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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post

    The fact a few hundred people follow ESO streams compared to a game like the D3 expansion which is in the same release timing shows everyhting really. And ... D3 doesn't even have a PvP element in it. A game like Hearthstone stormed the ranks in a matter of weeks, also beta btw.
    Twitch numbers are based on who is playing and not what they are playing. If one of the big names played Pong it would be at 10k views.
    I'm a Forsaken. I kill firstborns while their mamas watch. I turn cities into salt. I even, when I feel like it, rip the souls from little girls, and from now till kingdom come, the only thing you can count on in your existence is never understanding why.

  2. #142
    Banned True Anarch's Avatar
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    @Dasani: I know that. But even when knowing that it has been said so many times about different games that came before, I'm still very convinced about how well ESO will catch on.

    I never hyped any of the other MMOs that released over the past decade, because I'm pretty good at recognizing good and bad games. They weren't very good, although SW:ToR has a stupidly bad reputation, it's actually doing very good right now unlike what people on this forum would want to make you believe. Although I never played it, and I won't, since I don't like Star Wars. But with ESO it's different, and it's only going to be helped because of how old WoW is becoming and how bored people are getting with even the WoW expansions.

    ESO is going to be a major hit, once it launches and people start realizing what's going on... they'll come. Currently they're scared to hype up a game, because of the past track record of failed MMOs. They shouldn't be.

    Also your beta argument is wrong. Some games, like WoW, have pointless betas in which nothing changes, because Blizzard is a slow company. ZOS however has pushed through several major beta updates over the past few weeks, which vastly improved many aspects of the game with an update speed and dedication that Blizzard never has shown.
    Last edited by True Anarch; 2014-03-09 at 11:33 AM.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    The article clearly stated "League of Legends developer Riot Games has revealed that its MOBA generated $624 million in revenue through 2013"

    I know you are hanging on straws, but the independant study confirmed that figure, which is a nice way for you to say "everyone is lying".

    Nice BTW: Since Riot games are not stock related they are not obliged to reveal that info. But it is Always nice to see a 7.8 million subscription based game like WOW beat the "biggest played game" by a very wide margin.

    If anything: now count the development costs of a single player map of LOL with that huge wide world of Azeroth and you simply know FREE to Play is not a solution to WOW for the next years coming.

    We already knew that. Why even bother?
    The article is reporting the independent study's findings truth Riot have not confirmed this figure. But if we look at the the Superdata figures WOW unsurprisingly beat LOL for total revenue but was behind Crossfire by almost $50 million.

  4. #144
    Dreadlord Morbownz's Avatar
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    Removing the sub is the obvious one. Blizzard need to give an incentive to the average player to farm gear, the "real raiders" have raiding and achievements... the rest have LFR. Will this be solved in WoD? I imagine this would help subs or atleast keep current subs sticking around longer.
    Lets all go to the Blizz-store, Lets all go to the Blizz-store, Lets all go to the Blizz-store to buy ourselves some treats. Delicious things for geeks, the Pixels can't be beat. The Achievement points are just dandy, them sparkling mounts are quite handy. So Lets all go to the Blizz-store and buy ourselves a treat.

  5. #145
    Banned True Anarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morbownz View Post
    Removing the sub is the obvious one. Blizzard need to give an incentive to the average player to farm gear, the "real raiders" have raiding and achievements... the rest have LFR. Will this be solved in WoD? I imagine this would help subs or atleast keep current subs sticking around longer.
    That is exactly the problem with WoW. They don't have an endgame that can appeal to casual players. The casual players get thrown a chewed down old worn out bone, get herded together in LFR to do boring once-a-week challengeless content that showers them in low quality items. It doesn't matter if you're a casual player that played 200 hours this month, or 2000 hours last year, all you deserve is content without challenge and weak gear according to Blizzard.

    Let's put it this way... The MMOs about to be released in 2014 all formulated multiple solutions and gameplay choices to this problem, and it's probably the main reason why we'll see the casual playerbase leaving WoW in favour of these other games. They won't make you feel as if you're a worthless second-rank character in their world just because you didn't feel like matching up with the raidshedule of the most hardcore guilds -without- taking anything away from their hardcore gamers either.

