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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTirri View Post
    I've been thinking about rets finisher-situation and started wondering if Inquisition would serve better as a holy-dmg dot on the target instead of a passive buff. That would make it less of a "i have to keep it up or my dps will suffer" and more of a "I'm doing damage!" kinda deal while maintaining q modicum of "complexity" in our rotation. Sure, it would hurt our aoe/cleave, but thats already in a good place. Also, it might even offer an actual choice in sustained cleave-situations, we might wanna multi-dot with inq instead of just spamming DS
    Are you just randomly suggesting this? Because it sounds to me that you've given this no thought whatsoever.

    I like the concept though. Something like:

    Inquisition is turned into a debuff on targets. It hits every target around you (8 yards or something) and applies a dot on everything hit.
    You can then activate the skill again to absorb all of the debuffs, gaining the current inquisition buff for x seconds (x=base value*mobs absorbed).

    Think something like this:
    Scenario 1: Single Target. In this situation you want to have the inquisition on yourself
    Scenario 2: 4+ Mobs. In this situation you want to have the inquisition debuff on your 4 targets.


    If it had to be a cooldown, they'd either need to buff inquisition and make you unable to have 100% uptime to compensate (Think Tiger's Fury for ferals sort of style) or the cooldown would have to be short in order for the debuff to be useful for aoe (Think galakras waves. Imagine if it could not be up or every wave).

  2. #142
    Iterating a little more on DonTirri's idea, Inquisition could be a self-buff that builds as you spend Holy Power, that you can then trigger to boost the next attack you hit. So normally you let it build up to whatever max stacks, pop it for your finisher, but towards the end of a fight/if a mob/group of mobs is dying there may be some merit in popping the Inq 'early' for less max damage but more useful damage.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by KurenaiXIII View Post
    Iterating a little more on DonTirri's idea, Inquisition could be a self-buff that builds as you spend Holy Power, that you can then trigger to boost the next attack you hit. So normally you let it build up to whatever max stacks, pop it for your finisher, but towards the end of a fight/if a mob/group of mobs is dying there may be some merit in popping the Inq 'early' for less max damage but more useful damage.
    So it would be a bit like tiger eye brew?
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  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    So it would be a bit like tiger eye brew?
    I guess? Unfortunately I haven't done nearly anything with monk so I'm not really familiar with the way Tigereye Brew works. If our base damage were compensated for without having Inq and Inq becomes a booster I wouldn't mind having one more button to push.

  5. #145
    How about:

    "Your Crusader Strike, Hammer of the Righteous, Exorcism and Hammer of Wrath stack Inquisition on targets hit, increasing Holy damage taken by 5% per stack for 30 seconds. Activate Inquisitor's Vengeance to consume the stacks on your current target to increase your total damage done by [(sum_stacks*5%] and critical strike chance by [sum_stacks*2%] for 15 seconds."

    It would need balancing to make it worth-while activating Inquisitor's Vengeance though.
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  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    How about:

    "Your Crusader Strike, Hammer of the Righteous, Exorcism and Hammer of Wrath stack Inquisition on targets hit, increasing Holy damage taken by 5% per stack for 30 seconds. Activate Inquisitor's Vengeance to consume the stacks on your current target to increase your total damage done by [(sum_stacks*5%] and critical strike chance by [sum_stacks*2%] for 15 seconds."

    It would need balancing to make it worth-while activating Inquisitor's Vengeance though.


    Incredibly OP for any council/cleave fight. You'd have 100% uptime of Vengeance as well as them taking increasing holy damage from debuffs. You could easily have 3x5 stacks up at a time.

    If it soaked stacks from all targets, it would need a cap and as such would be useless to activate.

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by etsumii92 View Post
    Incredibly OP for any council/cleave fight. You'd have 100% uptime of Vengeance as well as them taking increasing holy damage from debuffs. You could easily have 3x5 stacks up at a time.

