1. #8941
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragoncurry View Post
    Uh huh, and when does sub count stop being marginal? 500K? 1 Mill? Cuz we are still 5 million ahead of that mark.
    / 10 chars
    Last edited by Barkloud; 2014-06-10 at 11:46 PM.

  2. #8942
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nayaga View Post
    Retarded? Really? Why is what I've said about why I love flying retarded?
    Really Dragoncurry, why are my reason I enjoy flight retarded?

  3. #8943
    Quote Originally Posted by Nayaga View Post
    I never said that, nor do most pro-fliers. Nice try at putting words in my mouth.
    Really:

    For me, "gameplay" would be any activity in the game I have fun with. I have fun flying, just for the sake of flying.
    Your argument is nothing except: Flying is fun, so it shouldn't be removed.

  4. #8944
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragoncurry View Post
    No, what you said is you don't want to bother with mobs that you find trivial (even though you have yet to encounter them), unchallenging (even though you have yet to see if they have level 100 elites that are challenging to you or the target objectives roaming the low level zones), and no risk with your precious time.

    Basically, you don't want to do gameplay that Blizzard feels is important.
    how do you know Blizzard thinks it important for me to kill low level mobs?

    Again why are my reasons retarded?

  5. #8945
    Quote Originally Posted by Barkloud View Post
    My point is it is not about what you have, it is about where you were.
    Not to stockholders. The past means nothing to an investor, all they care about is the future and the potential gains from supporting a company.

  6. #8946
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    Really:



    Your argument is nothing except: Flying is fun, so it shouldn't be removed.
    That is part of what I said, nice job at editing out what I said.

  7. #8947
    Quote Originally Posted by Nayaga View Post
    how do you know Blizzard thinks it important for me to kill low level mobs?

    Again why are my reasons retarded?
    What Blizzard decides to make you do in-game is clearly what they feel is important. They want you to stop and enjoy the world instead of flying in the clouds over the entire continent all of the time.

  8. #8948
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    Not to stockholders. The past means nothing to an investor, all they care about is the future and the potential gains from supporting a company.
    Stockholders love high profits. This increase the value. Of their stock.

  9. #8949
    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    Not to stockholders. The past means nothing to an investor, all they care about is the future and the potential gains from supporting a company.
    I agree, I miswrote my comment.

  10. #8950
    Quote Originally Posted by Nayaga View Post
    That is part of what I said, nice job at editing out what I said.
    How does what you added onto the rest of that lend any credence to your argument? Your entire argument is that flying is fun, so it shouldn't be removed. You don't give good reasons why flying should stay in the game, except that you enjoy it. Kudos to you for enjoying it, all I see it as is a way to get from A to B, and clearly that's all Blizzard sees it as now.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nayaga View Post
    Stockholders love high profits. This increase the value. Of their stock.
    The way a company was performing in the past adds value to the current stock? Didn't realize that! Somebody better tell those people who sold their Blockbuster stock to buy more of it!!

    So many economics professors in here today.

  11. #8951
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    What Blizzard decides to make you do in-game is clearly what they feel is important. They want you to stop and enjoy the world instead of flying in the clouds over the entire continent all of the time.
    I want to enjoy the content too. I love leveling, completing quests and clearing zones. At some point lower level mob fighting is boring to me, this happens when content is consumed and the mobs offers no risk, no challenge and little reward.

    Not eveyone enjoys the same things you do in the game. Do you think blizzards expects us all to enjoy everything They put in the game forever? If yes, why do the come out with new expansions? Its because we are bored with the consumed content and want something new.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    How does what you added onto the rest of that lend any credence to your argument? Your entire argument is that flying is fun, so it shouldn't be removed. You don't give good reasons why flying should stay in the game, except that you enjoy it. Kudos to you for enjoying it, all I see it as is a way to get from A to B, and clearly that's all Blizzard sees it as now.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The way a company was performing in the past adds value to the current stock? Didn't realize that! Somebody better tell those people who sold their Blockbuster stock to buy more of it!!

    So many economics professors in here today.
    you have got to be kidding. Blockbuster profitability dropped and so did its stock value.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    How does what you added onto the rest of that lend any credence to your argument? Your entire argument is that flying is fun, so it shouldn't be removed. You don't give good reasons why flying should stay in the game, except that you enjoy it. Kudos to you for enjoying it, all I see it as is a way to get from A to B, and clearly that's all Blizzard sees it as now..
    really stop putting words in my mouth. This debate tactic is pure fail. Please take the time to read my posts before make comments about them.

