Possibly no flying throughout entire xpac.

[megasus]

not sure phasing is the issue

try a /who 100 and see what you get... the vast majority of people are either in instanced content, garrisons, or at the apex daily that is pretty much it.

I just checked a random medium populated eu realm and did a '/who 100 #zone' for every draenor zone. The result was an average of 30 players. Now keep in mind that only one faction is included and players in garrisons are excluded as those are seperate zones.

So this does indeed look like phasing is involved when you find yourself not seeing many players. As we know phasing on Draenor wasn't originally intended, but as part of the troublesome WoD launch they activated it... Extensively! - i might add.

[Granyala]

I think once the newness is gone people are going to start to get really bored cause the time they were filling with archy, pet battles, dailies and such is going to be spent just waiting for a que to pop... Once people get bored people start to leave.

Lets be realistic: The typical pet battler / arch digger aren't the type of player that wants efficiency.

Yes arch is annoying, but you travel between digsites a lot less than back in the day of Cata b/c you get a lot of frags from one site.
I'm not convinced that people will stop doing that stuff just because there is no flight anymore.

Farming? Yes, farming will die out except for a few hardcore individuals. Garrison will see to that. Hopefully Blizzard goes the step and moves gathering profs to being secondary, so every char will be able to gather and one doesn't have to specialize anymore.

Imho, the crappy design and scarcity of lvl 100 non instanced content will hurt WoW a lot more than no fly ever could.

But as you said: only time will tell.

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Flying is not a core mechanic of the game.

I don't get why people insist that flying is a mechanic. Since TBC the airspace of WoW is dead space. There is nothing in there the player interacts with.
Back in WC III there were all kinds of units that could drag down flyers and enable your troops to make them squeal.

Suddenly in WoW every melee mob looks at you with puppy eyes when you're 2 meters above ground.

The devs added flying (good) but apart from a few experiments (cannons in Blades Edge / Skettis Kaliris) they forgot to design the inhabitants of the world around flying (bad).

No wonder that people call flying "god mode".

[Deleted]

Lets be realistic: The typical pet battler / arch digger aren't the type of player that wants efficiency.

Yes arch is annoying, but you travel between digsites a lot less than back in the day of Cata b/c you get a lot of frags from one site.
I'm not convinced that people will stop doing that stuff just because there is no flight anymore.

Farming? Yes, farming will die out except for a few hardcore individuals. Garrison will see to that. Hopefully Blizzard goes the step and moves gathering profs to being secondary, so every char will be able to gather and one doesn't have to specialize anymore.

Imho, the crappy design and scarcity of lvl 100 non instanced content will hurt WoW a lot more than no fly ever could.

But as you said: only time will tell.

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I don't get why people insist that flying is a mechanic. Since TBC the airspace of WoW is dead space. There is nothing in there the player interacts with.
Back in WC III there were all kinds of units that could drag down flyers and enable your troops to make them squeal.

Suddenly in WoW every melee mob looks at you with puppy eyes when you're 2 meters above ground.

The devs added flying (good) but apart from a few experiments (cannons in Blades Edge / Skettis Kaliris) they forgot to design the inhabitants of the world around flying (bad).

No wonder that people call flying "god mode".

Can't unsee orc with puppy eyes.

[-Superman-]

Great copy and paste. However, if the ruleset doesn't allow you to fly, it's hardly efficient to dream about 310% flight speed. Might as well dream about the I-Win-Button handing you items into your inventory directly. It's way more efficient and just as possible right now (ie, not at all).

Can't admit to making up a definition huh? It's ok. The Anti-fliers tend to lie alot in this thread. Good to know you are not deviating from their lies.

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Twice now. You put me on ignore a good few months ago as well.
Where's moderation in here?

Not sure, but they need to show up soon and start warning people, like yourself, about lying and trolling. If someone loses their cool with you, odds are you were baiting them to do so.

[Deleted]

Can't admit to making up a definition huh? It's ok. The Anti-fliers tend to lie alot in this thread. Good to know you are not deviating from their lies.

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Not sure, but they need to show up soon and start warning people, like yourself, about lying and trolling. If someone loses their cool with you, odds are you were baiting them to do so.

What is he on about now?

What are you on about Mon?

[Maneo]

Lets be realistic: The typical pet battler / arch digger aren't the type of player that wants efficiency.