    If it soaked stacks from all targets, it would need a cap and as such would be useless to activate.
    I was thinking maybe prevent Inquisition stacks from applying during Vengeance?
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  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    I was thinking maybe prevent Inquisition stacks from applying during Vengeance?
    You'd still have existing stacks out there. Imagine having 10 mobs out there fully stacked through exo glyph/Hotr, then pop this, pop cds and divine storm.

    Besides the point. It'd be much stronger than the current inquisition, and that's not really something we need right now.

  9. #149
    The idea I had was to change Inq from a boring (as most seem to classify it) passive that buffs your damage, into something that actually DOES damage. Yeah, sure it would only be useful for mobs that live long, but then again, who bothers to keep inq up at trash? I personally dont mind inq, but if it was a ST dot that hits hard, it wouldn't feel so... Well boring to pop inq.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTirri View Post
    The idea I had was to change Inq from a boring (as most seem to classify it) passive that buffs your damage, into something that actually DOES damage. Yeah, sure it would only be useful for mobs that live long, but then again, who bothers to keep inq up at trash? I personally dont mind inq, but if it was a ST dot that hits hard, it wouldn't feel so... Well boring to pop inq.
    I'm pretty hardcore about keeping inq up, myself. I get what you want but essentially you're replacing TV/DS as a finisher, which I don't think we need. I'd rather see TV just hit hard enough without Inq. To some extent any ability that we use rotationally is going to become 'just a button we hit' unless everything becomes based on reacting to procs.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTirri View Post
    The idea I had was to change Inq from a boring (as most seem to classify it) passive that buffs your damage, into something that actually DOES damage. Yeah, sure it would only be useful for mobs that live long, but then again, who bothers to keep inq up at trash? I personally dont mind inq, but if it was a ST dot that hits hard, it wouldn't feel so... Well boring to pop inq.
    Who doesn't keep inq up during trash? It's 3 globals --> 1 button and should last though most of the trash. That kind of logic is just silly.

    If inq was changed into a strong ST dot, you'd simply be benched for any cleave/aoe fight during progress.

    I mean, arguing that inq should be fun and do damage is like arguing about a boss mechanic being boring. If you can't sit on a boss 100%, is that fight boring/broken and need change?

  12. #152
    Getting sat out from aoe/cleave fights is not a good argument either, since we're already badly hurting on ST-department, and if Blizz retains a similar design philosophy they had in SoO (i.e aoe/cleave is mainly meterpadding/nice to habe but not mandatory and ST matters most, prime examples being spoils, paragons, garrosh, siegecrafter and shamans if melee etc) then more ST at the expense of cleave is a fair trade imo.

  13. #153
    The Patient Monoroth's Avatar
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    All these suggestions to make inq gameplay interesting and exciting have a good potential, but i think most of them lack one part of current inq gameplay which is fast target switching. If you lok at SoO boses almost every fight has some add which you need to nuke within secs. With current model we'r one of the best specs on quick target switch fights as we barely lose anything while switching. Most of inq changes that were suggested are focusing on building/stacking dots on target, just remember how much rogues want ret style of hopo for combo points and some of these changes are bringing us closer to one part of rogue gameplay and problems.

    While suggestions above look promising for single target it may suffer on mass aoe packs unless we'r fighting windlord where inq could tick for full duration. I think they should keep current model of inq or bake it in.
    Damn its anoying to type so much from phone, appologies for bad typos.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTirri View Post
    Getting sat out from aoe/cleave fights is not a good argument either, since we're already badly hurting on ST-department, and if Blizz retains a similar design philosophy they had in SoO (i.e aoe/cleave is mainly meterpadding/nice to habe but not mandatory and ST matters most, prime examples being spoils, paragons, garrosh, siegecrafter and shamans if melee etc) then more ST at the expense of cleave is a fair trade imo.
    The cleave/aoe we have make up for our single target dps (which btw is not as horrible as people make it out to be). Removing Inquisition from aoe (more than 30% of aoe. Factor in Crit) to increase single target would have to be a big enough buff to make us worth it single target and single target only. If that was the case, why would you not stack ret paladins where single target matters?

