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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    There's a reason most new games have tutorial modes that include even the simplest things as wasd control schemes because they have to assume the lowest common denominator which is someone who has never, ever played a game before. Being forced through this as an experienced player is horrible, which is why better games have optional tutorials. WoW has failed at providing adequate player instruction for years. People who complain like you do are likely people who also complain that everyone is bad in the game. Well guess what...the more intuitive the game is, the higher the capability of the LCD.

    How would you expect someone who has never played an MMO or WoW to know what a dungeon or scenario even is. How would they know where to queue for it? There's a reason leveling now provides pop ups of everything unlocked, followed by explanations when you look at these features (that glow yellow now). It is educational. Rift has even integrated video tutorials on how to use their features and game systems. It's innovative and a job well done on their part.
    I remember when I started playing, I was a noob, and someone told me about thottbot, I figured things out for my own... An MMO really isn't a hard thing to figure out.
    Have you never been to a friends house and they say "here play this" and you get the controller like "fuck how do I move" it takes a minute, but you get it eventually.

    You're insulting peoples intelligence saying they need help with something so simple. "I really liked that tutorial, it was fun and needed" - said no one ever

    Anyway, you guys aren't even on topic

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    How fast was HC Rag killed, and how much preparation needed for it?
    Patch 4.2 was released on 28/06/2011. Paragon downed Ragna on 19/07/2011. So about three weeks. However, Heroic Ragnaros took 500+ wipes to Paragon to nail down. Do not tell me that is even remotely comparable to classic Ragnaros.

    Heck, they even provided a video of the original classic Ragnaros kill: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Br1hXGXJ7Tg
    Now let's see Paragon's video of Heroic Ragnaros: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ez1pRo1sywY
    Clearly, a rogue standing there and spamming SS and SnD takes much more imba skills.

    BC/LK raider ('07-'10)

  3. #63
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreadNeos View Post
    You're insulting peoples intelligence saying they need help with something so simple. "I really liked that tutorial, it was fun and needed" - said no one ever
    You completely misunderstand the point. It's not insulting someone's intelligence to provide them adequate resources to learn however they need to. And you are actually completely wrong about many points considering game devs have knowledge on the matter and you don't. Plenty of people think the tutorials are useful and take advantage of them. They also hear complaints about it. What is insulting is people imprinting their 'so high skilled nature' on the general gaming public and thinking that's ok. Same reason why our public school system and standardized testing are so effed up. This thread is heading for the trash can with the levels of ignorance it has.
    BAD WOLF

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by jimlow View Post
    This is a terrible idea and you should feel bad for even suggesting it.
    but WHY is it a bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by undercovergnome View Post
    i have never understood why blizzard dont run a realm for each expansion, like 1 per region per old expansion, a vanilla, a tbc, and a wrath, they could do 6month races, and award prizes to the most geared, most progressed, most played etc, people would like that
    I could maybe see this too

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    You don't understand that the concept of Angry Birds isn't to 'push one button' which in itself is completely inaccurate anyways, but yeah...you don't get how trajectories and understanding force relations to objects in a game world (game physics, hello) is what is going on in your brain behind the scenes? So essentially you are being intentionally wrong, in order to facilitate WoW bashing. I'm not surprised.I don't expect you to be able to put yourself in anyone else's shoes from the high horse you are on, but let's try anyways! While we figured it out for ourselves, or let the smarter people do it for us, a game isn't succeeding if it isn't communicating the rules and tools it operates by. In theory, you can't even play a game if you don't know the rules. You aren't playing checkers if you don't know how to move the pieces. Chess is only chess because of how the pieces can move.

    There's a reason most new games have tutorial modes that include even the simplest things as wasd control schemes because they have to assume the lowest common denominator which is someone who has never, ever played a game before. Being forced through this as an experienced player is horrible, which is why better games have optional tutorials. WoW has failed at providing adequate player instruction for years. People who complain like you do are likely people who also complain that everyone is bad in the game. Well guess what...the more intuitive the game is, the higher the capability of the LCD.