Yes arch is annoying, but you travel between digsites a lot less than back in the day of Cata b/c you get a lot of frags from one site.
I'm not convinced that people will stop doing that stuff just because there is no flight anymore.

Farming? Yes, farming will die out except for a few hardcore individuals. Garrison will see to that. Hopefully Blizzard goes the step and moves gathering profs to being secondary, so every char will be able to gather and one doesn't have to specialize anymore.

Imho, the crappy design and scarcity of lvl 100 non instanced content will hurt WoW a lot more than no fly ever could.

But as you said: only time will tell.

I can only speak for myself personally. I enjoy archeology and pet battles but with the removal of flight I haven't been doing them beyond my experiment a couple days ago.

Makes me sad, though I just got the archy thing that would give me that little ghost pup, I just can't bring myself to go out and do it.

Don't mind dealing with BS mobs at my digsite, can't stand dealing with all the BS mobs omw to the dig site.

[Ordinator]

I can only speak for myself personally. I enjoy archeology and pet battles but with the removal of flight I haven't been doing them beyond my experiment a couple days ago.

Makes me sad, though I just got the archy thing that would give me that little ghost pup, I just can't bring myself to go out and do it.

Don't mind dealing with BS mobs at my digsite, can't stand dealing with all the BS mobs omw to the dig site.

Sounds like you don't enjoy it enough.. If you can't be bothered to even make it to the dig sites.

[Maneo]

Sounds like you don't enjoy it enough.. If you can't be bothered to even make it to the dig sites.

I enjoy it plenty...

Just like I enjoy going to the store, however I do not enjoy going to the store on Black Friday to annoying...

Just like I enjoy archy and pet battles, I don't enjoy them if I have to fight a bunch of mobs that pose no challenge threat or reward.

Understand?

[Ordinator]

I enjoy it plenty...

Just like I enjoy going to the store, however I do not enjoy going to the store on Black Friday to annoying...

Just like I enjoy archy and pet battles, I don't enjoy them if I have to fight a bunch of mobs that pose no challenge threat or reward.

Understand?

This group of words being said over and over is getting insanely annoying. You have pretty unreasonable expectations if you expected the leveling mobs of Dreanor to be / have any of those things, and the point of no flying wasn't to make these mobs that way. And if they were challenging / threatening, you would just bitch about that. You're just going to make it a lose lose situation no matter what.

[Maneo]

This group of words being said over and over is getting insanely annoying. You have pretty unreasonable expectations if you expected the leveling mobs of Dreanor to be / have any of those things, and the point of no flying wasn't to make these mobs that way. And if they were challenging / threatening, you would just bitch about that. You're just going to make it a lose lose situation no matter what.

wouldn't be hard to make the mobs somewhat rewarding. Wildstar did it. Have pointless mobs like that drop 1/25h a apex crystal or something. When I was getting stuff with my ethereal trader i didn't mind getting dismounted and killing trash mobs so much cause I was actually getting something worth while out of it.

Now please tell me you understand how archeology pet battles and such can be fun with flight, but not worth the annoyance with out it.

Honest question ( that you probably wont' answer) do you do pet battles or archeology or anything like that. If not what are you doing out in the world once your apex crystal daily is done?

[Deleted]

I enjoy it plenty...

Just like I enjoy going to the store, however I do not enjoy going to the store on Black Friday to annoying...

Just like I enjoy archy and pet battles, I don't enjoy them if I have to fight a bunch of mobs that pose no challenge threat or reward.

Understand?

Don't aggro them then.

[TyrianFC]

Hi everyone. I was wondering if some of the pro-flyers could tell me when when the 'huge shit storm of tears' was incoming from the '25-50% of subs who will ragequit the game once they realise they cant fly'.

I blinked... and maybe missed it? Or is it still a few days / weeks / months away?

[-Superman-]

Don't aggro them then.

That's like saying breathe without lungs. I swear some people just don't think before they speak. Not aggroing something within 3 feet of where you need to be is impossible. Even at level 100, you can aggro a lvl 5 wolf just by standing on it.

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Hi everyone. I was wondering if some of the pro-flyers could tell me when when the 'huge shit storm of tears' was incoming from the '25-50% of subs who will ragequit the game once they realise they cant fly'.

I blinked... and maybe missed it? Or is it still a few days / weeks / months away?

