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  1. #1

    Pvp item level and pve

    I dont understand why it is so hard to make pvp gear be good in both world and instanced pvp?

    Blizzard is saying that pvp ilvl needs to be lower to recognize easier who is raid eligible. But this can be worked easily by just making pvp be dependant totally on pvp stats like pvp power which could work on "lower item levels" but still beat the shit out of pve players in both world and instanced pvp.

    I really dont understand where the difficulty is, just make pvp power good and not counting on itemlvl.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    I really dont understand where the difficulty is, just make pvp power good and not counting on itemlvl.
    Correct me if I'm wrong here, but..

    PvP power is not included in the item level budget, meaning its just a pure bonus stat working only against players.
    In the same fashion pve gear is scaled down in instanced PvP, to make sure PvP gear stays better, PvE gear has higher ilvl to make sure its better in instances/raids than PvP gear is.

    In the open world though, the stats you get from higher ilvl on pve items, outweighs the benefit of pvp power, in turn making pve items better for open world pvp. IIRC they're planning on changing this somewhat in WoD.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandz View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong here, but..

    PvP power is not included in the item level budget, meaning its just a pure bonus stat working only against players.
    In the same fashion pve gear is scaled down in instanced PvP, to make sure PvP gear stays better, PvE gear has higher ilvl to make sure its better in instances/raids than PvP gear is.

    In the open world though, the stats you get from higher ilvl on pve items, outweighs the benefit of pvp power, in turn making pve items better for open world pvp. IIRC they're planning on changing this somewhat in WoD.
    PvP isn't about gear..its about skill

  4. #4
    That is exactly why pvp power needs to be better, I dont understand why pvp power is so bad.

  5. #5
    PvP power isn't part of the item level budget, but if I recall correctly it only works in instanced PvP areas.
    "Clearly every aspect of one's life, from financial stability to social popularity, to sexual prowess can be boiled down to 4 numbers: One's Arena rating" ~ Xandamere

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirayne24 View Post
    PvP power isn't part of the item level budget, but if I recall correctly it only works in instanced PvP areas.
    Nah, it works only against players in both instanced PvP and world.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    That is exactly why pvp power needs to be better, I dont understand why pvp power is so bad.
    PvP power used to be better.. It used to be around 265 for 1%, but is now somewhere around 400 for 1%.
    Why exactly this was nerfed, I'd have to look up. Can't remember why.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandz View Post
    PvP power used to be better.. It used to be around 265 for 1%, but is now somewhere around 400 for 1%.
    Why exactly this was nerfed, I'd have to look up. Can't remember why.
    It was nerfed because the dragon slayer population of wow (which Blizzard listens to more than the PvP pop) cried endlessly about getting messed up in their shiny dragon killing gear. So Blizz does what it always does and goes way overboard "fixing" a problem and now it's slanted way too far in favor of raid gear.

  9. #9
    Blizzard doesnt want people to feel they need to PvP to PvE or even that they need to PvE to PvP. They have done this really well with PvP by scaling down pve gear and bringing it up slowly every week in instanced PvP. Now if they would just do the same with PvP gear in PvE then both PvP and PvE items could be the same iLvL. but meh what do I know.

  10. #10
    If pvp gears power comes from pvp power then there should be zero issue with pve players. If pvp power were THE source of damage and healing, it would be good in pvp but not very good in pve and everyone is happy.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    If pvp gears power comes from pvp power then there should be zero issue with pve players. If pvp power were THE source of damage and healing, it would be good in pvp but not very good in pve and everyone is happy.
    PvP gear is better for PvP because of pvp power yes. The difference is honor gear is 496 and PvE gear now scales to 513? not sure the exact number.

    I just dont know what ilvl 496PVP=5**PVE gear but its getting closer every week.

  12. #12
    Pvp power is not good enough, othwerwise grievous geared would not be defeated by pve heroic geared.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Pvp power is not good enough, othwerwise grievous geared would not be defeated by pve heroic geared.
    If you are out in the world Heroic PVE gear > Grievous. This is do to the huge ilvl difference giving pve'rs more core stats including stamina. Now that resilience is base line they have a lot more effective health to push threw.

    If you are getting defeated in instanced pvp there is a different problem and its not so much gear related.

  14. #14
    The Patient Leefa's Avatar
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    PvP'ers whining that they cannot defeat PvE geared players in an pve enviroment? Nothing new there.
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  15. #15
    Pit Lord Kezotar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leefa View Post
    PvP'ers whining that they cannot defeat PvE geared players in an pve enviroment? Nothing new there.
    We're playing a MMO.. It's about Orc vs Human stretched to aliance vs horde. It's not World of Warcraft - Endless Raiding. Everything outside raids, dungeons and instanced zones is a world area which belongs to both PvE and PvP. Now if PvE players cry over being beaten by PvPers, they can go grab themselves some PvP gear and handle it, as they tell us PvPers.. Go get PvE gear.
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  16. #16
    Prideful gear will be ilv 550, so next season pvp gear will be king again against all but the tiny minute fraction of players sporting full heroic pve gear. As a mainly pvp player I think its fair for heroic gear to shit on everyone, takes infinitely more effort and skill to obtain than 10 games a week. Just cause it says pvp on the gear doesnt mean it should automatically kill everyone

  17. #17
    Why pvp power cant just be so good that even heroic pve geared cant do anything against full pvp gear in outdoor pvp? I cant understand why pvp power is so bad stat, it doesnt count in itemlevel so the ilvl would still be "low" so people recognize its not appropiate pve gear for raid.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Leefa View Post
    PvP'ers whining that they cannot defeat PvE geared players in an pve enviroment? Nothing new there.
    If you think of the outdoors as a PvE enviroment only then you propably should roll on a PvE server.

  19. #19
    Warchief Anzen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anger78 View Post
    It was nerfed because the dragon slayer population of wow (which Blizzard listens to more than the PvP pop) cried endlessly about getting messed up in their shiny dragon killing gear.
    Nailed it! The tears that flooded my eyes after getting 'messed up' by a PvP'er. I'm so glad I went crying to father Blizzard and now I can two shot all the PvP'ers ^^

    OT: They're making next seasons gear 550 item level (between upgraded flex and normal) so you'll be at an advantage against most players in open world PvP (because of PvP power not adding to the item budget). You'll probably still not stand much of a chance against someone in BiS PvE gear, but it won't be a brutal two shot like it is now.

    To be completely honest, I can't say I really condone 'open world PvP' much anyway. It nearly always actually means "huehue gank that guy on 20% hp in combat with a rare - must not forget to pop all cooldowns and bust out my /spit macro's whilst doing it!"
    Last edited by Anzen; 2014-02-05 at 11:45 AM.

  20. #20
    I am Murloc! Baracuda's Avatar
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    I think in the future we might have the same ilevel gear but pvp gear will have 70 strength and 40-50 pvp strength while pve will have 100 strength.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    If pvp gears power comes from pvp power then there should be zero issue with pve players. If pvp power were THE source of damage and healing, it would be good in pvp but not very good in pve and everyone is happy.
    Sure but then PvE shouldn't be very good for PvP either. Many PvPers do casual PvP and dailies so their gear has to work for PvE too.
    Last edited by Baracuda; 2014-02-05 at 11:48 AM.
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