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  1. #21
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PetersenIII View Post
    Please don't speak for people who aren't you. I don't really care what number is in the circle by my name, as long as that number is the highest it can be. The number is irrelevant as long as it is the maximum.
    Says to not speak for people who aren't me, which I didn't do, then proceeds to do that very thing. The number is irrelevant to you. I can't help that you don't get the larger concept of identity in a video game and instead want to pare it to an argument of semantics. The number beside your name is an indicator of who you are, much like the title. When we hit level 100 we will be proud of that accomplishment.

    And more to the point, your level doesn't affect gameplay in the slightest. What purpose would the proposed idea serve other than to arbitrarily change numbers? Or are people so naive to think that Blizzard should rebalance the entire game with different npc stat budgets to accomodate what is already 'smoothed out' in the same rate by way of XP needed per level?

    Edit: you also don't understand the concept of knowing you have accomplished x level by way of earning y XP. Stats on your gear aren't broken down into x number of dungeons, y number of quests, z number of LFR runs. You pretty much don't understand philosophy in the slightest. But go ahead and eyeroll some more ignorance my way.
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  2. #22
    They should remove levels and replace them with storyline checkpoints.

  3. #23
    The Lightbringer Mokoshne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by staal View Post
    They should remove levels and replace them with storyline checkpoints.
    i doubt it since alot of people actually enjoy the leveling process.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by barlar View Post
    this. but also how many new people are gonna buy a 90 if they can and wont know how to play? its gonna suck.
    Wierd i know plenty of people that really knows their class and really can play that lvled with recruit a friend, by your logic they shouldn´t be able to know their class as good as those that lvled 1-90 the normal way.

    It have almost nothing to do with how they lvled their char and everything to do with how much do they really wanna learn to play their char.
    Last edited by Raven; 2014-02-15 at 09:55 AM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Says to not speak for people who aren't me, which I didn't do, then proceeds to do that very thing. The number is irrelevant to you. I can't help that you don't get the larger concept of identity in a video game and instead want to pare it to an argument of semantics. The number beside your name is an indicator of who you are, much like the title. When we hit level 100 we will be proud of that accomplishment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Everyone using this argument is doing it wrong. The amount of strength or damage you do is a behind the scenes operation of your character's spells. If you didn't have damage meters or displayed combat text, which is outside of the actual game world, it is literally invisible. However, your character's level is integral to their identity. You are the level 90 DK or level 90 Mage. You are not a 10k Intellect mage or a 20k strength DK.
    Quote Originally Posted by PetersenIII View Post
    Please don't speak for people who aren't you. I don't really care what number is in the circle by my name, as long as that number is the highest it can be. The number is irrelevant as long as it is the maximum.
    If you can't see the difference, then I really can't be bothered talking to you, but please feel free to continue the ad hominem.
    "It is a demonstration of incomprehensible hubris to quote one's self, especially in one's own forum signature."
    ¬PetersenIII

  6. #26
    I am glad the squish is happening. The last time my health and damage output was really relatable was WotLK. I took a 75k hit yesterday and reflexively moved to get out of whatever death pool I was standing in to do that much damage to me, then realized it was, in raid terms, barely a scratch. Last night I switch to Resto and my Healing Stream Totem was ticking for about 75k. And my item level is barely over 500.

    When numbers get too big they cease to really have meaning. Most people have trouble relating to large numbers beyond "That is a really large number!".

  7. #27
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PetersenIII View Post
    If you can't see the difference, then I really can't be bothered talking to you, but please feel free to continue the ad hominem.
    So essentially you have nothing to say. Pro tip, saying you don't understand something isn't exactly a supreme example of ad hominem. But please continue throwing out random internet buzzwords. If you have an actual response, feel free. I'm sorry that you don't understand the philosophical issue at hand. I could try to reiterate, but I have a strong feeling it would be a wasted effort.
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  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by barlar View Post
    this. but also how many new people are gonna buy a 90 if they can and wont know how to play? its gonna suck.
    I think that's a big thing though that many people don't realize. With nearly every F2P game, regardless if MMO or otherwise I tend to play the game a bit before making any conclusion to spending anymore money then the actual monthly fee or any knick knacks in the game.

