1. #3061
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demsi View Post
    What is wrong with Blizz?!, they just completely remove AoW, why not do something interesting and daring with it?!?, i swear the spec gets more and more bland and boring each expac.
    It's still there, just not in the spellbook(Spell book clean up).
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple https://twitter.com/Aeluron1989

  2. #3062
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    The irony of this is, in Hearthstone you can put it on another card. In WoW it's yourslf only.
    Funny thing is, when they first mentioned ability bloat/consolidation, I brainstormed to one of my fellow paladin buddies about how I wouldn't mind seeing HoP merged with DS with cooldown and talents applied at the time of application (so self-applied it'd be the usual 5 min, on someone else it'd be 3 min, baseline). While a slight nerf in that you wouldn't be able to throw both out simultaneously, it'd be a buff to HoP in that it would be effective against both physical and magical attacks, and perhaps some adjustment between cooldown length, talents, and forebearance could be used to tweak the ability.

    Honestly if our utility and class identity is going to revolve around Hands, I wouldn't mind seeing a system whereby throwing our utility out on others buffs us simultaneously. Something like Hand of Freedom applied to ourselves provides movement-impairing immunity, but applied to an ally, they get the Freedom effect, but we get immunity to hard CCs (stun and fear) for half the duration. Sort of a "this is good on you, but potentially better if you're looking out for someone else," philosophy would both fit the archetype of a paladin, encourage us to use our toolkit, and add some much needed complexity and depth to our playstyle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fredzilla View Post
    I've been sitting on those links myself, Fred. I especially can't wait to use the "Mages go up, Rets go down. Balance." quote when DPS numbers start coming out. I know we'll get the usual song and dance about how stack ranks don't matter, but it'll be a good opening.

    Honestly, more than anything else, today's patch notes look to me like Blizzard is saying, "We were going to try something and you complained about it. So **** you, you get nothing instead."

  3. #3063
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    That idea Camaris is interesting mechanically you got there.
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple https://twitter.com/Aeluron1989

  4. #3064
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    the didnt do anything with AoW because that would require imagination.

    Something they heavily lack with their apparent out of touch design with the spec.

    This is going to make 4.0 look like christmas

  5. #3065
    Pandaren Monk Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zabannith View Post
    think of it this way.. weapon dmg has been reduced by 50% ..this makes casters a lot stronger than any melee in the game atm because they don't scale of weapon dmg like we do
    To make things even worse....since when casters are ever weaker than melee in the first place? haha :P

  6. #3066
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    To make things even worse....since when casters are ever weaker than melee in the first place? haha :P
    Since their movement is hurt significantly. Also I believe in SoO we got another buff(Melee wise) but that stuff is out of the air until more builds get rollin.
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple https://twitter.com/Aeluron1989

  7. #3067
    Pandaren Monk Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Since their movement is hurt significantly. Also I believe in SoO we got another buff(Melee wise) but that stuff is out of the air until more builds get rollin.
    To be honest the only melee that rival can a caster at the moment is rogue which can be countered by Warlock opness (Talking about damage in pve raiding not pvp)

  8. #3068
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    To be honest the only melee that rival can a caster at the moment is rogue which can be countered by Warlock opness (Talking about damage in pve raiding not pvp)
    You forgot Feral

  9. #3069
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    You forgot Feral


    Meow. /10chars
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple https://twitter.com/Aeluron1989

  10. #3070
    Pandaren Monk Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    You forgot Feral
    Haha yeah. I remember during Wotlk Blizzard kept nerfing retri because in their point of view is that retri is "One man army." really? what about current Feral now ? :P

  11. #3071
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    I like to think we champions of said faction ARE one man armies. Not just Paladins specifically >.>



    Go go Forum glitches
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple https://twitter.com/Aeluron1989

  12. #3072
    Mechagnome
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    yeaaaaaaaaa. they seem to be ignoring us blatantly as of now, may it be because they cant, or believe they shouldnt, either way it is bad. since our inception into this game they have had problems with us, and they think that ignoring how we are is a good thing?

    I also forgot one big portion as to how we will suck come next expo, how much dps do you think we do if our trinkets were not so blatantly OP? 10% increased to all our secondaries as well as gaining 50% cdr? WITH massive str procs on them as well? these two trinkets ALONE give us massive scaling, and without either of them AND inq, we will be having a very rough time indeed, even more so with weapon damage almost being decimated out of existence.

    i have NO clue as to how they can even begin to fix that scaling issue without an entire spec revamp, and im not talking like giving us two more holy power and another ability to add it, im talken about EVERYTHING being removed and redone from scratch, almost like it was a new class, which in the past, we rets tend to even think of ourselves as such, and i sometimes think that we should be treated as such considering our massive differences from the rest of the paladin idea.

