders would crucify me if I did that.

My raiders have grown fat on a diet of normal mode success and drops. I constantly get pressure to move on and "go try another boss" from them now that we're having to work again on heroics. I'm the raid lead enforcing the "only this boss" standard on them. Granted we're super casual (6 hours of raiding a week, 4/14 heroic) but I want to tear my hair out when people do that. I think they've begun to realize the benefits of focus though, and lately I've just been getting pressure to do specific bosses from different players depending on loot.

[Krazzorx]

If nothing changes, if you can put up with it for a few months longer know the end is in sight: in WoD they said at Blizzcon you can't jump bosses like you can now. You have to go through in order. That sort of forces them to stop jumping.

[announced]

tell your raid leader he needs to focus on downing one boss first before he moves to other ones, it makes no sense to change progression just because you feel like another boss may be easier than one, most of them are around the same difficulty, just diff mechanics

You didn't 3 heal Shamans and Thok? (I know some do it, but I don't see why at this point)

3 healing thok is quite fine, our raid team used to 2 heal it and if a healer got rng- targeted twice for fixate and couldnt run away fast enough it turned into an instant wipe, 3 healing means pushing every phase to 20+ stacks and getting much more dmg on thok than before, now we kill it even before the fire phase happens cause of 3 healing. (10 hm)

[Darkfriend]

Your RL is an idiot. There has been 1 instance ever where we skipped a boss we had spent time working on to work on another- and that was due to a hard DPS check we couldn't meet the first few weeks into MOP.

[minkage]

Poor leadership.

[Gaidax]

There is often issues beyond what you see, just as you may be annoyed with this strategy, there may be others in your guild who simply don't want to beat their head on a wall whole night and I can understand that too - nothing more frustrating than 3 hours straight of wipes.

Also, it could be that the raid composition at that point was less than optimal. I mean, we had that issue too in SoO on some HC Sha and Shamans attempts, where we had one particular healer standing in fire like an idiot all the time and getting gibbed in like 80% of the tries and wiping us with projections on 20% others and at that night we had no replacement healer available, so we just moved on instead of wasting time.

Maybe you just don't see and understand those things, while officers actually do. In our raids we have an experienced raid leader and a good officers team and all their decisions regarding what we do next are taken as a team, I don't think that those decisions in your guild are taken solely by raid leader as well.

Also, the best course of action in this case is not to make a drama or try to prove your point in chat, but to open a good-natured thread on your private guild forum stating your opinion (and not presenting it as a fact).