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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by snuzzle View Post
    I don't think they're indistinct, and I think it hurts your argument to say that they are. If that was the level of difference we got from face to face in WoW, I would be over the moon.

    However, what they are is different face models, ie different geosets not just textures. You can see it especially in the nose and jaw, the actual facial geometry is different. It's much more apparent when clicking from face to face in the actual game. So they're not something that's really comparable to WoW where the only difference from face to face is texture.
    I have GW2. I've played that race. I mostly found all those faces overwhelming for being too subtle in their differences, it highlights one point I've made. You risk either making the distinctions too subtle to warrant the work especially with WOW's design philosophy of having very stark and broad differences between each choice making their limited choices matter more, or as I've said you can risk going too far and making something like looks like a bunch of similarly related animals that aren't quite the same species. I understand how you think that helps what you're saying, but I don't think it does at all, it actually shows how overwhelming and too busy this kind of thing can get, and I specialize in breaking down form and capturing nuance in my field of work and in my hobbies, I can sit and see the differences now but the first time I saw them, if you didn't label the faces, I wouldn't have been able to tell you if I was looking at 30 different subtle variations between the very obvious that stick out to me or 50 beyond how often the few I recognize cycle back. And I also have an eye trained for identifying individual animals based on coat markings in real life wildlife conservation and capturing reptiles like turtles and others who camouflage into their environment, I latch on to silhouettes. I'd be a good fossil hunter, and have even taken some cracks at it, and found I had a knack for it. I can sit and eventually recognize those faces, but WOW's thing is all about first impressions. That's matters so much with a genre trying to appeal to people outside it's fan base.

    I don't think I'm going to change your mind though. I guess I'll agree to disagree. WOW's purpose to give us larger than life instantly recognizable variants is both frustrating and appreciated in my view. The sculptor and painter in me wants to go crazy, but I still love their work 99% of the time and I like the way they basically give us these things that scream "WARCRAFT" in our faces while offering us things like bumper-stickers and decorations to feel just enough of your own personal touch in a very carefully adjusted balance it's easy to dismiss as lazy. Knowing why they did it, and seeing them put the same amount of work in other places that people think a character creation system like this warrants annoys me when people chalk it up to Blizzard trying to "get away" with something we are supposed to just tolerate.

    I think in this cartoon style also, you can create entire new player races based on extremely different proportioned individuals. As I've shown comparing the array of human models we have in WOW that look so different but all are human, while talking about high elves in the Subrace photoshop thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by snuzzle View Post
    And yet, your posts do nothing to convince anyone to stop expressing their opinion. I see a lot of threads I don't care about, too. And then I don't post to them.



    My apologies. I must have misread what you were saying. You do have a point about the male worgen, but I still think our feedback did influence the direction the new model took.
    I just don't think 21 days was enough time, nor do I think they felt comfortable with the worgen they made. For one, they had developed a more advanced generation of models the original worgen players aren't up to par with, aesthetic preferences aside, for another, looking at every worgen incarnation in game, they look much more like the Worgen we know. The player Worgen looked nothing like Worgen. They looked like Dobermans and weird fox/deer ladies to me with very outdated polygons and textures in a lot ways, though I loved them when I first played them and argued AGAINST more feral Worgen, I immediately changed my mind personally logging into beta and seeing the new model the night it was implemented. But we'll never know, I just have a suspicion it wasn't because of a few threads we had on the beta forum for 21 days.
    Last edited by Yig; 2014-03-18 at 05:41 AM.
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  2. #182
    Scarab Lord Mokoshne's Avatar
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    i want my Characters to be able to show emotion. If i get a new piece of loot my character should smile. If i am taking heavy damage or a big hit i should show pain.

    it would also be good for machinima if there were awesome facial rigs & lip sync abilities.
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  3. #183
    High Overlord Pedrolo's Avatar
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    "If we create different faces for each race it will take time from a raid or some dungeons." "Buy this exciting new face for your account on the store!" This are the 2 options you can choose eith Blizzard.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Mokoshne View Post
    i want my Characters to be able to show emotion. If i get a new piece of loot my character should smile. If i am taking heavy damage or a big hit i should show pain.

    it would also be good for machinima if there were awesome facial rigs & lip sync abilities.
    Yes, I love facial expressions in games, it's pretty much mandatory now. In the KOTOR beta screenshots they were all blank faced dolls and it drove me insane.



    Quote Originally Posted by Pedrolo View Post
    "If we create different faces for each race it will take time from a raid or some dungeons." "Buy this exciting new face for your account on the store!" This are the 2 options you can choose eith Blizzard.
    You need to be strapped to a chair Clock Work Orange style with a film shown to you about context. Context is important. Ignoring and playing semantic games with context is dishonest. This makes you a liar when you do that. You should be careful you don't do that if that matters to you.
    It must suck to have nothing but "gotcha" sound bites to hide behind in place of actually reasoning and addressing points and thinking.

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  5. #185
    Moderator Gehco's Avatar
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    I will rather sit back and wait to see the progress and release, then throwing what sounds like a soft complaint out on the forum.

    Still underconstruction, so we can give our best view once we can see the end result.
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  6. #186
    Herald of the Titans Snes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    How about they finish all of the models first and release the expansion before we start complaining?
    Complaining is useful. If we didn't complain, we would have ended up with same faces.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Snes View Post
    Complaining is useful. If we didn't complain, we would have ended up with same faces.
    Or we'd have ended up in the same spot we are now, just without all the complaining.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Or we'd have ended up in the same spot we are now, just without all the complaining.
    Not the kinda of gambling I'm interested in.

    If people are willing to complain constructively enough that blizzard understand they could have done better, then I'm happy for that. A little to lazy to do it myself usually.
    It's almost always the wrong argument to compare yourself to the highest DPS specs out there. "Middle of the pack" is actually where everyone is supposed to be. -Ghostcrawler
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  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    How about they finish all of the models first and release the expansion before we start complaining?
    Literally the first reply in the thread.

    Bravo, Darsithis. *tips cap*

  10. #190
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    I will rather sit back and wait to see the progress and release, then throwing what sounds like a soft complaint out on the forum.

    Still underconstruction, so we can give our best view once we can see the end result.
    Careful so it won't be to late, correct me if I'm wrong but Blizzard doesn't have a history of changing things to have gone live unless it's fairly serious?

    I have made them aware several times of a fairly big mistake with one of the male dwarf faces since vanilla, the teeth model is miss placed and is hovering far outside the mouth.

    Reported several floating objects that also gets dismissed, I remember them fixing a lot of flying seaweed in wrath though. That was nice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    How about they finish all of the models first and release the expansion before we start complaining?
    Highly doubt they will modify them after release, doesn't sounds like they have much room to go backwards with the kind of workload Blizzard tell us they have.
    It's almost always the wrong argument to compare yourself to the highest DPS specs out there. "Middle of the pack" is actually where everyone is supposed to be. -Ghostcrawler
    DPS Tuning
    •Yes, this is a roller coaster. Our process is to try things out and iterate if we don't like them. If the churn offends you, just hang on for another week or two.

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