1. #1

    "Class Quests" that Provide Backgrounds for Unusual Combinations

    Hello mmo-championites!

    After browsing some recent threads related to new classes and races, I got to thinking about the idea that some of you abhor and some love. New Race/Class combinations. This gave me the idea I'm sharing now.

    Okay, so many race/class combinations don't make immediate sense in World of Warcraft's lore. While I personally disagree with this notion, I can understand some of the logic behind it. With that in mind, Blizzard could utilize some of their previous technology once more to give us something entirely different and interesting. Here's how it works.

    You reach a certain level with one of your characters (for argument, I'm going to say 85). A host of quests now become available to you to explore. some of these quests take place in the greater world, while some are in normalized (to 85-appropriate ilevel) scenarios. During each chain, you learn more about a class that your race is not usually a member of. In the scenarios, you play a "member" of the class via a refined vehicle system (think LK quests where you are Arthas). By the end of that chain, you are tasked with bringing knowledge of the class back to your race's faction leader, who approves you to "train" others. You then choose whether to train your own people or another race.

    You can also go on your own "class" quest and choose to then spread that training to another race, having learned how to teach your skills in a broader scheme. These choices are character specific, so you can keep passing on knowledge with more characters or you can change who you are "training" for a nominal fee (gold sink). You also wouldn't be able to buy a race change to a specific class until you've unlocked it with this process.

    This unlocks the class for your chosen race as a "hero class," because your original hero is helping them learn more about it. Characters you build of that race/class begin at the higher level (85) and progress as they should from there. Unless blizzard ever decides to unlock all race/class combinations, this system would always be relevant in some fashion.

    TLDR - Epic Quest Lines unlock new class/race combinations through character progression.
    Last edited by Edlarel; 2014-03-14 at 06:57 PM.

  2. #2
    no. i think this is a bad idea.
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Zanjin/simple horde main
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...yhearts/simple alliance main
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...2#post25856782
    Coming soon Expansion ideas: Age of N'zoth, Assault on Agrus, and Age of Extinction(aka the true end time)

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Edlarel View Post
    Okay, so many race/class combinations don't make immediate sense in World of Warcraft's lore.
    Such as? I believe I can, and I say it with reasonable confidence, explain every supposedly "nonsense" combination in the game.
    I can't help but feel my "epic" experience being diminished when I wage battle against mighty Ordos and 10 people in the raid do nothing but /jump and /fart ...
    -- Strych, 90 Orc Warrior, Tarren Mill EU

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    no. i think this is a bad idea.
    Thank you for your opinion. Any reason why not? It's only a basic concept that would be refined through testing and feedback.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosWolf View Post
    Such as? I believe I can, and I say it with reasonable confidence, explain every supposedly "nonsense" combination in the game.
    If you would bother to read the next line, I explain that I don't personally subscribe to that belief; it's just common enough around here that I will abide by it for the sake of this concept.

  5. #5
    The Patient Darknessvamp's Avatar
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    The system does sound interesting and would certainly have some merit with the current classes available but there are of course certain class combinations that wouldn't be doable with this (e.g. Pandaren becoming Death Knights, Goblins being Druids, etc, etc). Although to improve upon the idea, I would suggest that rather than that character opening the unavailable class to the race that can't access it (which I assume would allow you personally to create a character in Ccreation with that class) that instead that character swaps classes to the new class that they have explored, changing the abilities they have access to. Additionally making the class quests available to only classes that would realistically be able to make the class swap would also shore up the idea some more (e.g. Human Mage(Fire, Frost and Arcane teachings) learning about Shamanism from the Draenei and the Dwarves).

    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosWolf View Post
    Such as? I believe I can, and I say it with reasonable confidence, explain every supposedly "nonsense" combination in the game.
    Draenei, Tauren and Nightelf Warlocks, Pandaren Death Knights, Goblin and Gnome Druids, Undead Paladins(I know they can be Priests but technically they are shadow priests/Death Knights are them). And I'm sure there are more but I'm not listing them all.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Edlarel View Post
    Thank you for your opinion. Any reason why not? It's only a basic concept that would be refined through testing and feedback.
    .
    certain race/class combos are lore breaking.
    this is also a stupid way to bring more combos. it should be across the board not in a stupid quest chain thing. new players may want a certain combo but they would have to level something else to get it. VERY STUPID.
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Zanjin/simple horde main
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...yhearts/simple alliance main
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...2#post25856782
    Coming soon Expansion ideas: Age of N'zoth, Assault on Agrus, and Age of Extinction(aka the true end time)

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Darknessvamp View Post
    Draenei, Tauren and Nightelf Warlocks, Pandaren Death Knights, Goblin and Gnome Druids, Undead Paladins(I know they can be Priests but technically they are shadow priests/Death Knights are them). And I'm sure there are more but I'm not listing them all.
    None of those are in the game. And most likely never will be.
    I can't help but feel my "epic" experience being diminished when I wage battle against mighty Ordos and 10 people in the raid do nothing but /jump and /fart ...
    -- Strych, 90 Orc Warrior, Tarren Mill EU

  8. #8
    Field Marshal CamdenQ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darknessvamp View Post
    Draenei, Tauren and Nightelf Warlocks, Pandaren Death Knights, Goblin and Gnome Druids, Undead Paladins(I know they can be Priests but technically they are shadow priests/Death Knights are them). And I'm sure there are more but I'm not listing them all.
    Draenei and Nightelves can already be mages, which is like step one to becoming a warlock. Even so, and this applies to Tauren as well, cultural stigma is not a good enough reason for ZERO Tauren, Nightelves, or Draenei to succumb to the lures of demonic power.