    Of course, different people are different.
    Last edited by Roamingstorm; 2014-02-15 at 11:50 PM.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Everyone using this argument is doing it wrong. The amount of strength or damage you do is a behind the scenes operation of your character's spells. If you didn't have damage meters or displayed combat text, which is outside of the actual game world, it is literally invisible. However, your character's level is integral to their identity. You are the level 90 DK or level 90 Mage. You are not a 10k Intellect mage or a 20k strength DK.

    Edit: Additionally your levels serve as a badge of honor of actual actions completed. You earned the XP to be level 90. You will soon earn the XP to be level 100. There is no definable action tied to having X amount of Y stat.
    Levels are behind the scenes as well by your own line of reasoning. XP is also behind the scenes. In the game world you're just "a seasoned veteran" at this point. Your entire stance here is extremely hypocritical.

  10. #30
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mistahwilshire View Post
    Levels are behind the scenes as well by your own line of reasoning. XP is also behind the scenes. In the game world you're just "a seasoned veteran" at this point. Your entire stance here is extremely hypocritical.
    Read again. It's a correlation of specific deeds accomplished to the number, which stats simply do not have.
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  11. #31
    The Patient
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    So does this mean a level 93 Boss in MSV is tougher than the Lich King?

    The levels mean nothing other than as identifiers. BC bosses are not inherently weaker than WotLK bosses, the numbers just represent the time line.

    I would argue that intellect is more of an identifier than level. I would recruit a 25k int mage over a 22k int mage. He is likely to do more damage and needs less upgrading.

  12. #32
    As stated the suggestion of flattening levels is ridiculous, but the general concept of flattening the XP curve (and also the crazy amounts of XP earned/earnable with boosts) may have merit.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by PetersenIII View Post
    Because it's not silly to magically go from 20,000 strength to 4,000 strength, right?
    Item squish is happening because of the insane numbers we will expect to push out in WoD if the exponential growth continues. LVs don't exponentially grow however so drastic numbers aren't a problem.

    Until we reach a lv containing 6 digits, I don't see a purpose to squish.

  14. #34
    Moderator Gehco's Avatar
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    Level and XP squish is far from the same as item squish, so far.

    Besiddes, you are taking away what people have been working with by reducing level (and what you write, XP as well). The item squish doesn't affect you at all in the end, it is just a squish of stats. You can still do your damage. Is this discussion built on the fact of wanting big numbers and not understanding why it is squished, so suddenly thinking the rest should to keep up?

    There was multiple item squish blue posts, explaining it so well for all. And to an over view, lvl 90 today is.. not really far.. You can, by casual play, do it in 7 days (very casual). But squishing levels are not the same as stats. Working on the levels, you are suddenly ripping through content and from how I see your post, making the content unstable and even less seen if you want XP squish too.

    You plan would mean, level squish -> XP blow up (Not XP squish, XP squish means less XP needed). Lower levels means longer and slower levelling to reach max for it to work against even more obsolete content.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kail View Post
    Item squish is happening because of the insane numbers we will expect to push out in WoD if the exponential growth continues. LVs don't exponentially grow however so drastic numbers aren't a problem.

    Until we reach a lv containing 6 digits, I don't see a purpose to squish.
    This indeed.
    Currently, we have people doing on burst, 6 million DPS (Or more, I have seen 6 as my highest). A stat squish is basicly just removing some zeros that isn't much used.

    The stat squish just reduces the size of the numbers, not the damage of them as mobs and content will be following the chart too.

    1.000.000 burst DPS = 100.000 (or even 10.000, depending on the squish). You, and the mobs, everything are just going a few steps down the ladder together, else some numbers would be insane.
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  15. #35
    For a new player who may be daunted by the prospect of leveling to 100. Which sounds more appealing.

    1. We are reducing everyone to level 60, so now you only have to level from 1-60
    2. Buy the expansion and get an instant boost to lvl 90

    Blizzard Marketing > ideas from forum poster

    Read some of the non-wow gaming websites. That free lvl 90 is going to bring back a TON of returning players.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Karnak View Post
    I am glad the squish is happening. When numbers get too big they cease to really have meaning. Most people have trouble relating to large numbers beyond "That is a really large number!".
    My main, a Guardian Druid, regularly rocks over one million health, at a 550 item level. That is almost as much health as Ragnaros in Molten Core. I'm still not done getting my normal gear, and I have heroic to look forward to. Her health pool is already starting to get unfathomably large, and it's only going to get bigger. Exponential increases are fun, but this is just insane.

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