    How would you expect someone who has never played an MMO or WoW to know what a dungeon or scenario even is. How would they know where to queue for it? There's a reason leveling now provides pop ups of everything unlocked, followed by explanations when you look at these features (that glow yellow now). It is educational. Rift has even integrated video tutorials on how to use their features and game systems. It's innovative and a job well done on their part.
    Stop being so hostile, I'm not trying to take your home from you, we're just having a conversation. I wouldn't agree with you when you say that the game does a bad job of communicating its rules. Popups happen for a very longtime and blizzard even puts your spells on your bar for you until level 10 now. If you're someone who has never played an MMO and you pick up WoW, it's just naive to expect that they market their tutorial to someone who has never touched a computer before because that's the minority of new players coming in. And again, I have no problem with tutorials, I never have. I'm talking about the hand holding they get when they're at max level. You're no longer a new player at max level.

  6. #66
    at OP

    Sounds like a very personal, me-centerd, list. I wouldnt want ANY of those changes. None. Here's my list:

    1. LFR, Ordos, Celestial should be farmable for me and no one else (no weekly reset)
    2. A potion of invincibility and x1000000 damage for soloing current heroic content, you know for titles
    3. Bonus 10,000 gold for every dungeon run, boss fight, heroic. Of course I'm the only one who gets it, because I wouldnt want to wreck the economy, I just want to dominate it.
    4. Warlock should be able to tank and heal
    5. Any ally ganking me should serve a 20 ban

    Think that'll do it.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    You completely misunderstand the point. It's not insulting someone's intelligence to provide them adequate resources to learn however they need to. And you are actually completely wrong about many points considering game devs have knowledge on the matter and you don't. Plenty of people think the tutorials are useful and take advantage of them. They also hear complaints about it. What is insulting is people imprinting their 'so high skilled nature' on the general gaming public and thinking that's ok. Same reason why our public school system and standardized testing are so effed up. This thread is heading for the trash can with the levels of ignorance it has.
    It's not high-skilled nature, I'm not a very 'talented' player, but I'll be damned if I'm not going to figure something out/try my best. There are A LOT of reasons our school systems are fucked up. I think you are being a hypocrite; you act like you know everything and say everyone is ignorant. Your theories are hit and miss, you're not even staying on the threads topic either.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by undercovergnome View Post
    i have never understood why blizzard dont run a realm for each expansion, like 1 per region per old expansion, a vanilla, a tbc, and a wrath, they could do 6month races, and award prizes to the most geared, most progressed, most played etc, people would like that
    Even without the races it would still please many people.
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  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by DDKingg View Post
    at OP

    Sounds like a very personal, me-centerd, list. I wouldnt want ANY of those changes. None. Here's my list:

    1. LFR, Ordos, Celestial should be farmable for me and no one else (no weekly reset)
    2. A potion of invincibility and x1000000 damage for soloing current heroic content, you know for titles
    3. Bonus 10,000 gold for every dungeon run, boss fight, heroic. Of course I'm the only one who gets it, because I wouldnt want to wreck the economy, I just want to dominate it.
    4. Warlock should be able to tank and heal
    5. Any ally ganking me should serve a 20 ban

    Think that'll do it.
    Hahaha, I enjoyed that. Maybe it's partly selfish. I just want the chance to go back and earn what I didn't have the opportunity to, I'm not getting special treatment and I thought of it in a way that I thought would make the game better and other people might enjoy too.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Wow will become easier and simplistic with each expansion. Blizzard seems to be catering to the angry bird generation and only cares about money and not true gaming.

    I mean seriously. Who the hell needs a guide from level 1-10? Are you kidding me? Not to the mention that the Blue that posted in the comments section is arrogant enought to say that new people need help. Oh my God...

    The best way to play an MMO is to find things for yourself and explore. Not sit in the main city and press one button from level 1 to 90.
    Oh my god. Well said that I'm thinking of making this as my new sig. I was laughing my ass off on why did they make such a guide for one of the easiest starting areas in the game that could be done easily in 20-30mins. The thing that gripped me to WoW earlier was the thrill and the need for exploration which created immersiveness which is also something rare to see nowadays.