    There were Pandaren out and about in the world before the Mists opened, a couple of them could easily have been turned into death knights.

    Goblins and Gnomes already posses the patience required to study the Light and become priests, and Goblins have already become shaman. Either class could easily be curious enough about the benefits of Druidism to learn the ways of nature and Elune.

    As for Undead paladins, they make WAAAAYYY more sense that frickin' Tauren paladins. *cough*supported by existing lore*cough*Sir Zeliek*cough*

    The thing people seem to forget is that just because a player can be a certain combination of class and race doesn't make that a common thing. Your character being a Tauren warlock doesn't make you suddenly accepted in the eyes of society. Just makes you a Tauren who happens to be also a warlock. Pretty simple.




    As for the original post, I don't particularly like the idea. It's overly complicated, and lots of races wouldn't benefit much from it (Dwarves can be everything except druids, for example).
    Last edited by CamdenQ; 2014-03-15 at 12:16 PM.
    Thanks to Eis for this great sig and avatar! || My 90s: Yurric | Fittz | Jarcey | Cairden | Aibhinger | Rehlos

  9. #9
    The Patient Darknessvamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosWolf View Post
    None of those are in the game. And most likely never will be.
    Sooooo you're agreeing that those combinations wouldn't be doable/shouldn't exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by CamdenQ View Post
    Draenei and Nightelves can already be mages, which is like step one to becoming a warlock. Even so, and this applies to Tauren as well, cultural stigma is not a good enough reason for ZERO Tauren, Nightelves, or Draenei to succumb to the lures of demonic power.
    Except it's not considering being a Warlock means you're cool with using Legion based magic which Draenei and Nightelves absolutely abhor. So yeah being a Warlock belonging to one of those races and being part of the Alliance doesn't really make sense in Lore. As for Tauren, unless the Grimtotem finally stopped being dicks and joined the Horde and a secret sect of them being practiced Warlocks was revealed then I think the Tauren are too much in touch with nature to be cool with using magic that is derived from a force known for trying to burn the world to cinders.

    There were Pandaren out and about in the world before the Mists opened, a couple of them could easily have been turned into death knights.
    That is true however as per Blizzard's strange way of introducing the Pandaren back into Warcraft lore, it seems that most of the Pandaren that were not on Panderia stuck to the Wandering isle and didn't have that major presence across the world until after the Cataclysm meaning it is not likely that Arthas and his armies encountered Pandaren during the WotLK conquest. Plus there's a chance Arthas and his Lieutenants wouldn't have made them into Death Knights anyway as they do resemble the Tuskar a bit much and I for one don't remember seeing any Tuskar Death Knights running around.

    Goblins and Gnomes already posses the patience required to study the Light and become priests, and Goblins have already become shaman. Either class could easily be curious enough about the benefits of Druidism to learn the ways of nature and Elune.
    I'll give a little on the Goblins probably having a chance at becoming interested in Druidism but I still think they only became Shamans is because WoW's brand of shamanism is more about the wild and destructive part of nature which suited the Goblins well whereas Druidism is more about serenity and balance. However as for Gnomes, they take far too much interest in the mechanical and unnatural to seem appropriate for learning the teachings of Druidism. Plus I really don't think Nightelves like them in the first place (whether that's because they came from a race of robot people or are inherently evil I dunno).

    As for Undead paladins, they make WAAAAYYY more sense that frickin' Tauren paladins. *cough*supported by existing lore*cough*Sir Zeliek*cough*
    Although I do agree on the point about Tauren Paladins (seriously, whose idea was that?), I just don't think Sir Zeliek is good enough evidence for it considering there could have been other special reasons for why he still had the ability to use the power of the light especially considering it's not known what dictates the Light and what it actually is in WoW lore.

    The thing people seem to forget is that just because a player can be a certain combination of class and race doesn't make that a common thing. Your character being a Tauren warlock doesn't make you suddenly accepted in the eyes of society. Just makes you a Tauren who happens to be also a warlock. Pretty simple.
    Which is the case with Orc Warlocks and Worgen Death Knights although there are still some class combinations that just don't seem like they would ever happen.

  10. #10
    The Patient Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    So the Paladin trainer is like "This is how you cast Exorcism, now you try!" And then your undead paladin tries it and bursts into flame, and starts over at lvl 1.

  11. #11
    Mechagnome Anyael's Avatar
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    Sir Zeliek and the other undead paladin whose name escapes me in what was once known as Light's Chapel is no longer just a single data point, we now have a trend. If just any race could be a paladin as outliers, we would have seen night elf paladins by now. The fact that we have seen 2 undead paladins just makes it a matter of time.