  12. #8952
    Quote Originally Posted by Nayaga View Post
    I want to enjoy the content too. I love leveling, completing quests and clearing zones. At some point lower level mob fighting is boring to me, this happens when content is consumed and the mobs offers no risk, no challenge and little reward.
    Well luckily they're making 100 new levels of mobs and content just for you to enjoy!

    Not eveyone enjoys the same things you do in the game. Do you think blizzards expects us all to enjoy everything They put in the game forever? If yes, why do the come out with new expansions? Its because we are bored with the consumed content and want something new.
    I recognize that people enjoy different thinks and I recognize that Blizzard makes new expansions to provide new content. But the fact that Blizzard feels it is important for you to stop and enjoy the world as it is makes your argument about enjoying it moot. Lots of things that people enjoyed have been taken out of the game; old talent trees, elite farming, attunement chains, hardcore dungeons, etc.

    you have got to be kidding. Blockbuster profitability dropped and so did its stock value.
    Obviously you have no idea what I was even arguing about. Barkloud tried to claim that a company who once had a game sell 12 million subs wouldn't be as "alluring" to shareholders when the same game only has 7.6 million subs now. Which is a ridiculous argument because it's been 4 years since WoW had 12 million subs and they're still more profitable than ever and investors are still earning great returns. The future and the financial stability of a company is all that matters to investors, not how many people play their online game at that point in time.

    So, therefore, Blockbuster was once a mega-chain that was rolling in the dough and now they're broke and out of business. So if we based everything off past performance, than Blockbuster would still be a good buy, yes?

    Sad that I have to explain it, really...

    - - - Updated - - -

    really stop putting words in my mouth. This debate tactic is pure fail. Please take the time to read my posts before make comments about them.
    Ah, using a logical fallacy to try and point out a logical fallacy. You are not even arguing at this point anymore, instead you are ranting about what I am supposedly saying you said. Instead of that, why not try to refine your argument so that people can understand it better and it can't be boiled down to "flying is fun, don't take it out of the game!"

  13. #8953
    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    I really wish people like you would stop trying to bring economics into your argument. In 2010, when Blizzard had its highest sub numbers, the combined net revenue of Activision-Blizzard was 4.4 billion. In 2013, after a bad year in sub drops, the net revenue of Activision-Blizzard was *drumroll* 4.58 billion! But wait, how does revenue go up when subscription numbers go down? By diversifying their game selection and continuing to focus on quality gameplay that will keep people coming back time and time again.

    So while sub numbers can be a good indicator for where a game is trending, a marginal gain/drop in subs has little to no effect on revenue and stockholders don't really care about that "subscription" line. They care about that "Dividends per share" line, and the general analysis for how the company is built up and prepared for the future. Stockholders aren't video game fans who jump ship at the slightest sign of trouble; they make informed investments and are in it for the long haul. Therefore, a company with proven worth and financial stability (ie, Blizzard) is worth far more than anything else, sub numbers be damned.
    I agree with everything you said. I do not believe they are going to be able to continue trending at 4.5 billion.

  14. #8954
    I really don't know why these threads continue on. Trying to argue no flying vs the flying crowd is like trying to argue creation or evolution. Neither side will see any reason other than there own point. And the reality is yes it was said there would possibly be no flying through the entire expansion. It was also said before the release of other expansions. In the end it won't happen there will be no flying in the start and by the time the patch comes out it will be in. They can give a thousand and 1 excuses for why they are removing it till the patch but it boils down to they are releasing a content lite expansion and they want to drag it out as long as they can because they can't push content out as fast as they know they need to.

    and if it does and you dont like it unsub or just sit in a city to do whatever you need. With the way the dungeon and raid finder works you really dont need to leave a city for much else.

  15. #8955
    Quote Originally Posted by Barkloud View Post
    I agree with everything you said. I do not believe they are going to be able to continue trending at 4.5 billion.
    With Hearthstone being a smash hit, Diablo 3 picking up steam, SC2 being the go-to game of the RTS genre, Call of Duty being the go-to game of the FPS genre, Skylanders, and Activision's new IP Destiny coming out, I think the company has a very solid future.

