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  1. #101
    Don't kid yourself, the hardcore players will still rush through the content, to get to 100 ASAP, just to make a lot money, or to get a head start ahead of the rest of the population while grinding reputations, or farming materials, or whatnot, which is a HUGE deal on high/full realms.

    And about "experiencing the leveling content"- I can always experience it/read the quests/etc on one of the 3 alts I have, which I won't have a reason to rush with.

    And I really don't get what problem do the people that DON'T compete for Realm First have with the achievements? It doesn't affect them in any way, but they want it gone? Can't find the logic here- if I don't care about something in the game, they better remove it.
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  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by willemh View Post
    If I woudnt enjoy it I woudnt do it, simple. While everyone has different reasons to enjoy a game, nobody in this world plays games he doesnt enjoy. The achievement was an incentive for me to check out the whole story and enjoy the whole story. I knew more about the story then anyone who just logs in at expansion release and starts randomly lvling to max lvl (like >90% of the players do). Without this incentive in the form of an achievement to check out the whole content I will have to re-evaluate if I believe its fun enough.
    This is an interesting argument. Basically you are saying you played the game in Beta to experience the content so that you could skip through it once the content goes live.

    While this may be a good incentive for you personally to experience the game, I think it's fair to say it kinda runs contrary to the spirit of the game. The game should be enjoyed once it's live. People competing for realm firsts tend to miss out on a lot, and for most of them it ends up being in vain because there can only be one winner. I had a guildie who went for realm first warrior, and missed out by about 15 minutes. It was a huge let down for the guy, and he spent the next few months not really knowing what the MoP story was, while the rest of us got to really enjoy the expansion and its story a lot more.

    Quote Originally Posted by willemh View Post
    And I believe the answer will be negative. I will still take some days off from work to level to max, farm dungeons and be fully prepared for the first raid but I wont spend hours on the beta checking out every single quest out there.
    My point exactly. The beta isn't intended to be your gaming experience of the new expansion. It's not meant to be there for you to figure out how to get a special achievement. The fact that a number of people used the beta to get the edge needed to win the race really spoils it for everyone else. IMO it would be a far more meaningful race if everyone in the realm was on the same footing, going into it with no prior information.

    This is one of the primary reasons why I believe they canned the idea. The kind of crap that the world first people pulled off to get it (Athene for Cata and then that FS guy for MoP) just ruined the fun of it. It goes against the spirit of the game, and the mere fact that there were debates about whether it was technically cheating or just a case of clever rules lawyering indicates that it was a broken feature.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    The beta isn't intended to be your gaming experience of the new expansion. It's not meant to be there for you to figure out how to get a special achievement. The fact that a number of people used the beta to get the edge needed to win the race really spoils it for everyone else. IMO it would be a far more meaningful race if everyone in the realm was on the same footing, going into it with no prior information.
    And the best guilds in the world use the PTR to learn the boss mechanics/tactics, how is it any different with them? Neither race(to realm first level X, or to kill X boss) is suited for everyone, only for a groups of people that are really, really interesting in achieving it.
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  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skr View Post
    And I really don't get what problem do the people that DON'T compete for Realm First have with the achievements? It doesn't affect them in any way, but they want it gone? Can't find the logic here- if I don't care about something in the game, they better remove it.
    I have never competed for it, and I don't particularly desire to see it go away, but I can understand why Blizzard sees it as a negative feature - because I have observed it becoming a toxic event for a lot of people who did choose to compete.

  5. #105
    As a Realm First in all the expansions (80, 85 and 90) I must say I'm glad they're removing them. The amazing stress, tension, panic etc were not exactly good feelings, specially when nearing the last hours of the leveling. I also never played any beta to max level because I don't want spoilers on new content, and for WoD I would probably need to. So all in all, you should be happy. You can still blast to maximum level however you want and you will NOT "lose", which is a huge thing. When I felt all that joy and glory when the achievement popped, after getting some sleep I thought about how the other players felt; very close in exp, all that time (14+ hours) only to LOSE in the end. I understand people like to feel the thrill of the race, but well, you got Hardcore Diablo for that! (just kidding)

