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  1. #241
    Imagine someone taking your car away, simply because it allowed you to get to places more efficiently than riding a bicycle? They are contemplating this because it allows them to greatly slow down the player base. Holding onto someones belt as they walk up a hill, so to speak.

    For those arguing that all flying should be removed, how about you exclusively use your precious ground mounts you love so much, and let the people that prefer to fly, fly?

    I agree with the comments regarding Blizz selling flying mounts for genuine cash, then mentioning their removal. People spent money on them, or grinding out mats crafting these mounts. Saying that they can be used as ground mounts as well, is the same as saying your car still rolls, push it and be happy with it.

    I think I have finally outgrown this "suffocate" design philosophy.

  2. #242
    Warchief Sylreick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incitatus View Post
    Imagine someone taking your car away, simply because it allowed you to get to places more efficiently than riding a bicycle? They are contemplating this because it allows them to greatly slow down the player base. Holding onto someones belt as they walk up a hill, so to speak.

    For those arguing that all flying should be removed, how about you exclusively use your precious ground mounts you love so much, and let the people that prefer to fly, fly?

    I agree with the comments regarding Blizz selling flying mounts for genuine cash, then mentioning their removal. People spent money on them, or grinding out mats crafting these mounts. Saying that they can be used as ground mounts as well, is the same as saying your car still rolls, push it and be happy with it.

    I think I have finally outgrown this "suffocate" design philosophy.
    Difference being that this is a game. Games are meant to be played, and content to be used. Problem is, is that like a car, you aren't driving to drive (95% of the time), you drive to get to your destination. But in a game, the destination is meant to be reached through playing.

    Using your car analogy, it would be like in a mario game, going straight to the end castle without having to jump once.
    "Believing something is not an accomplishment. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because “strength of belief” is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. Listen to any “die-hard” conservative or liberal talk about their deepest beliefs and you are listening to somebody who will never hear what you say on any matter that matters to them — unless you believe the same. Wherever there is a belief, there is a closed door."

  3. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylreick View Post
    Difference being that this is a game. Games are meant to be played, and content to be used. Problem is, is that like a car, you aren't driving to drive (95% of the time), you drive to get to your destination. But in a game, the destination is meant to be reached through playing.

    Using your car analogy, it would be like in a mario game, going straight to the end castle without having to jump once.

    Your analogy seems to be a narrow view. Although it isn't "logical" to remove flying once someone has acquired it. I can still understand that from a design concept, it just makes the game easier to create if you can limit the player base from doing what they would prefer to do. Currently, we fly all over the place. I do not miss vanilla at all in that view. It took forever to get places. I prefer to fly directly to where I prefer to go, regardless if it is "just sight seeing", or to a daily quest hub, or material gathering.

    If flying is ever removed entirely. I will have no desire to pay a monthly fee.

    If this someone else prefers that model, then by all means rejoice.

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroWashu View Post
    Two words: Timeless Isle

    More words : There are so many bad ones and they do not act on them when reported.
    Sorry, what? I talk about flight paths in WoD and you use Timeless Isle as an example? FYI, Timeless Isle is in MoP. And I don't even know what Timeless Isle has to do with flight paths. I'm not saying flight paths will be better in WoD but don't make any assumptions until you actually try it.
    Last edited by Shiroh; 2014-03-13 at 08:54 PM.

  5. #245
    Quote Originally Posted by Rorcanna View Post
    People thinking no flying will change the community or bring back the vanilla feeling are morons.

    Also, WOTLK was the peak. It had FLYING.
    I don't think many argues that removing flying for a while will "bring back" anything, other than putting a healthy limit on convenience for a while.

    You could put Cataclysm after BC and it'd still be the peak for subs. Finite market. Wish people would realize already.
    Why would flying have anything to do with it?
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  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylreick View Post
    Well, there's the key point. They want to see the reaction, which usually comes after people actually giving it a shot
    Usually when Blizzard floats an idea half a year before it happens, the reaction comes right away, which is probably the reason why they brought the issue up now. Hence they have some interest in seeing our current reactions as well and we have some interest in sharing it.

  7. #247
    Stood in the Fire freakyduck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylreick View Post
    Well, there's the key point. They want to see the reaction, which usually comes after people actually giving it a shot (not being so childish as to unsub, purely out of spite, and their opinions aren't all that useful, if they're really willing to quit over something so simple, then they probably aren't the long term player that blizzard would worry over). The most likely outcome is that they follow what was originally planned, and allow flying in the older content with the release of the first patch. If people actually enjoy it, then I would see no reason to change and allow flying.
    Again, this is the WORST argument of them all. To think that Blizzard would be okay with any amount of cancelled subscriptions from something they change is kinda dumb. Yes, i can concede that they probably have a number that would be considered an "acceptable" loss, but even with that no company is going to be willing to do something that they know would cost them money. Removing flight (even just in one portion of the game) would cause less people to be inclined to buy new store mounts, even if they reduced the cost of those mounts if they only had a ground option, and to think that people would be willing to pay the same amount for a mount they only get half use out of for the majority of the content they will be participating in with a tagline of "Don't worry, you can use the flying aspect of this new fancy mount when you visit the old content!!".