    If our single target was buffed to that point, we'd be considered broken. That is why I think it's a bad idea.

  15. #155
    The more I think about it, the more I think Inquisition can't be made 'fun' and 'dynamic' and retain its current role of damage-booster--either it's non-rotational and therefore unreliable or it takes over another position in the toolkit (i.e. finisher), as DonTirri is suggesting (if I am reading what he's writing correctly.)

    Right now I don't think Inq is in a bad place; if the duration-extension glyph were baked in and activating Inquisition early added to the duration instead of overwriting it, I'd be mostly happy.

  16. #156
    Stood in the Fire Zabannith's Avatar
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    There's nothing wrong with Inq , it's not going anywhere, The only thing I can see Blizz doing to it to change it is , making it have a refresh mechanic similar to an assassination rogue with envenom refreshing it so you put it up onceThen more or less forget it unless you have down times in the fight and cannot refresh it with whatever ability they choose to make refresh it

    - - - Updated - - -

    They could even tie it into our art of war procs , "when your art of war activates , it also refreshes the duration of your inquisition to its 3 HP maximum"
    but that's more or less use it once and forget it , because who honestly doesn't get an art of war proc every minute?

    Maybe "your art of war procs add 10 seconds to the duration of your inquisition " , but if this was to be done I'd like to see inquisitions duration to go back to 30 seconds , this way you still have to watch it , if you're unlucky and don't get an art of war proc in 30 seconds you'd still have to reapply inquisition , if you do get and art of war proc awesome , you got another 10 seconds where you don't have to watch it and to hope you get another art of war proc .

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also guys I need help finding all the info you can so I can put it in the OP
    Last edited by Zabannith; 2014-02-28 at 03:54 PM.

    New Ability: Renounce. When cast, Renounce permanently changes the Paladin into a Warrior.

  17. #157
    // snip

    Anyway, away from Inquisition. I really hope our Final Verdict talent stays. I fear that it might be too over the top, but I'm sure we could come to an agreement if something else would have to be nerfed slightly.

    Divine Storm - It'd be nice to have our old animation (better: particle effects) back, now that Blizz wants to tune down the effects of other raid members for oneself.

    Hm... right now nothing else comes to mind.

    Edit: Inquisition apparently gone.?
    Last edited by Kelemar; 2014-02-28 at 04:48 PM.

  18. #158
    Stood in the Fire Zabannith's Avatar
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    updated op with racial's that apply to us

    New Ability: Renounce. When cast, Renounce permanently changes the Paladin into a Warrior.

  19. #159
    Herald of the Titans Lovestar's Avatar
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    CTTC is only fun because you have 2 other specs that keep up S&D, so Mut having CTTC makes it feel special and different. Even then it's on the chopping block for WoD (confirmed), with S&D just stripped from Mut completely (or baked in) since they view CTTC as pointless (making people bind S&D, but only pressing it if something 'goes wrong' and it drops after the initial up).

    If they were going to put Inq on a CTTC mechanic it would basically be the death of Inq at this point in WoW's design. The Shred/Rip mechanic is more interesting, with finishers or Exo or whatever extending the duration of Inq. I actually like that idea.

    Inq at one minute is honestly inane, it's at the "Why is this here?" point and in fact, is fairly similar to CTTC — put it up once, then forget you have the binding. A 20-30s duration that gets extended by 6-10s per finisher (capping at 30s) would at least add something dynamic and engaging to it.

    Buuuuuut we all know how well it turned out giving Ret players a short-duration Inq that required attention/upkeep effort. At this point Blizz does seem on the verge of just writing it off (which they practically did already with the 1m duration).

  20. #160
    Think the most interesting thing that could come of Inq is the Feral Druid mechanic, where you can cast it with no HoPo. Other than that the spell is fine, specially at 1m.

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