6.0 Paladin Discussion and Speculation (All Specs)

[Zabannith]

There's nothing wrong with Inq , it's not going anywhere, The only thing I can see Blizz doing to it to change it is , making it have a refresh mechanic similar to an assassination rogue with envenom refreshing it so you put it up onceThen more or less forget it unless you have down times in the fight and cannot refresh it with whatever ability they choose to make refresh it

- - - Updated - - -

They could even tie it into our art of war procs , "when your art of war activates , it also refreshes the duration of your inquisition to its 3 HP maximum"
but that's more or less use it once and forget it , because who honestly doesn't get an art of war proc every minute?

Maybe "your art of war procs add 10 seconds to the duration of your inquisition " , but if this was to be done I'd like to see inquisitions duration to go back to 30 seconds , this way you still have to watch it , if you're unlucky and don't get an art of war proc in 30 seconds you'd still have to reapply inquisition , if you do get and art of war proc awesome , you got another 10 seconds where you don't have to watch it and to hope you get another art of war proc .

- - - Updated - - -

Also guys I need help finding all the info you can so I can put it in the OP

[Kelemar]

// snip

Anyway, away from Inquisition. I really hope our Final Verdict talent stays. I fear that it might be too over the top, but I'm sure we could come to an agreement if something else would have to be nerfed slightly.

Divine Storm - It'd be nice to have our old animation (better: particle effects) back, now that Blizz wants to tune down the effects of other raid members for oneself.

Hm... right now nothing else comes to mind.

Edit: Inquisition apparently gone.?

[Zabannith]

updated op with racial's that apply to us

[Lovestar]

CTTC is only fun because you have 2 other specs that keep up S&D, so Mut having CTTC makes it feel special and different. Even then it's on the chopping block for WoD (confirmed), with S&D just stripped from Mut completely (or baked in) since they view CTTC as pointless (making people bind S&D, but only pressing it if something 'goes wrong' and it drops after the initial up).

If they were going to put Inq on a CTTC mechanic it would basically be the death of Inq at this point in WoW's design. The Shred/Rip mechanic is more interesting, with finishers or Exo or whatever extending the duration of Inq. I actually like that idea.

Inq at one minute is honestly inane, it's at the "Why is this here?" point and in fact, is fairly similar to CTTC — put it up once, then forget you have the binding. A 20-30s duration that gets extended by 6-10s per finisher (capping at 30s) would at least add something dynamic and engaging to it.

Buuuuuut we all know how well it turned out giving Ret players a short-duration Inq that required attention/upkeep effort. At this point Blizz does seem on the verge of just writing it off (which they practically did already with the 1m duration).

[Xs]

Think the most interesting thing that could come of Inq is the Feral Druid mechanic, where you can cast it with no HoPo. Other than that the spell is fine, specially at 1m.

[KurenaiXIII]

CTTC is only fun because you have 2 other specs that keep up S&D, so Mut having CTTC makes it feel special and different. Even then it's on the chopping block for WoD (confirmed), with S&D just stripped from Mut completely (or baked in) since they view CTTC as pointless (making people bind S&D, but only pressing it if something 'goes wrong' and it drops after the initial up).

If they were going to put Inq on a CTTC mechanic it would basically be the death of Inq at this point in WoW's design. The Shred/Rip mechanic is more interesting, with finishers or Exo or whatever extending the duration of Inq. I actually like that idea.

Inq at one minute is honestly inane, it's at the "Why is this here?" point and in fact, is fairly similar to CTTC — put it up once, then forget you have the binding. A 20-30s duration that gets extended by 6-10s per finisher (capping at 30s) would at least add something dynamic and engaging to it.

Buuuuuut we all know how well it turned out giving Ret players a short-duration Inq that required attention/upkeep effort. At this point Blizz does seem on the verge of just writing it off (which they practically did already with the 1m duration).

I'm not sure a return to old-style Inq is a great idea. Even if HP generation isn't as painful as it was then, pressing the button more often doesn't make it more interesting.

[Zabannith]

well some ppl are saying inq is gone , but i have yet to see a blue post stating this , IF it was gutted, there'd better be some changes to ret because it would literally be 4 button priority spec with nothing else to do or even try to maintain , not to mention all our dmg would need to reworked and then there's the fact that final verdict without inq will only hit as hard as tv does now most likely , guess rets will be seal twisting after all in wod?

[Kelemar]

well some ppl are saying inq is gone , but i have yet to see a blue post stating this , IF it was gutted, there'd better be some changes to ret because it would literally be 4 button priority spec with nothing else to do or even try to maintain , not to mention all our dmg would need to reworked and then there's the fact that final verdict without inq will only hit as hard as tv does now most likely , guess rets will be seal twisting after all in wod?