    Personally, the idea of an undead so devoted to the light that they would put themselves through the torture of using it sounds badass. (see: self-flagellation)
    If you realize that all things change, there is nothing you will try to hold on to. If you are not afraid of dying, there is nothing you cannot achieve.
    -Lao Tzu --- 안 여래
    Quote Originally Posted by Zehnn View Post
    What are you, the citation police?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Anyael View Post
    Sir Zeliek and the other undead paladin whose name escapes me in what was once known as Light's Chapel is no longer just a single data point, we now have a trend. If just any race could be a paladin as outliers, we would have seen night elf paladins by now. The fact that we have seen 2 undead paladins just makes it a matter of time.

    Personally, the idea of an undead so devoted to the light that they would put themselves through the torture of using it sounds badass. (see: self-flagellation)
    You're thinking Leonid Bartholomew, who has never been confirmed as a paladin. He works with the Argent Crusade, but uses no Light-based abilities. It is just as likely (More likely, in my opinion) that he is a warrior.

    And Sir Zeliek is an extreme exception. He was such a devoted paladin in life that his mind remained his own, meaning he has held onto the beliefs and virtues required to remain in the Light's grace. His body, however, was not in his control, which is why he was a boss.

    As for self-flagellation, people who do that do not expect to pick up a sword and shield during said flagellation and charge into battle. An undead paladin would effectively be weakening himself because he would feel his own body rotting, distracting himself from the battle. It's not badass; It's stupidity at it's finest. Why do that when you can be a more skilled warrior who isn't distracted by your own rotting flesh?
    Last edited by Fleugen; 2014-03-16 at 02:38 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If a building's about to collapse, you can debate whether it's better to demolish it or repair it, and you can make political-agenda arguments either way. Disputing gravity itself to claim it won't fall down is not a political position, it's just ignorance.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Darknessvamp View Post
    That is true however as per Blizzard's strange way of introducing the Pandaren back into Warcraft lore, it seems that most of the Pandaren that were not on Panderia stuck to the Wandering isle and didn't have that major presence across the world until after the Cataclysm meaning it is not likely that Arthas and his armies encountered Pandaren during the WotLK conquest. Plus there's a chance Arthas and his Lieutenants wouldn't have made them into Death Knights anyway as they do resemble the Tuskar a bit much and I for one don't remember seeing any Tuskar Death Knights running around.
    There's a thing about this. The Pandaren Monk trainer for Draenei describes seeing the Exodar fall from the sky and thus is already established. That somewhat proves your point, though.
    Gone until the next expansion.

  14. #14
    Mechagnome Anyael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    You're thinking Leonid Bartholomew, who has never been confirmed as a paladin. He works with the Argent Crusade, but uses no Light-based abilities. It is just as likely (More likely, in my opinion) that he is a warrior.

    And Sir Zeliek is an extreme exception. He was such a devoted paladin in life that his mind remained his own, meaning he has held onto the beliefs and virtues required to remain in the Light's grace. His body, however, was not in his control, which is why he was a boss.

    As for self-flagellation, people who do that do not expect to pick up a sword and shield during said flagellation and charge into battle. An undead paladin would effectively be weakening himself because he would feel his own body rotting, distracting himself from the battle. It's not badass; It's stupidity at it's finest. Why do that when you can be a more skilled warrior who isn't distracted by your own rotting flesh?
    Because of your intense devotion to the light.

    Hell, it's like people don't understand what it means to have a weakness is. Newsflash: all good characters have a weakness.
    If you realize that all things change, there is nothing you will try to hold on to. If you are not afraid of dying, there is nothing you cannot achieve.
    -Lao Tzu --- 안 여래
    Quote Originally Posted by Zehnn View Post
    What are you, the citation police?

  15. #15
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anyael View Post
    Because of your intense devotion to the light.

    Hell, it's like people don't understand what it means to have a weakness is. Newsflash: all good characters have a weakness.
    I'll just leave this here. Awesome story someone else linked in a different thread that follows the same theme you're exploring

    http://meghanohara.wordpress.com/2011/04/21/fresh/

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Anyael View Post
    Because of your intense devotion to the light.

    Hell, it's like people don't understand what it means to have a weakness is. Newsflash: all good characters have a weakness.
    Because you're fucking dead and have rotting flesh.

    The only thing that prevents the undead from feeling their own decaying bodies is the fact that they were raised by unholy magics, which are cleansed when embodying, or being touched by the Light. That's a pretty huge weakness to force on yourself for absolutely no extra power when compared to the average warrior.

    You don't see Orcs lighting themselves on fire and running into battle because it'd be stupid to do so. That's essentially why an Undead can't be a Paladin; It'd be stupid for an Undead to CHOOSE to feel their own flesh rotting just to fight the same way a warrior does, but with holy magic that also burns their flesh.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If a building's about to collapse, you can debate whether it's better to demolish it or repair it, and you can make political-agenda arguments either way. Disputing gravity itself to claim it won't fall down is not a political position, it's just ignorance.

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