    Also, if you think cancelling a subscription is "childish" you're ignoring the very real fact that actions speak louder than words and by cancelling they show their opinion very strongly to Blizzard about flying being removed. Blizzard doesn't care about the maturity level of the player base so long as said players are paying their sub fees. That's clearly evident by the conversations in Trade Chat on nearly every server.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiroh View Post
    Sorry, what? I talk about flight paths in WoD and you use Timeless Isle as an example? FYI, Timeless Isle is in MoP. And I don't even know what Timeless Isle has to do with flight paths. I'm not saying flight paths will be better in WoD but don't make any assumptions until you actually try it.
    Person was referring to the one and only flight path that actually goes to Timeless Isle. Yes, many will connect to it, but it's in the middle of Jade Forest and it's a long flight from there to Timeless Isle. I think we've all been on many flight paths that don't go directly to our destination as if we were carrying multiple passengers and there were layovers along the way, many of those "stops" are out of the way and cause you to circle around your destination just to get there.

  8. #248
    Warchief Sylreick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incitatus View Post
    Your analogy seems to be a narrow view. Although it isn't "logical" to remove flying once someone has acquired it. I can still understand that from a design concept, it just makes the game easier to create if you can limit the player base from doing what they would prefer to do. Currently, we fly all over the place. I do not miss vanilla at all in that view. It took forever to get places. I prefer to fly directly to where I prefer to go, regardless if it is "just sight seeing", or to a daily quest hub, or material gathering.

    If flying is ever removed entirely. I will have no desire to pay a monthly fee.

    If this someone else prefers that model, then by all means rejoice.
    My "narrow analogy" was based off the quoted "narrow view" of describing it as if it were a car. If they feel like playing WoW is a job, and that they'd rather skip everything and just get it over with, then maybe they ought to take a break, or find some other game to play. As they are clearly not having fun with it anymore.

    Do you not play any single player games, because they "force" you to run through the story as dictated by their maker? Like in zelda, they allow you to ride eponia through that main world map in OoT, but they don't allow you to use it in the areas that actually matter. Would you be the type to get pissed off by that sentiment and not buy the game?

    I still don't see the reason people would get their pants in a bunch enough to unsubscribe purely because they try to make ground travel more viable and restrict flight. It seems like something else is behind it, and the flight restriction is an excuse.
    "Believing something is not an accomplishment. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because “strength of belief” is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. Listen to any “die-hard” conservative or liberal talk about their deepest beliefs and you are listening to somebody who will never hear what you say on any matter that matters to them — unless you believe the same. Wherever there is a belief, there is a closed door."

  9. #249
    Not gona go through 13 pages...


    anyone mention
    Upon arrival to Draenor, players will go through a 45 minute experience to try and turn off the Dark Portal to save Azeroth.
    Yet?

    Could this be something like AQ or is it individual?

  10. #250
    Warchief Sylreick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exaelitus View Post
    Usually when Blizzard floats an idea half a year before it happens, the reaction comes right away, which is probably the reason why they brought the issue up now. Hence they have some interest in seeing our current reactions as well and we have some interest in sharing it.
    Yes, of course there is an immediate reaction. But, as it appears in many of the threads on the subject, these immediate reactions are baseless and have absolutely zero context on the content that will be provided or the changes they have made for the expansion. Unless we have a detailed blog post, videos of max level content or a beta test being utilized, we won't know how it is going to play out.

    Yet, we already have people threatening to unsub, whining about the loss of flight and all of this based on what is experienced in game NOW, not what will be in WoD. Which is why, the complaining should have a strong and well written reason for the dislike, or else wait for the beta to see how it plays out.
    "Believing something is not an accomplishment. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because “strength of belief” is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. Listen to any “die-hard” conservative or liberal talk about their deepest beliefs and you are listening to somebody who will never hear what you say on any matter that matters to them — unless you believe the same. Wherever there is a belief, there is a closed door."

  11. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by aelaelia View Post
    hate flying mounts, world will definitely be more dynamic/engaging by getting rid of them. example: everyone rushes to rare spawn, rapes it, everyone mounts up and flies away immediately ,leaving the ground empty and deserted
    Roughly 2 years and 2 months. WoW didn't come out in early 2002, lol.

  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by usiris View Post
    Not gona go through 13 pages...


    anyone mention
    Yet?