    Say for example, you're a very casual gamer, you only play an hour a day sometimes, more during the weekends or holidays, but slowly you're specializing in your expansive crafting profession, and slowly you're learning to craft unique type epic and legendary gear. Hardcore guilds and others are going to have reason to recognize you for that, since the crafting system is so expansive that they can't possibly do everything themselves and will depend on others. "You're a master-craftsman of legendary daggers? Awesome... we'll trade you an endgame raiddrop for it (since raidloot isn't BoP in our game)." This among many other solutions which also provide access to challenging solo- or public dungeon crawling experiences.
    Last edited by True Anarch; 2014-03-09 at 11:47 AM.

  6. #146
    Like others have said, remove the sub requirement, but that only serves to increase numbers, not revenue. And as revenue is their concern over raw numbers, they won't do that until the game's basically over anyways.

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    The article said clearly stated "League of Legends developer Riot Games has revealed that its MOBA generated $624 million in revenue through 2013"
    The same article you hang yourself up with is based on the gamespot article. It clearly states "via gamespot" with a link.
    The gamespot article clearly stated the Super Data estimates as the source, not Riot Games.
    Your clear statement is a misquote or writing error and that is clearly proven trough the same article you cited.
    You hang yourself up on imaginary straws.

    Now until a few moments ago you made best attempt to hide and then deny that it was not revealed or stated by Riot Games or any other credible source.
    You lost your credibility.
    Last edited by Conscience; 2014-03-09 at 11:53 AM.

  8. #148
    remove flying. remove teleporting to entrance. suddenly the world feels like a world.

    also remove pvp guard npc because they are no fun.

    also i agree remove 20,000 different raid tiers. let it be hard and let people fail at it.
    Quote Originally Posted by inboundpaper View Post
    The short answer is nope, the long answer is noooooooooooooooope.

  9. #149
    I don't think it can really. Blizzard have become pretty slow and stagnant and the next expansion kind of shows this more features are being removed from the game than added.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Gheld View Post
    Because the market dynamics have changed. Subscription based gaming is going the way of the dodo and micro-transaction funded games are the most profitable.

    But really to go back to the original question here the answer is simple:

    They can't. Less and less people look upon each new expansion as "Something new and exciting" and instead see "more of the same". The majority of the gaming community looks at the Warcraft franchise and sees a franchise where nothing new has been offered in almost a decade.
    This is right on. In addition for me I would love free tx servers from my current PVP realm, which I have been on for 9 years, to a PVE and merging the servers which they are doing at a snails pace. An MMO with a scarce population is rather boring, but it does offer some advantages. Allow flying when you hit max lvl and this would go a long way to get me back.
    Oh almost forgot that once you hit exalted with one toon then that rep becomes account wide for if I come back will probably switch mains and its depressing to see all of my hard work on my previous main not displayed on my new as far as reputations go.
    Last edited by metatation; 2014-03-09 at 01:28 PM.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Anarch the Conqueror View Post
    That is exactly the problem with WoW. They don't have an endgame that can appeal to casual players. The casual players get thrown a chewed down old worn out bone, get herded together in LFR to do boring once-a-week challengeless content that showers them in low quality items. It doesn't matter if you're a casual player that played 200 hours this month, or 2000 hours last year, all you deserve is content without challenge and weak gear according to Blizzard.

    Let's put it this way... The MMOs about to be released in 2014 all formulated multiple solutions and gameplay choices to this problem, and it's probably the main reason why we'll see the casual playerbase leaving WoW in favour of these other games. They won't make you feel as if you're a worthless second-rank character in their world just because you didn't feel like matching up with the raidshedule of the most hardcore guilds -without- taking anything away from their hardcore gamers either.

