Death Knight Mobility PVP & PVE

[Mr. Casual]

this is a problem i have had with dks which why i dont roll one anymore. WE have shit mobility but because of other tools like being able to always break CC and decent ranged damage we can not have mobility.

[PuppetShowJustice]

Trim the mobility from HUNTERS!

I really have no trouble sealing kills on proper casters as a DK. Hell, Death Knights practically eat Warlocks for breakfast.

It's hunters with their insane mobility, control, AND damage AND CC AND immunity effects AND a CD reset that need the "toning down."

You know that old joke about Rock saying that Paper is OP but Scissors are fine? Your post is literally that.

Also, what CD reset? Readiness was removed several patches ago.

[nyc81991]

I disagree with the idea that our ranged damage makes up for it. In fact, Enhance shamans have the best ranged melee, ranged interrupt, far more mobility. And our ranged damage is just simply not that strong. I have yet to see a dk range kill anything in high end pvp. I'm not talking random bgs. It's so simple to just kill a noob with a few HB/DC and say "Man our range is good." But that does not hold true in Arenas/RBGS.

Furthermore. Every Melee has a gap closer, and multiple iterations of it. We have 1. 1 that is easily escaped at that. If the argument that Chains makes up for this all, I humbly disagree. And hell, remove chains. The only reason we are brought is due to NS to kill healers. That's it. If there is no healer on the team we are sub par.

Every Melee has a gap closer? Ret Paladins have 0 gap closers.

[Huckfealing]

Every Melee has a gap closer? Ret Paladins have 0 gap closers.

Burst of Speed/ Long arm of Justice, Range stun come to mind.

[Kaleredar]

I guess since dk's can't own hunters we must be buffed right? Dk's absolutely own all casters and are almost just as effective against other melee. What more do you people want?

Rogues and warriors walk over DKs with a fair amount of ease. Removing disarm in WoD will be a boon though, no doubt.

Oh, and right there are two more classes that can easily negate one of a frost DK's only potential CCs.

You know that old joke about Rock saying that Paper is OP but Scissors are fine? Your post is literally that.

Usually not okay from a balance standpoint to have rock, paper, and scissors. "Well I was fine playing as rock, but boy howdy, paper showed up... hope I'll be more lucky next time." And as for locks and DKs, a warlock with a proper setup can run circles around them. Depends on who gets the drop on who, as it is with most classes. But hunters can easily finagle a situation to their benefit with pet stun or snare, disengage or net disengage, deterrence, concussive shot, scatter shot into freezing trap (that's always fun,) and so on and so forth...

[Hand Banana]

People in this thread must play against some of the worst casters ever. Dks never catch mages, hunters and well played locks. That is mostly because we don't have any rootbreaks. We sacrifice our mobility for incredible dot and ranged damage/pressure. The rune system also ensures that when we do get to our target we will be able to unload on them, so we don't need to be in constant melee range. The only thing that holds dks back right now is being easy to burst down from lack of defensives and easy to kite due to lack of mobility. Give them some of both and they will be incredibly overpowered.

I am fine with mobility I just wish active defensives were stronger. Sitting in blood pres + conv all game being nuked hoping to not die is kinda lame. Something along the lines of upping AMS to 75% (50% + 65% battle fatigue, its like 120k in BP fully geared right now) and making a glyph that allows it to absorb physical damage as well (but no longer gives RP). Gives a short cd absorb against any attack if we choose to glyph it (great for melee cleaves).

[nyc81991]

Burst of Speed/ Long arm of Justice, Range stun come to mind.

Those are not gap closers. They are speed boosts and CC. A gap closer is Death Grip, Charge, Heroic Leap, Flying Serpent Kick, Shadow Step, ect..

[Nomisno]

Those are not gap closers. They are speed boosts and CC. A gap closer is Death Grip, Charge, Heroic Leap, Flying Serpent Kick, Shadow Step, ect..