    Could this be something like AQ or is it individual?
    I believe they said this was going to be individualized. Something about the experience being different for boosted characters to go through and learn to utilize their skills, I think. They said something about the experience being along the lines of the Death Knight starting area, a quick lore-filled rundown of what's happening.
    "Believing something is not an accomplishment. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because “strength of belief” is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. Listen to any “die-hard” conservative or liberal talk about their deepest beliefs and you are listening to somebody who will never hear what you say on any matter that matters to them — unless you believe the same. Wherever there is a belief, there is a closed door."

  13. #253
    Pandaren Monk Mukki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalanos View Post
    3 years. An then 6 with flying.
    2, not 3. Classic came out in November 2004. BC came out in January 2007. If BC had landed 10 months later, you'd have 3 years.

  14. #254
    If WOD is designed with no flying in mind, it should be fine.... unless you're a gatherer, then I can see how it might become a pain in the ass. However, Bots thrive from flying so maybe we'll less of them around when they have to run everywhere? I don't know.

    For me, I'd say I'll feel this the most with Archaeology. If the profession stays as it is, I might no longer be able to endure the 4+ hour surveying sessions while watching TV.. if they change it (in Draenor anyway) to compensate, then it will likely be ok.

    I do love the immersion I get while leveling on ground mounts. But the game has changed to make flying more necessary over the years. All those MOP achievements for rare hunting, or treasure hunting would have been a nightmare without flying.

    So I suppose, I'm open to it provided the game is designed to match. I honestly didn't mind being grounded in Vanilla, but couldn't imagine Cata/MOP without flying... so lets see what happens. If they add more flight paths, for example, and make them direct, then that's a good start.

  15. #255
    Pandaren Monk Mukki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    Yeah I'm a "veteran player."

    Playing this game for so long has allowed me to realize that I really like playing the game I want to play.

    If I want to bunny hop between quests, so what?
    I KNOW! How dare those game designer design the game, as if they have the right to make changed to their project! The nerve!

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by Mukki View Post
    I KNOW! How dare those game designer design the game, as if they have the right to make changed to their project! The nerve!
    They really don't have the right to uproot the status quo they created. You saw what happened in the beginning of cata. It will happen again here.
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy." -Alexander Tytler

  17. #257
    Quote Originally Posted by Mukki View Post
    I KNOW! How dare those game designer design the game, as if they have the right to make changed to their project! The nerve!
    actually, we're the ones that feed them the money to even make the game in the first place. we should have more say than them to an extent, because we're the only reason they're still in business.

    this afrasiabi fucker needs his ass kicked and thrown out on the street. he's one of the biggest pieces of shit to ever stain WoW. i'd much prefer ghostcrawler to this loser.

  18. #258
    Pandaren Monk Mukki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    My social skills are just lovely. I get along fantastically with my guild and am very polite to other people in BGs and Raids.

    Hahahaha, oh man. Have you ever tried talking to people in real life?

    - - - Updated - - -

    I wonder how many people threatening to quit over no flying are okay with the Blizzard Store selling transmog gear and level boosts? Lol

  19. #259
    Quote Originally Posted by Dakara View Post
    However, Bots thrive from flying so maybe we'll less of them around when they have to run everywhere?
    That would actually be an awesome side effect of no flying! :O

  20. #260
    Stood in the Fire freakyduck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylreick View Post
    Yes, of course there is an immediate reaction. But, as it appears in many of the threads on the subject, these immediate reactions are baseless and have absolutely zero context on the content that will be provided or the changes they have made for the expansion. Unless we have a detailed blog post, videos of max level content or a beta test being utilized, we won't know how it is going to play out.

    Yet, we already have people threatening to unsub, whining about the loss of flight and all of this based on what is experienced in game NOW, not what will be in WoD. Which is why, the complaining should have a strong and well written reason for the dislike, or else wait for the beta to see how it plays out.
    You're right, but then the baseless and blind support for the restriction/potential removal of flight coming in WoD should stop as well to see how it plays out. Yet we won't see that happen either. This is part of what Blizzard wants though. They want people to react with the information given otherwise they wouldn't put it out there yet. It has been stated since Blizzcon that flying would be restricted, to add this other potential that it might not be part of WoD at all was just them seeking the reaction of the players. To put this simply: The reactions to what Blizzard posted are "working as intended".

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylreick View Post
    Which is why, the complaining should have a strong and well written reason for the dislike, or else wait for the beta to see how it plays out.
    I'm not sure what you expect from people that are voicing their opinions on this subject. A lengthy essay? Bullet points? Power Point Presentation? A simple "I disagree with Blizzard on this" doesn't count as a valid reason to you? Can say the same for every "argument" that supports not having flying in WoD, restricted or removed completely. Immersion will still happen, immature players will still play and torment you, world pvp will still be as dead as it is today.

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