  16. #8956
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    You are not even arguing at this point anymore, instead you are ranting about what I am supposedly saying you said. Instead of that, why not try to refine your argument so that people can understand it better and it can't be boiled down to "flying is fun, don't take it out of the game!"
    Flying is very important to me to be able to enjoy content. My game time is limited, very limited. I only have one level 90 toon, I don't have time for alts. I don't want to use my limited game time slogging through level 91 mobs at level 100. It's a complete waste of time, there is no risk, no challenge and little reward. If I can fly at max level, I can get on with achievements, pet battles, archaeology, ore, herbs, skinning, exploring, pet collecting, dailies. fishing and so on, without wasting my time in irrelevant mobs.

    Wasting my time on irrelevant mobs is not "fun" for me. Fun is subjective, not everyone enjoys the same aspects of the game. Image that.

    There is only one reason I play wow and that's to have fun.
    Last edited by Nayaga; 2014-06-11 at 12:54 AM.

  17. #8957
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    I really wish people like you would stop trying to bring economics into your argument. In 2010, when Blizzard had its highest sub numbers, the combined net revenue of Activision-Blizzard was 4.4 billion. In 2013, after a bad year in sub drops, the net revenue of Activision-Blizzard was *drumroll* 4.58 billion! But wait, how does revenue go up when subscription numbers go down? By diversifying their game selection and continuing to focus on quality gameplay that will keep people coming back time and time again.

    So while sub numbers can be a good indicator for where a game is trending, a marginal gain/drop in subs has little to no effect on revenue and stockholders don't really care about that "subscription" line. They care about that "Dividends per share" line, and the general analysis for how the company is built up and prepared for the future. Stockholders aren't video game fans who jump ship at the slightest sign of trouble; they make informed investments and are in it for the long haul. Therefore, a company with proven worth and financial stability (ie, Blizzard) is worth far more than anything else, sub numbers be damned.
    You can't take any one side of this and try to extrapolate it into a cogent argument for financials. Sure their profit went up, and subs went down. They also had increase digital sales which completely nullify a middle man in the normal equation.

    The fact remains, you cannot possibly continue to gain efficiencies at the pace they have and make up for it by reducing expenditures. You can only get so lean on the development side, can only dip into the 'make a new mount' club, lay off so much staff, without eventually hurting your bottom line. The surest way for them to retain high ROI and the dividends you speak of is to keep subscription numbers up as high as they can.

    At least we know what CRZ was finally about though. Too bad they don't publish costs for the their data centers in their quarterly reports.

  18. #8958
    Quote Originally Posted by Sweetpeaz View Post
    If you don't think removal of flight makes WoW even more of an MMO on rails, I don't know what else to try. Common sense didn't work, neither did facts regarding the change in game fron TBC which was an MMO off rails, to the current iteration of WoW.

    Me thinks you just have your mind set and nothing would sway you from you perch.
    It's funny that flying is what makes an MMO on or off the rails. That's fine for you to think for yourself, but don't try to present it as a fact.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barkloud View Post
    Blizzard is a publicly traded company. It is not about just making a profit, it is about maintaining stockholder confidence. You do not maintain confidence by being marginally as profitable as you used to be.
    Once again, you're delusional m8. You probably spend your time not spent on the forums bouncing your arguments off an echo chamber.
    The stockholder confidence thing has already been picked to pieces by others so no further comment here.

  19. #8959
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lolercaust View Post
    It's funny that flying is what makes an MMO on or off the rails. That's fine for you to think for yourself, but don't try to present it as a fact.
    Clearly, I stated "......removal of flight makes WoW even more of an MMO on rails". I know you're smart enough to know what that really means, so please don't make it seem like I am saying things I am not.

  20. #8960
    Quote Originally Posted by Mosotti View Post
    I understand the people that don't like the state of the game and blame flying for it. They are like our ancestors that blamed the gods for floodings. Sure we now know they were retarded and in the meantime we've build dams to control floods, and instead of throwing the virgins into volcanoes, we just fuck them. So yeah, when their hopes will get totally crashed, and there'll be no "amazing" world PvP and there will be no player interaction & love, and in fact all there will be is more down time by traveling, then the rage will start. I have my popcorn reserved already.
    I 100% believe this will come to pass.

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