Did you really say Flying Serpent Kick? How is it different from pally sprints? What it does is indeed closing a gap, but not very different from how paladins do/try to do it. (except for Kick being waaaaaay stronger/faster)

[Drenan]

I guess you guys play frost because as UH I rape warriors and rogues 1 on 1. Hunters I admit will eat me up if they catch me in the wide open. Maybe it's because I have played wow for a while and have played different classes and specs and come to realize there is always going to be a class/spec that is going to counter you to the max and there will always be an OP spec that owns everybody. Re roll UH and have fun face rolling 90% of the other classes and specs.

[Hand Banana]

I guess you guys play frost because as UH I rape warriors and rogues 1 on 1. Hunters I admit will eat me up if they catch me in the wide open. Maybe it's because I have played wow for a while and have played different classes and specs and come to realize there is always going to be a class/spec that is going to counter you to the max and there will always be an OP spec that owns everybody. Re roll UH and have fun face rolling 90% of the other classes and specs.

UH is actually pretty average at 1v1. You have no real way to stop another classes burst. I don't see how you beat rogues unless you 1v1 terrible ones; a decent rogue will eat a DK no problem. Nearly any ranged beats us including, mages, hunters, demo locks, booms, enh beats us, rogues beat us, ferals beat us, monks beat us. Thats mostly because passive mitigation through BP/Conv isnt as good in 1v1 as it is in team play with a healer. The more active defensives/burst you have the better you are in 1v1.

[SlippyCheeze]

I guess you guys play frost because as UH I rape warriors and rogues 1 on 1.

It would be nice if you could use another term for that. Unless you mean you literally have imaginary forced sex with them, in which case your internal fantasy life is kind of disturbing.

...but, seriously, that isn't a great way to put that, and brings to mind all sort of unpleasant real world things I would rather not be reminded of. Thanks.

[Grayjoy]

It would be nice if you could use another term for that. Unless you mean you literally have imaginary forced sex with them, in which case your internal fantasy life is kind of disturbing.

...but, seriously, that isn't a great way to put that, and brings to mind all sort of unpleasant real world things I would rather not be reminded of. Thanks.

Yeah bro, it's 2014 and we aren't the kids playing counterstrike we once were (but I also take offense because I'm a rogue).

[Deleted]

It would be nice if you could use another term for that. Unless you mean you literally have imaginary forced sex with them, in which case your internal fantasy life is kind of disturbing.

...but, seriously, that isn't a great way to put that, and brings to mind all sort of unpleasant real world things I would rather not be reminded of. Thanks.

dawwww did you get triggered? boohoo

[Nomisno]

Do you even feel the Offtopic?

[Drenan]

Ever heard the saying "the best defense is a good offense"? Between pet stun, asphyxiate, Death grip, ams, blood presence, conversion, lyche born plus DC heal, chains of ice, desecrated ground, Mind freeze, dark simullcrum, and ice bound fortitude how can you complain?

[Shiira]

That's just a list of tools.

You can make one for any spec you want and it proves nothing.

[bals]

a lot of those aren't even for offense?

[Drenan]

I've come to the conclusion that you guys just aren't doing it right, as in playing uh dk to its potential.

[Kraeth]

How are those tools even remotely linked to mobility?

Pve-wise we're hands down one of the worst, maybe even the worst class in terms of mobility. Being melee something's gotta change.

[Hand Banana]

Pve-wise we're hands down one of the worst, maybe even the worst class in terms of mobility. Being melee something's gotta change.

I can understand the idea of PVE needing more mobility. However all of the melee who dont have gapcloser (rets, dks, enh) all have ranged abilities as part of their rotation as well as movement speed increases. This compensates for the lack of mobility. Warriors, rogues and ferals have no real ranged abilities to speak of in a dps sense and as such they get gap-closers. Thats how I see it. I can't speak a whole lot for pve since I dont do it anymore but in pvp if dks had more mobility then would be damn unstoppable. Its frustrating sitting in roots half the game but I still outdamage everyone BY ALOT which is sort of scary when you think about it.