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skr View Post
    And the best guilds in the world use the PTR to learn the boss mechanics/tactics, how is it any different with them?
    I never said it was a good thing. But I acknowledge that it a necessary evil since a PTR is needed to test out the stuff.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skr View Post
    Neither race(to realm first level X, or to kill X boss) is suited for everyone, only for a groups of people that are really, really interesting in achieving it.
    Race for X boss kill takes a lot more commitment than world first level XX. Also, although world first raid kills almost certainly require practice in Beta, most of the work is still done in the actual game. I think the fact that some people spent weeks playing beta to get ready for a leveling race that took less than 24 hours in the actual game is just sad.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    I think the fact that some people spent weeks playing beta to get ready for a leveling race that took less than 24 hours in the actual game is just sad.
    That's their very own business. Nobody is holding a gun at someone's head forcing them to compete for realm first. If it's not your thing- good, I'm sure that there are other part of the gameplay of the incoming expansion that concern you, but there are people that enjoy this particular thing.
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  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    This is an interesting argument. Basically you are saying you played the game in Beta to experience the content so that you could skip through it once the content goes live.

    While this may be a good incentive for you personally to experience the game, I think it's fair to say it kinda runs contrary to the spirit of the game. The game should be enjoyed once it's live. People competing for realm firsts tend to miss out on a lot, and for most of them it ends up being in vain because there can only be one winner. I had a guildie who went for realm first warrior, and missed out by about 15 minutes. It was a huge let down for the guy, and he spent the next few months not really knowing what the MoP story was, while the rest of us got to really enjoy the expansion and its story a lot more.



    My point exactly. The beta isn't intended to be your gaming experience of the new expansion. It's not meant to be there for you to figure out how to get a special achievement. The fact that a number of people used the beta to get the edge needed to win the race really spoils it for everyone else. IMO it would be a far more meaningful race if everyone in the realm was on the same footing, going into it with no prior information.

    This is one of the primary reasons why I believe they canned the idea. The kind of crap that the world first people pulled off to get it (Athene for Cata and then that FS guy for MoP) just ruined the fun of it. It goes against the spirit of the game, and the mere fact that there were debates about whether it was technically cheating or just a case of clever rules lawyering indicates that it was a broken feature.
    So in your opinion its better to not experience the content at all over experiencing it in BETA?

    Without the achievement I wont bother doing all the quests in beta. I will just rush trough a few random zones once the game goes live and get my character geared up as fast as possible for raids. I will miss out a load of content compared to the previous expansions, where I could dream every corner and quest and story of every zone because I prepared for the server first race.

    If you really think that those previously rushing for server first will suddenly slowly read every quest and do every quest in each zone in chronological order and continue questing even after they hit level 100 to experience the full story your delusional. These compatitive players want to get to level 100 and gear themselves up for raids. Thats how they enjoy the game, and theres nothing wrong with this. At least previously the achievement gave these players a reason to check out all the quest content, now this reason is gone.

  9. #109
    Can someone tell me what the HARM in having realm first achievements is? Because 97.5% of the population gets butthurt and says "OMG U HAZ NO LIFE NERD" when they don't get it ? I do not understand what the fuck the problem is. Blizzard makes little sense these days. The people that enjoy racing to realm first will still do it and GuildOx will still track it for us, so it isn't that big of a deal but it's kind of convenient to know when it happens on the live realms, and also fun to congratulate the other players. I know in MoP I was always in the top 5 running for that lvl 90, I think I ended up getting Shaman 1st and Overall 4 or 5 but it was fun talking in general with the other guys, etc. etc.

    They should work on removing things that actually effect the game in a negative way or things that are obsolete.

  10. #110
    mmmm not happy at all with the removal of realm first achievements. It may have encouraged exploits but it was fun and a cool accomplishment.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by zaneosak View Post
    Can someone tell me what the HARM in having realm first achievements is? Because 97.5% of the population gets butthurt and says "OMG U HAZ NO LIFE NERD" when they don't get it ? I do not understand what the fuck the problem is. Blizzard makes little sense these days. The people that enjoy racing to realm first will still do it and GuildOx will still track it for us, so it isn't that big of a deal but it's kind of convenient to know when it happens on the live realms, and also fun to congratulate the other players. I know in MoP I was always in the top 5 running for that lvl 90, I think I ended up getting Shaman 1st and Overall 4 or 5 but it was fun talking in general with the other guys, etc. etc.

    They should work on removing things that actually effect the game in a negative way or things that are obsolete.
    It sends out a message that they want you to rush through the leveling content, which they don't. It might cause demand for customer service as tickets, which means that people with real problems have to wait, and it has balance issues with the new troll racial and heirlooms from Garrosh so it's better not to have it as official achievement.