Well, given that some players have not yet hit 100, and been bored for 3 months, I would say "Soon". Also, nice job of flame baiting.

[Deleted]

That's like saying breathe without lungs. I swear some people just don't think before they speak. Not aggroing something within 3 feet of where you need to be is impossible. Even at level 100, you can aggro a lvl 5 wolf just by standing on it.

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Well, given that some players have not yet hit 100, and been bored for 3 months, I would say "Soon". Also, nice job of flame baiting.

Its clear that you certainly don't think. If a mob is 3 feet away from where you need to be you'll aggro it whether you walked or flew there.

You need to think more logically before posting.

[Pyromelter]

I honestly don't think that flight is important enough to cause any sort of impact on subscriptions.

Myself and others in this thread have unsubbed over this, or as a big reason why we are not playing. I'm sure there are others out there as well. Because as I have stated countless times, there are literally hundreds of other MMO's without flying, and none of them ever did as well as wow, and yes, you can say "well that's cuz they suck and wow is awesome," but it is undeniable that the two most popular expansions were the ones where flying was an integrated reward (TBC and Wrath).

Lets be realistic: The typical pet battler / arch digger aren't the type of player that wants efficiency.

Yes arch is annoying, but you travel between digsites a lot less than back in the day of Cata b/c you get a lot of frags from one site.
I'm not convinced that people will stop doing that stuff just because there is no flight anymore.

That is total, utter, bs. There is a reason there are addons and min/max theorycrafting for pets, including power/speed/health subtypes, and this is also why certain breeds of pets are worth a lot more than others. The price of a good breed of a rare pet is proof enough that pet battlers are just as much about efficiency as elite level raiders. There were also people who used an exploit to farm jade forest for things like tol'vir artifcats, again, as a method of efficiency over a sense of casual exploration, or whatever you think it is people do when farming archy.

I don't get why people insist that flying is a mechanic. Since TBC the airspace of WoW is dead space. There is nothing in there the player interacts with.
Back in WC III there were all kinds of units that could drag down flyers and enable your troops to make them squeal.

Suddenly in WoW every melee mob looks at you with puppy eyes when you're 2 meters above ground.

The devs added flying (good) but apart from a few experiments (cannons in Blades Edge / Skettis Kaliris) they forgot to design the inhabitants of the world around flying (bad).

No wonder that people call flying "god mode".

Flying isn't god mode. God mode would be using speedhacks, instant teleports, instant kills/martin fury. Flying is just a less time consuming way to get from point A to point B, so that you can do something productive/interesting/fun on the ground. Having played both wow and other MMO's stuck to the ground, I hate it. I'll reference again Final Fantasy RPG's, most of which at endgame either have an airship or an instant teleport system, which means you can get to the actual fighting and doing stuff faster with minimal hassle/artificial time sink.

Let me ask, when you get the airship in Final Fantasy VII, are you in godmode? Or are you just traveling around Gaia in a much more efficient, less annoying way?

I don't want to be annoyed when I'm playing games. It's just not fun. You say you don't think flight is important enough to cause an impact on subs, I'm telling you it definitely already has (part of those "10 million" subs was me, and I'm now unsubbed).

There is a presumption from the pro-flying camp, which I'm a part of, that if blizz does not activate flying on 6.1, there will be a huge sub hit. I agree with this, and pretty much agree with Maneo. Flying isn't godmode or "not what was intended," it's just less of a hassle than doing it other ways.

btw, pvp was at it's absolute apex during wrath of the lich king. Why? Because blizzard gave us a very compelling reason to pvp (vault of archavon). Then they did tol barad which was an awful piece of garbage, and they went away from that model because "it didn't work" or some such nonsense, which is total crap, because the biggest issue with Wintergrasp was that it was TOO popular, and would crash the northrend server because EVERYONE wanted in! This was not only in an expansion with flight, it was in an area you can fly over when the battle isn't happening! And even on my lonely pve server, some world pvp would happen fighting over the fire mote dudes outside of the battle.

Compelling reason to stay on the ground. That is what they should have been focusing on. Not restricting freedom of movement.

[Slant]

Can't admit to making up a definition huh? It's ok. The Anti-fliers tend to lie alot in this thread. Good to know you are not deviating from their lies.

