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  1. #1
    High Overlord
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    Need help with Hunter 10m N Garrosh

    Greetings, Hunters!

    I come to you in need of some assistance in breaking down our Hunter in our 10m group. I have a feeling he's one of our weaker players (his awareness and reaction times are lacking), yet we haven't had very many issues up until this fight. I was hoping a more experienced person in the ways of Hunter and parsing Hunter logs than I wouldn't mind poking through some aforementioned logs and finding some things that need to be fixed.

    Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ntrrx/advanced

    Logs from night #1: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...d59/details/0/
    Logs from night #2 (ignore thok, blackfuse, and paragons obv): http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...tdu/details/3/

    Now, a cursory glance tells me that he doesn't quite have a grip on how to play survival hunter at all; it seems his Black Arrow uptime is abysmal, which explains the low explosive shot damage output. Are there any other red flags I need to be aware of before I start making changes to our group?

    All your help and expertise is greatly appreciated, and thanks for taking the time to dig in and assist with our problems.
    I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.

  2. #2
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    just looking at his armory: He's waaaaaaaaaay over hit/expertise cap. He's NINE HUNDRED (900!) over the expertise cap, and almost 250 above the hit cap. That's 1150 wasted secondary stats.

    He can lose expertise on his chest, both rings, and his hands, but I think he's already reforging as much as he can out of hit.

    There's really no excuse for his BA numbers, on your Garrosh attempts, he has an average of 6% uptime over 7 attempts on BA. On two attempts he didn't cast it *AT ALL*. I had to do a double take and make sure that was right. LnL is the main mechanic SV rotates around, and his LnL procs are *abysmal*. Black Arrow is THE ONLY spell which procs LnL, explosive trap doesn't any more, besides ice trap on adds which can be snared. In your 11:41 attempt, he got two LnL procs. TWO. That is mind-boggingly bad.

    He never has above 50% uptime on SrS, which would be bad even if he had 4pc tier (where SrS sometimes falls off)....but he only has 2pc.

    I'm sorry, but this player is just bad. I don't know how you carried him so far in normal modes, but I guess that's an indication of normal modes these days. I don't know how to fix this other than to tell him to make sure he's casting things on CD.

  3. #3
    He is just bad, plain and simple or got no clue about his class, as eschatological said, hes way above both hit/expertise cap, his uptimes on Serpent sting/Black arrow is abysmally low. And the fact that he uses sigil of rampage. /Facepalm

  4. #4
    It really looks like he is prioritizing arcane shot over explosive shots. Explosive should probably be on top of the damage by ability chart, at least if he has 4pc.
    Also needs to try to keep black arrow up on a target that will live through the duration. Explosive trap no longer triggers lock and load, he was using that a lot too.
    As an example, one of the last times I did Garrosh 10, I had 46 ex shot hits, 46 crits, 67 ticks, and 87 tick crits in a 6:12 long fight. He had double that for an entire night of attempts.

    What is his job during the fight? Is he spacing out trying to do that?
    Does he have a mod like Weak Auras 2 or JSHB to remind him of cooldowns or abilities that are ready or if debuffs fell off the boss?

  5. #5
    Yeah, it looks to me as though he has no idea how to play Survival. Talk to and maybe he can iron it out. Otherwise he will need to be replaced. And to be fair, if nothing else has dropped for him, it really isnt bad to use Sigil...unless he's using it over Haromms or TeD.

  6. #6
    High Overlord
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    Thank you guys for all the responses; I had no idea things were this dire. We've actually had terrible luck with agi rings/trinkets dropping for us - even with bonus rolls - that as a monk tank even I'm rolling with the 535 timeless trinket, due to nothing dropping (been trying for the TED for WEEKS for both of us.... nothing). I'll get with him and chat; it seems like he's using an outdated spell priority or he just doesn't know.

    @Jakezor: I'll let him know about the explosive trap no longer triggering LnL, I'm pretty sure he still thinks it does, although one would think if you had so few procs during a fight, something might be up... We have him on Engineers in the first phase, which he handles just fine; other than that he's with the rest of the range moving in for MCs and back out to put down desecrates. I'm fairly certain he doesn't utilize either of those mods, I'll tell him to look into that.

    I appreciate all the help you guys have given. Hopefully we can turn this around quickly for him.
    Last edited by NRL1515; 2014-02-14 at 08:58 PM.
    I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.

  7. #7
    I just have to post to say WOW at a hunter out-damaging a destro lock on this fight (especially a hunter who is messing up their rotation that badly).

  8. #8
    Blademaster t11fa's Avatar
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    Has to be one of the worst hunters I've ever seen. No point in repeating everything, eschatological and Jakezor pointed out most of it. Should probably get some help for the destro lock too, I do more on my 539 alt lock with 476 trinkets on that fight and I barely touch the class.