Just saw some people claim it as well. I have never seen any mention of this though either. Hopefully, Inq stays!

[Zabannith]

Well ...looks like more nails in the coffin for Inquisition.....too bad I liked it and it was what separated the good from great rets

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I got a feeling they'll be replacing it with something. That tweet isn't really telling much.

[Zabannith]

I honestly don't see a problem with it , build on it sure , but remove it an replace it with something else...when there's nothing wrong with it? sounds redundant to me.
Really what could they replace it with that will fill the same role as inq?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I honestly don't see a problem with it , build on it sure , but remove it an replace it with something else...when there's nothing wrong with it? sounds redundant to me.
Really what could they replace it with that will fill the same role as inq?

It's still kinda problematic. Yeah it pushed a gap showing who were the skilfull players are but..I'm not sure how that has to be involved in gameplay. I mean I like the name of a spell Inquisition. I would of preferred it be a passive or be something else.


Oh and I forgot. It's annoying to keep up in PVP.

[Zabannith]

See, I don't have the mindset that its a maintenance buff, (this is what it is yes , but I look at it differently)
I ask the people who have an issue with Inq ..do you have a problem with Goak or AW? no? because they are dps cds that make you do more dps? ...well guess what Inq is the same damned thing .. its a 30% holy dmg increase with a 1 min cd nothing more nothing less ..

Honestly if you have a problem with Inq because its a chore to push when its off cd , then you should have the same problem with Goak and AW oh and ES too because they are all the same they are abilities you push as soon as they are off cd to get the most bang for your buck .(except for the odd occasion where you delay AW to line up with Goak )

[smendou]

See, I don't have the mindset that its a maintenance buff, (this is what it is yes , but I look at it differently)
I ask the people who have an issue with Inq ..do you have a problem with Goak or AW? no? because they are dps cds that make you do more dps? ...well guess what Inq is the same damned thing .. its a 30% holy dmg increase with a 1 min cd nothing more nothing less ..

Issue most have with it I would imagine is that you don't "see" that 30% increase so to speak. When you hit TV or DS you see pretty damage numbers pop up. Are they buffed by Inq? Sure. But there is delayed gratification versus instant gratification with the damage finishers. Now if the game gave numbers in a way that showed how much of a hit was due to Inq, it might be different. But to a good many I'd say it just doesn't feel rewarding. As to your comparison with AW / GoAK? What is the opportunity cost of using AW/GoAK? Hitting whatever button they are macro'd too? Whereas, to put up Inq you are giving up seeing those damage numbers for a few more seconds.

I don't really have a strong opinion on it going or staying myself as its become more or less autopilot when to refresh it.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

See, I don't have the mindset that its a maintenance buff, (this is what it is yes , but I look at it differently)
I ask the people who have an issue with Inq ..do you have a problem with Goak or AW? no? because they are dps cds that make you do more dps? ...well guess what Inq is the same damned thing .. its a 30% holy dmg increase with a 1 min cd nothing more nothing less ..

Honestly if you have a problem with Inq because its a chore to push when its off cd , then you should have the same problem with Goak and AW oh and ES too because they are all the same they are abilities you push as soon as they are off cd to get the most bang for your buck .(except for the odd occasion where you delay AW to line up with Goak )

Except Avenging Wrath is a CD and not a maintenance buff. Blessing Of Ancient Kings is a CD is well and not a maintenance buff. That and you can macro(I don't really do this cause I'm not a fan of the mindset) Blessing of Ancient Kings, Avenging Wrath and(If you chose Holy Avenger) Holy Avenger.


Honestly I'm not sure how one can not see the difference.

[Zabannith]

Issue most have with it I would imagine is that you don't "see" that 30% increase so to speak.

Sure you "See" the numbers , run any fight for the full duration without using INQ and I can say with 100% certainty that you will "see" the difference

As for when you hit Inq "you are giving up seeing those damage numbers for a few more seconds." , sure for a couple seconds, but that dmg that you'd have done by hitting TV instead of Inq will more than be made up for and then some over the duration of the 60 seconds Inq is up.

Who cares if it's not instant gratification? it's more dmg over the long run than just using TV plain and simple .

- - - Updated - - -

Except Avenging Wrath is a CD and not a maintenance buff. Blessing Of Ancient Kings is a CD is well and not a maintenance buff. That and you can macro(I don't really do this cause I'm not a fan of the mindset) Blessing of Ancient Kings, Avenging Wrath and(If you chose Holy Avenger) Holy Avenger.


Honestly I'm not sure how one can not see the difference.