  12. #112
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    Blizzard really likes to remove stuff. It amazes me how much they talk, and yet say so little.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Skr View Post
    Don't kid yourself, the hardcore players will still rush through the content, to get to 100 ASAP, just to make a lot money, or to get a head start ahead of the rest of the population while grinding reputations, or farming materials, or whatnot, which is a HUGE deal on high/full realms.

    And about "experiencing the leveling content"- I can always experience it/read the quests/etc on one of the 3 alts I have, which I won't have a reason to rush with.

    And I really don't get what problem do the people that DON'T compete for Realm First have with the achievements? It doesn't affect them in any way, but they want it gone? Can't find the logic here- if I don't care about something in the game, they better remove it.
    How about the spam everyone gets when someone gets a realm first achievement? Take out the spam and I'm good with whatever.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    SNIP...
    It goes against the spirit of the game, and the mere fact that there were debates about whether it was technically cheating or just a case of clever rules lawyering indicates that it was a broken feature.
    If we're going to bring up what goes against the spirit of the game then buying a level 90 and skipping the entire 1-90 leveling content goes against the spirit of the game.

    Might as well just let me buy a level 100 and skip the entire leveling process and get to end game where the real game starts for many players.

    BUT with server first achievements you are at least Leveling yourself in the quickest way possible and actually playing the game.
    Last edited by quras; 2014-03-07 at 04:20 PM.

  15. #115

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    Quote Originally Posted by willemh View Post
    So in your opinion its better to not experience the content at all over experiencing it in BETA?

    Without the achievement I wont bother doing all the quests in beta. I will just rush trough a few random zones once the game goes live and get my character geared up as fast as possible for raids. I will miss out a load of content compared to the previous expansions, where I could dream every corner and quest and story of every zone because I prepared for the server first race.

    If you really think that those previously rushing for server first will suddenly slowly read every quest and do every quest in each zone in chronological order and continue questing even after they hit level 100 to experience the full story your delusional. These compatitive players want to get to level 100 and gear themselves up for raids. Thats how they enjoy the game, and theres nothing wrong with this. At least previously the achievement gave these players a reason to check out all the quest content, now this reason is gone.
    If you don't want to quest for the joy of questing, that is your prerogative. You keep talking as if the world first race is the only reason to pay attention to any quest or storyline in the game. Maybe so for you, but understand not many others share your view.
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  16. #116
    Really glad to see realm firsts go. Now hopefully I won't have to go an extra 15 skill points on my gnome in engineering just to get credit for getting to the new max level of engineering for that achievement, assuming they leave in achievements for maxing out professions.

  17. #117
    Appear offline.... such a simple feature yet they need 2 years to make (and apparently aren't even close to completing it), what kind of programmers blizzard have? As a programmer of 13 years i can say this is 1 week work, seriously. Its obvious they dont want to do it for different reasons.

  18. #118
    Wondering if people complaining here actually got any realm first themselves.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Frozenbeef View Post
    What's with the lack of wod info >.< We are in march and not even an announcement of a beta let alone the beta itself
    "We're gonna bring faster expansions and content." inb4 MoP being longest expansion to date for WoW. I don't think there's any chance the expansion will come out before September or even October. They've been silent since BlizzCon almost, showing us models we don't really need to see now, and posting useless blogs imo.

    If there would've been at least 2 or 3 more features coming with WoD I would understand the delay. But what's the delay for? Models? Garrison? Can't bay anything else, I'm not hyped for either of them, sure models are cool, but I don't look at my character much. And Garrison, meh decent feature but guess it's taking up way to much time. It should've been in with expansion after WoD and bring something less time consuming with WoD.

    Unless, they're gonna be "Surprise we're also adding a new race and class!/Biggest feature yet to WoW!"

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by SteveZombie View Post
    If you don't want to quest for the joy of questing, that is your prerogative. You keep talking as if the world first race is the only reason to pay attention to any quest or storyline in the game. Maybe so for you, but understand not many others share your view.
    Am I not a player of this game? If you make thousands of players happy by literally adding 1 achievement why not do so?

    I see no reason whatsoever to remove it. It makes me enjoy a new expansion and the beta more, and has no negative impact for people like you in any way.

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