    OT; Why seperate people even more just for the sake of nostalgia? Sure people might like it but after awhile these realms will be nothing but a ghost town when people get bored. Just tune the game back to it's vanilla/bc glory days without bringing the old things back and letting people forced to do them or so.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by enchanted View Post

    OT; Why seperate people even more just for the sake of nostalgia? Sure people might like it but after awhile these realms will be nothing but a ghost town when people get bored. Just tune the game back to it's vanilla/bc glory days without bringing the old things back and letting people forced to do them or so.
    We all know this will never happen, too many people will whine about how hard it is.
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  12. #72
    [QUOTE=Xilurm;25434164]Yeah last night I pressed one button and I killed the last boss of this expansion. Umm, you were saying?

    Yeah, back in the day me and 14 other ppl defeated 40 man raids while 25 others were AFK. umm, you were saying?

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Phaty View Post

    Yeah, back in the day me and 14 other ppl defeated 40 man raids while 25 others were AFK. umm, you were saying?
    Unless you were all level 70 then I don't think so.
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  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    We all know this will never happen, too many people will whine about how hard it is.
    I think with the right amount of balance it could happen next expansion. LFR/normal for casuals or people that don't play hardcore and Mythic for hardcore players. I do think though that the mechanics are better nowadays than before and that things are more balanced than in 'vanilla' where you had to bring that class just for its special ability such as buffing or dispelling etc...

  15. #75
    The Lightbringer Toffie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Unless you were all level 70 then I don't think so.
    Not to burst your buble, but WoW have only become harder by each expansion.
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  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toffie View Post
    Not to burst your buble, but WoW have only become harder by each expansion.
    For the 10% or so hardcore raiders apparently.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by DreadNeos View Post
    snip
    In the end it would split the community and the reality is that most likely after a short while you wouldn't have the manpower on your classic realms to form 40mans. BG and arena Ques would be extremely long and eventually the population would dwindle even more.

    Sure Blizz could make a classic realm (meaning everything from vanilla unlocked). And it would be entertaining until you've beaten KT. This would probably take people ~6 months ... and then what? Farm T3 forever?

  18. #78
    The Lightbringer Toffie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by enchanted View Post
    For the 10% or so hardcore raiders apparently.
    Well yeah.
    But if I see someone who keeps going on about how the game have gotten easier, then I expect them to have cleared all the heroic bosses.
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  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Unless you were all level 70 then I don't think so.
    umm, i do think so. plus we raided all the way through naxx with raid chat, no VoIP. i dont know if it was your server or not, but vanilla was extremelly accesible on mine. regular pugs on the weekends for ZG, MC, BWL, AQ20 and the first few bosses in AQ40. hell, when naxx released, people who saved up for their keys were pugging trash and the first few bosses in each wing

    - - - Updated - - -

    the point im getting at, is the game was never as hard as you think it was. there were alot of either a) bad players or b) people didnt know what they were doing they. it was mostly a mix of both. as the player base has gotten better, mechanics have gotten more complex. if you take most players with the skill they had in vanilla and throw them in wrath-cata. they wouldn't get past 3 bosses. LFR bosses are more complex than vanilla

  20. #80
    Mechagnome Tripz's Avatar
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    This thread is soon to be locked (I'm surprised it's gone on this long actually, come on mods)

    The OP presented some bad ideas, maybe once you get to max level you could get an option to xfer realms which you can hold on to until you are ready.

    Anyway, stop whining at each other and throwing tantrums people. Vanilla wasn't "hard" it was just grindy and some bosses hit really hard, keep in mind that the game was still newish back then so people hadn't had a chance to adapt to gameplay like nowadays. Quests pretty much teach us everything we need to know now, and things get increasingly more challenging so when we overcome a hurdle it becomes simple. Hard to explain, sorry if it doesn't make sense
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    I hear in order to get the browser attunement, you first had to run heroic Internet.

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