Think of it this way , be patient with me here , sure Inq has no "cooldown" like Aw and Goak .. however why would you refresh it at 30 seconds? or 45? or even 50? everybody refreshes it at 58-59 seconds effectively giving the spell a 1 min cd , that's why and how I see it as a dmg cd

- - - Updated - - -

I mean really would people see the spell differently if it read like this? " Inquisition : 3hp 60 second cooldown , Increases all holy dmg you do by 30% for 60 seconds"
does the same thing .. but now its a dps CD you use it when its off cd....

[Felspark]

Well ...looks like more nails in the coffin for Inquisition.....too bad I liked it and it was what separated the good from great rets

Is that a joke?

How does refreshing a one minute snooze button separate a good from a great ret paladin? Every ret paladin knows you refresh this, especially if they have CoC Ret. This statement is like suggesting only great hunters remember to use their pets. It's a part of our game play. Sorry, but this statement made me chuckle.

[Krekko]

See, I don't have the mindset that its a maintenance buff, (this is what it is yes , but I look at it differently)
I ask the people who have an issue with Inq ..do you have a problem with Goak or AW? no? because they are dps cds that make you do more dps? ...well guess what Inq is the same damned thing .. its a 30% holy dmg increase with a 1 min cd nothing more nothing less ..

Honestly if you have a problem with Inq because its a chore to push when its off cd , then you should have the same problem with Goak and AW oh and ES too because they are all the same they are abilities you push as soon as they are off cd to get the most bang for your buck .(except for the odd occasion where you delay AW to line up with Goak )

To be clear, before going forward, I don't want Inq to be baked in, and I don't want it to just disappear. If it goes anywhere, I want it to be replaced by a more dynamic and complex system with some form of decision making involved in it's use, just something more than Max uptime.

That said, with the comparison to GoAK, AW and such, the question is "why more of the same, then?", why not just make everything a +Damage on use. Then, in turn, AW with SW modifies your rotation slightly, you often want to try and wait and match up your use of spells around GoAK and ES, with Inq it's just plain "hit as close to every minute as humanly possible". It's not a chore, it's just that it doesn't offer much, and we already have stuff to do "press to increase DPS". Doesn't need to go away as much as it needs to be built and expanded upon, once again, solely my opinion.

I guess I just feel it's a copout for a "complexity" factor, one that could be better placed.

[Zabannith]

To be clear, before going forward, I don't want Inq to be baked in, and I don't want it to just disappear. If it goes anywhere, I want it to be replaced by a more dynamic and complex system with some form of decision making involved in it's use, just something more than Max uptime.

That said, with the comparison to GoAK, AW and such, the question is "why more of the same, then?", why not just make everything a +Damage on use. Then, in turn, AW with SW modifies your rotation slightly, you often want to try and wait and match up your use of spells around GoAK and ES, with Inq it's just plain "hit as close to every minute as humanly possible". It's not a chore, it's just that it doesn't offer much, and we already have stuff to do "press to increase DPS". Doesn't need to go away as much as it needs to be built and expanded upon, once again, solely my opinion.

I guess I just feel it's a copout for a "complexity" factor, one that could be better placed.

Well personally Id rather have a more complex inq than we have as well , however , I don't want to loose it just because the majority of people it seems like (both here and on the blizz forums) cant be bothered to hit what is essentially a dps cd every min when its off cd

- - - Updated - - -

I personally would love to see some interaction between Inq and art of war procs , how about " while your inquisition is active , if your art of war procs , all HP generators will give 2 hp instead of 1 for x seconds"

or like i mentioned earlier in the post

Maybe "your art of war procs add 10 seconds to the duration of your inquisition " , but if this was to be done I'd like to see inquisitions duration to go back to 30 seconds , this way you still have to watch it , if you're unlucky and don't get an art of war proc in 30 seconds you'd still have to reapply inquisition , if you do get and art of war proc awesome , you got another 10 seconds where you don't have to watch it and to hope you get another art of war proc .

[Krekko]

- - - Updated - - -



Think of it this way , be patient with me here , sure Inq has no "cooldown" like Aw and Goak .. however why would you refresh it at 30 seconds? or 45? or even 50? everybody refreshes it at 58-59 seconds effectively giving the spell a 1 min cd , that's why and how I see it as a dmg cd

- - - Updated - - -

I mean really would people see the spell differently if it read like this? " Inquisition : 3hp 60 second cooldown , Increases all holy dmg you do by 30% for 60 seconds"
does the same thing .. but now its a dps CD you use it when its off cd....

People would have the same exact problem as they do now if it was a 60 second CD 60 Second buff spell....

It equates to at the end of the day, being just another, rather bland spell. Doesn't offer much for the players, and leaves a lot to be desired. It's not like they are not well aware enough of the DPS benefit it offers them, it's just that for them it doesn't flow. Opinions in the end.

I honestly think people just want it to be more engaging rather than gone.