    Say for example, you're a very casual gamer, you only play an hour a day sometimes, more during the weekends or holidays, but slowly you're specializing in your expansive crafting profession, and slowly you're learning to craft unique type epic and legendary gear. Hardcore guilds and others are going to have reason to recognize you for that, since the crafting system is so expansive that they can't possibly do everything themselves and will depend on others. "You're a master-craftsman of legendary daggers? Awesome... we'll trade you an endgame raiddrop for it (since raidloot isn't BoP in our game)." This among many other solutions which also provide access to challenging solo- or public dungeon crawling experiences.

    Feel like this whole argument is invalid since WoW has never really Been/Felt like for the 1-2 Hour Casual Gaming like you say. Raiding has pretty much always been for the Committed players and not the how u say hardcore raiders since the World First 25 Man/10 man Heroic boss kills are usually down by a handful of guilds. Its pretty simple LFR was made for the casual if they had more time or really cared to commit to a real raiding guild they would. And for the whole (since raidloot isn't BoP in our game) is just stupid ya it must be so hard to actually work for your upgrades / loot and good luck getting people trading you loot before the actually raiding roster if your not part of it lol. + ESO has gotten plenty of hate/Heat over the retarded Paywalls they are putting up on the CE and pre orders ON A SUB BASED GAME people pay for Subs for the Full game not for paywalls. end of rant :P

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Paarthurnax View Post
    The simplest answer is often the best one: Give players a reason to stick around. One of the pitfalls of letting everyone and anyone see all of the game's content within a 1-2 week period of time is that there is little reason to keep playing the game after a month or two of doing the same thing over and over again. There is nothing in the game pushing you towards doing normal modes or heroic modes nor is the game even trying to properly teach you how to play at that level or prepare you for content of that level.

    The reason TBC and WOTLK had such high sub numbers was besides the amazing raid content there was always something to do outside of raiding, something to work on in terms of character progression and if you were in that small category of players who didn't have anything to work on those expansions were VERY alt friendly so the journey could easily start over again for you.

    Compare that kind of game to what we have now, leveling and gearing alts now is a chore, and beyond raiding there really isn't much to do outside of the game that won't get tiresome after a few weeks.
    Forgot about that!! The game seemed to becoming more and more of a chore in MOP than an actual fun game, but that maybe to the freaking staggering amount of dailys in the beginning and the gated items behind them. God it was just awful. Kalgan take me away!!!!!

  13. #153
    I don't think ESO is going to kill WoW, but I'd like to see it do well. For the first time in a while we're getting a major MMO release thats trying to do something different than just copying WoW again. So far what I've seen of it looks very interesting.

    WoW is in decline, frankly I think it needs to die soon before it brings down the entire MMO market with it.

  14. #154
    The Lightbringer Primernova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ribald View Post
    I don't think ESO is going to kill WoW, but I'd like to see it do well. For the first time in a while we're getting a major MMO release thats trying to do something different than just copying WoW again. So far what I've seen of it looks very interesting.

    WoW is in decline, frankly I think it needs to die soon before it brings down the entire MMO market with it.
    ESO will do exceptionally well, even if it's bad.

    Skyrim hasn't been out of the top 20 on Steam, in nearly 3 years. The fan base is there to support it.

  15. #155
    Everyone here is a marketing expert. I love MMOC forums

  16. #156
    Free to play will kill the game. So many spam. So many kids.

  17. #157
    The Patient Piitz's Avatar
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    May I ask, how does it matter to you personally that people lose/gain subs? Is that the reason people play this game?

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by rejer13 View Post
    Free to play will kill the game. So many spam. So many kids.
    stop pretending the "adults" are better.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Primernova View Post
    ESO will do exceptionally well, even if it's bad.

    Skyrim hasn't been out of the top 20 on Steam, in nearly 3 years. The fan base is there to support it.
    Just because people like Skyrim doesn't mean they like ESO. I like Skyrim, but I will never ever play ESO.
    I can see what you see not - vision milky then eyes rot. When you turn, they will be gone - whispering their hidden song...

  20. #160
    Dreadlord Ogait's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    Remove the subscription.
    Imagine all the scrubs coming from Private Servers to ruin this game.
    Realm First Monk & Hellscream's Downfall

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