  9. #9
    High Overlord
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    Quote Originally Posted by t11fa View Post
    Has to be one of the worst hunters I've ever seen. No point in repeating everything, eschatological and Jakezor pointed out most of it. Should probably get some help for the destro lock too, I do more on my 539 alt lock with 476 trinkets on that fight and I barely touch the class.
    Yes I've gone around and posted in each of our members' respective class forums for a more in-depth analysis. Again, thank you for taking the time to help us out.
    Last edited by NRL1515; 2014-02-15 at 05:30 PM.
    I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.

  10. #10
    Bloodsail Admiral Kissthebaby's Avatar
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    if you guys think the hunter is bad, hes beating the warlock on some of the longer attempts, dont think he is very great either.
    Last edited by Kissthebaby; 2014-02-14 at 10:47 PM.

    kissthebaby#1726

  11. #11
    Blademaster t11fa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRL1515 View Post
    Yes I've gone around and posted in each or our lesser members' respective class forums for a more in-depth analysis. Again, thank you for taking the time to help us out.
    Reread my post and I came of as very rude, sorry about that. I've been having login issues these past days and it's getting very annoying, but I shouldn't take that out on other people. But yeah, you should probably get your raiders to research their classes a bit more, will make it easier for all of you.
    Last edited by t11fa; 2014-02-15 at 01:40 AM.

  12. #12
    and i was wondering about that heroic puddle punisher ....

    at least u should -

    1) redirect him to noxxic/icy vein so at least he can get his abilities priorities right.

    2) ask him to get weak aura, and he can use the weakaura strings found here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ter-Aura-Group!

    his performance will have dramatic increase only by following the points above. Then he can go on and fine tune it even more. Sp long he doesnt mind reading, he will improve.

  13. #13
    The Patient GoKs's Avatar
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    Please find out if he is a clicker?
    I used to do the clicking thing, and my dps wasnt too bad (for me =P). Then started to suffer when we started on heroic progression.
    Got myself a new mouse with more then 2 buttons, bound some keys hit the dummys for a few hours, then some more while running arround like a posessed panda ,and hey what do you know, my dps increased by about 20k in the raid and I dont stand in the fire anymore cause I dont have to finish clicking my explosive shot(s) before I move out of fire.

    Keybinds is not the be-all end-all, but it sure will help, that is to say if he isnt already using them.
    Yea as anjan011 said, icy veins and noxxic has some great guides.
    Good luck with Garrosh =P

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by GoKs View Post
    Please find out if he is a clicker?
    I used to do the clicking thing, and my dps wasnt too bad (for me =P). Then started to suffer when we started on heroic progression.
    Got myself a new mouse with more then 2 buttons, bound some keys hit the dummys for a few hours, then some more while running arround like a posessed panda ,and hey what do you know, my dps increased by about 20k in the raid and I dont stand in the fire anymore cause I dont have to finish clicking my explosive shot(s) before I move out of fire.

    Keybinds is not the be-all end-all, but it sure will help, that is to say if he isnt already using them.
    Yea as anjan011 said, icy veins and noxxic has some great guides.
    Good luck with Garrosh =P
    I was a clicker for a number of years and did really good. I am no longer a clicker and it has resulted in a small gain, especially when I am on the move. However, that is not the issue here. Not using BA on CD indicates a lack of knowledge, not slow reflexes.

  15. #15
    Bloodsail Admiral
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    Quote Originally Posted by Namor of Muradin View Post
    I was a clicker for a number of years and did really good. I am no longer a clicker and it has resulted in a small gain, especially when I am on the move. However, that is not the issue here. Not using BA on CD indicates a lack of knowledge, not slow reflexes.
    Edit: NM, I figured out how to do it.
    Last edited by markdall; 2014-02-15 at 06:49 AM.

  16. #16
    I don't mean to be rude but that hunter has a lot of improvement to make happen if you ever plan to begin heroics with. He needs to read up on his spec and practice.

  17. #17
    The Patient GoKs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Namor of Muradin View Post
    I was a clicker for a number of years and did really good. I am no longer a clicker and it has resulted in a small gain, especially when I am on the move. However, that is not the issue here. Not using BA on CD indicates a lack of knowledge, not slow reflexes.
    While I do agree with you to some extend I just cant help but wonder if the reasoning behind his low BA and SS usage is the fact that he has to click on them, but he first wants to move out of the fire, by the time he has done that there is more stuff to move (engineer for example) to or away from so he never gets to clicking BA.
    Just a thought since I used to do that, but it doesnt mean he did or does.
    Also tell him not to use traps on Garrosh since if he gets mind controlled it is and extra bit (al be it trevial) of healing for your healers to do.

  18. #18

  19. #19
    He is bad. Those numbers are unbelievable, i seriously don't understand how you can do that little with a 567 ilvl.

    Everything said above is pretty much correct, bad dot uptime, bad LnL procs because of it, overuse of arcane shotway over hit and expertise caps, bad trinket.

    He only does 200k (ish) on Thok? Might just wanna replace him unless he is a close friend, he is almost beyond help.

  20. #20
    High Overlord
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    Thank you guys for all the replies, there's a lot of things here that need to be addressed before we continue on Monday. I'll get with our hunter and try to sort things out.
    I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.

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