So now you're changing the discussion to personal attacks? You can phrase it however you like, riding the fastest route when flying is unavailable is efficient just like flying from A to B in a straight line is efficient when flying is available.

Don't call me a liar because you can't speak english. Don't make your problem mine.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Whether flight makes it into the Draenor continent in 6.1 or 7.0, I'm glad that Blizzard is sticking with designing all future content to be experienced initially from the ground. Tannaan from the sky would have been a travesty.

[Deleted]

Myself and others in this thread have unsubbed over this, or as a big reason why we are not playing. I'm sure there are others out there as well. Because as I have stated countless times, there are literally hundreds of other MMO's without flying, and none of them ever did as well as wow, and yes, you can say "well that's cuz they suck and wow is awesome," but it is undeniable that the two most popular expansions were the ones where flying was an integrated reward (TBC and Wrath).



That is total, utter, bs. There is a reason there are addons and min/max theorycrafting for pets, including power/speed/health subtypes, and this is also why certain breeds of pets are worth a lot more than others. The price of a good breed of a rare pet is proof enough that pet battlers are just as much about efficiency as elite level raiders. There were also people who used an exploit to farm jade forest for things like tol'vir artifcats, again, as a method of efficiency over a sense of casual exploration, or whatever you think it is people do when farming archy.




Flying isn't god mode. God mode would be using speedhacks, instant teleports, instant kills/martin fury. Flying is just a less time consuming way to get from point A to point B, so that you can do something productive/interesting/fun on the ground. Having played both wow and other MMO's stuck to the ground, I hate it. I'll reference again Final Fantasy RPG's, most of which at endgame either have an airship or an instant teleport system, which means you can get to the actual fighting and doing stuff faster with minimal hassle/artificial time sink.

Let me ask, when you get the airship in Final Fantasy VII, are you in godmode? Or are you just traveling around Gaia in a much more efficient, less annoying way?

I don't want to be annoyed when I'm playing games. It's just not fun. You say you don't think flight is important enough to cause an impact on subs, I'm telling you it definitely already has (part of those "10 million" subs was me, and I'm now unsubbed).

There is a presumption from the pro-flying camp, which I'm a part of, that if blizz does not activate flying on 6.1, there will be a huge sub hit. I agree with this, and pretty much agree with Maneo. Flying isn't godmode or "not what was intended," it's just less of a hassle than doing it other ways.

btw, pvp was at it's absolute apex during wrath of the lich king. Why? Because blizzard gave us a very compelling reason to pvp (vault of archavon). Then they did tol barad which was an awful piece of garbage, and they went away from that model because "it didn't work" or some such nonsense, which is total crap, because the biggest issue with Wintergrasp was that it was TOO popular, and would crash the northrend server because EVERYONE wanted in! This was not only in an expansion with flight, it was in an area you can fly over when the battle isn't happening! And even on my lonely pve server, some world pvp would happen fighting over the fire mote dudes outside of the battle.

Compelling reason to stay on the ground. That is what they should have been focusing on. Not restricting freedom of movement.

Is this guy saying wow was successful because of flying?
Do you realize how silly that sound?

Flying IS godmode as it allows you to skip terrain and avoid fighting and danger at will.

If flying is the reason why you unsubbed... well... your problem I guess. Cata had flying and it gave us uldum. Early wotlk had no flying and the gave us zul drak.
But sure... It isn't about content mate. It's about whether you fly or not.

Please stay unsubbed.

[Wrathonia]

Is this guy saying wow was successful because of flying?
Do you realize how silly that sound?

Flying IS godmode as it allows you to skip terrain and avoid fighting and danger at will.

If flying is the reason why you unsubbed... well... your problem I guess. Cata had flying and it gave us uldum. Early wotlk had no flying and the gave us zul drak.
But sure... It isn't about content mate. It's about whether you fly or not.

Please stay unsubbed.

God mode usually implies immunity to damage. Flying doesn't do that. God mode was for FPS games mostly so you could kill things without danger. You can't kill anything while flying. Your definition needs an update.

[ataraxia123]

God mode usually implies immunity to damage. Flying doesn't do that. God mode was for FPS games mostly so you could kill things without danger. You can't kill anything while flying. Your definition needs an update.

Well it does give you immunity to dmg from melee mobs

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So this thread will likely to survive till the end of WoD I suppose..... hilarious