  13. #3073
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    The way things are going 4.0 will seem like Christmas, Hanukkah, Easter, and Halloween rolled into one. I don't see how they can gut us anymore without giving DS and TV to Holy/Prot as well.

    Honestly are they trying to force ret to reroll Holy/Prot?
    Patience is a virtue. I never claimed to be virtuous.

  14. #3074
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Self fulfilling prophecy indeed....
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple https://twitter.com/Aeluron1989

  15. #3075
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    Haha yeah. I remember during Wotlk Blizzard kept nerfing retri because in their point of view is that retri is "One man army." really? what about current Feral now ? :P
    i think your misspelled some words, such as WotLK being MoP and paladins being warlocks, cause lets face it, if a paladin does anything somewhat well, its OP. But if a freaken caster or pure dps does it, its perfectly balanced. (cough cough warlock healing being stronger than EVERY hybrid dps barring maybe a enh spamming healing raid an entire fight and having AS MUCH HEALTH as a TANK while still being #1 dps)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dremall View Post
    The way things are going 4.0 will seem like Christmas, Hanukkah, Easter, and Halloween rolled into one. I don't see how they can gut us anymore without giving DS and TV to Holy/Prot as well.

    Honestly are they trying to force ret to reroll Holy/Prot?
    yes
    /10chars

  16. #3076
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reghame View Post
    yeaaaaaaaaa. they seem to be ignoring us blatantly as of now, may it be because they cant, or believe they shouldnt, either way it is bad. since our inception into this game they have had problems with us, and they think that ignoring how we are is a good thing?

    I also forgot one big portion as to how we will suck come next expo, how much dps do you think we do if our trinkets were not so blatantly OP? 10% increased to all our secondaries as well as gaining 50% cdr? WITH massive str procs on them as well? these two trinkets ALONE give us massive scaling, and without either of them AND inq, we will be having a very rough time indeed, even more so with weapon damage almost being decimated out of existence.

    i have NO clue as to how they can even begin to fix that scaling issue without an entire spec revamp, and im not talking like giving us two more holy power and another ability to add it, im talken about EVERYTHING being removed and redone from scratch, almost like it was a new class, which in the past, we rets tend to even think of ourselves as such, and i sometimes think that we should be treated as such considering our massive differences from the rest of the paladin idea.
    Dont forget their initial plans for our multistrike won't proc mastery and is 1/3 of the hit. Why does multistrike exist again? a Proper way to introduce multistike NOT as a blatantly inferior version of crit would be have it proc attacks the procing attack does AND the resource. Multistrike CS bloop bloop 2 holy power.

    There are holes everywhere in the WoD design for ret it's anything but promising.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Serpha might work in a world with 20+ gem slots and reforging. Seraph doesn't work in the "new" WoW

    Seal twisting just doesn't work period.

  17. #3077
    Brewmaster Fredzilla's Avatar
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    Multistrike would work, too, if it were to proc, say, seals off of appropiately MS'd attacks. Like good ol tiny abom.
    "You little hoochees!" - Daos, Lord of Terror

    Quote Originally Posted by PraisetheSun View Post
    "NEENER-NEENER RETS ARE WIENERS."

  18. #3078
    The Patient
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    The way things are going it will be less than a month from release, and someone is going to tap one of the devs on the shoulder and be like "Hey we still haven't touched ret at all." There is going to be an oh crap moment and they'll throw something together that passes for playable with next to no testing and we'll either be buffed or nerfed to be brought back in line after release and the "90 is not end game don't worry" goes away.

    Overall I'm not too impressed with the secondary stats at all. Miss the tiny abom

    At the rate they're going might as well (and need to) take us back to the drawing board.
    Patience is a virtue. I never claimed to be virtuous.

  19. #3079
    Quote Originally Posted by Lumineus View Post
    Don't expect that to last. You'll hear the QQ from orbit when the first Warrior eats an Ashbringer to the face.
    Hahaha exactly. Those warriors... blizzard should rename "shout" spells to "cry" they are so good at that.

    I'm still waiting for them to remove spells like light's hammer. Useless talent.

  20. #3080
    The more I think about it the more making our t16 4 set baseline seems to be the way to go. If instead of removing Art Of War they changed it into the 4p proc and make Divine Storm heal for a % of damage done like it did in Wotlk, it could not only function as a way to get Divine Storm single target dps but also as raid / group utility.

    In Wotlk one of the things I loved most about playing Ret was seeing the passive heals to my raid through Divine Storm and Judgment of Light. Speaking of which I would also like to see Judgment of Light return in some form as well. (Not as much as Divine Storm though).

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