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  1. #81
    High Overlord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    This post is a bit weird, you're from EU, are you playing on US servers? At prime time (4-11PM server time), DPS only have 5-10 minute queue times for LFR on EU. About 10-15 minute queue times for dungeons.
    EU - Bloodhoof - Alliance. Queues were very rarely under 15 minutes for either and this is at around 7pm. I'm talking about actual time spent in the queue, not the average time it posts when you first join the queue. I can only put this down to an abundance of DPS compared with relatively few tanks & healers. This might have improved briefly at the beginning of a patch or during a world event - but not for long.

    Even when I last played a month or two ago the DPS in my guild were always asking to queue with my healer as it cut down their waiting time by such a drastic amount. Weird or not that's how it was.

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Thyr View Post
    If the game offers more content that can be done by tanks and healer specs outside of instanced content, then i assume an increase of these specs. Currently, tanks and healers are only needed in dungeons / raids / pvp (with exceptions). Everything else, they are literally useless.
    They're not useless, but it's much easier to do quests, scenarios, and the like in a DPS spec. It makes things a bit painful for my Druid. I tank raids in Guardian, keep Feral for a quest/scenario spec, and would like to PvP as either Resto. or Boomkin... But I'd rather not pay for spec changes every time I get the whim to PvP.

  3. #83
    I am Murloc! Rorcanna's Avatar
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    Imo they should just let us have all specs available so that people didn't feel forced to choose between 2 when they have 3 or 4. I want to tank, heal and dps on my druid but I cba running back and forth to trainers and fixing my bars and macros each time I feel the urge to tank.

  4. #84
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eon Drache View Post
    Idk where you get your data, but queue times for 5 mans are much faster these days than they were in Cataclysm. I see more people enjoying tanking because they can still see the big numbers, and most tanks I run into love playing tank. They get to set the pace without getting kicked by a tank, and they still see big numbers. Source?
    that and 5 mans are so fast they are trash so ppl just run them over and over for valor. and HAVE to do them a million times /s
    Why are Dungeons and Scenarios mash-fests that take less time than the actual queue or wait list? What a waste of content design...

  5. #85
    As another note, if you type "Tank shortage" + ANY MMO on Google, you will find tons of threads:

    SWTOR: SWTOR Forums
    Tera: Tera Forums
    FFXIV ARR: FFXIV Forums
    Rift: Rift Forums
    (Insert your MMO here): Your-MMO Forums.

    If you have an easy solution (tip: it's not easy) please solve the "problem" of so many games. You would probably even get paid with a 100% surefire way to improve number of tanks/healers without any backfire on other ends.

  6. #86
    Players made the healing and tanking roles unattractive, by always having the dps pulling and tanking everything in low level dungeons, and blaming anyone but themselves when they are too damn stupid to move out of stuff on the ground.
    So Blizzard bribe them with a bag of extra loot. Doesn't work.
    Blizzard provide content that is then less reliant on tanks and healers in the form of scenarios, but then players complain how that content not needing them, and actually discouraging them is then responsible for the shortage.
    As usual stupid players cause most of the problems that blizzard get blamed for.

    Quote Originally Posted by Milkwolfgang View Post
    As another note, if you type "Tank shortage" + ANY MMO on Google, you will find tons of threads:

    SWTOR: SWTOR Forums
    Tera: Tera Forums
    FFXIV ARR: FFXIV Forums
    Rift: Rift Forums
    (Insert your MMO here): Your-MMO Forums.

    If you have an easy solution (tip: it's not easy) please solve the "problem" of so many games. You would probably even get paid with a 100% surefire way to improve number of tanks/healers without any backfire on other ends.
    This pretty much sums it up.
    The issue is one that transcends any game, which leaves only one common factor.
    The players themselves.
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    I don't understand why we don't have flying so they tell us we will have convenient flight points. Immersion and danger? Here take some coins and fly me there while I read facebook or go take a poop.
    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaerd View Post
    T'is good to see there are still people valiantly putting the "Ass" in assumption.

  7. #87
    Field Marshal Cougar's Avatar
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    - Playing a Tank in LFR puts a target on you for frustrated people.
    Uh, what? I never see the tanks getting bitched at unless they're legitimately terrible. It's always the healers and low DPS taking the brunt of the abuse.

  8. #88
    - No flying, so world pvp will ensue and you will quest as dps.
    Except in a dps vs tank, the tank wins?

    - EVEN FEWER dungeons! (yet 5 more levels to bridge).
    So level through quests like most people?

    - You will have to fight for nodes/herbs more often because you can't fly (or fly away).
    I mean... I have to fight for nodes now... because people fly at the same speed I do.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Milkwolfgang View Post
    As another note, if you type "Tank shortage" + ANY MMO on Google, you will find tons of threads:

    SWTOR: SWTOR Forums
    Tera: Tera Forums
    FFXIV ARR: FFXIV Forums
    Rift: Rift Forums
    (Insert your MMO here): Your-MMO Forums.

    If you have an easy solution (tip: it's not easy) please solve the "problem" of so many games. You would probably even get paid with a 100% surefire way to improve number of tanks/healers without any backfire on other ends.
    I've always seen the lack of tanks/healer as a problem with 'pressure roles'. When you Tank you're it, a 'leader' & if anything goes wrong people look to you first to see what caused the problems, & any mistakes are fairly 'visible'. Healers, if ANYONE dies no matter who or how, even if its not your fault you get looked at. What type of content you do alters the reaction of the other party/raid members but the sentiment remains.

    DPS isn't as much of a 'pressure cooker' as tanking or healing, especially pugging.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
    [12:07:45] <+Radux> i think Bibi should post a super passive agressive message in there. like "OH NO LOVE FOR BIBI. I SEE HOW IT IS. YOU'RE WELCOME FOR CREATING THE SITE. CARRY ON."

    OH NO LOVE FOR BIBI. I SEE HOW IT IS. YOU'RE WELCOME FOR CREATING THE SITE. CARRY ON.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Wacomman View Post
    Being a tank or a healer isn't something you should be specced in all the time if you want to enjoy your class. It's not something that should be encouraged. You should only specc that when you're running a dungeon.
    Except tanks need a whole second set of gear to do their job. At least WoD is fixing that a bit.

  11. #91
    Brewmaster caninepawprints's Avatar
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    I think it might encourage more people to pick up the role of tank or healer simply because they won't have to carry around a whole different set in their bags. When they swap specs, their gear will automatically swap with them. Also, getting rid of parry and dodge is a big thing.

    People have always blamed healers and tanks for the mistakes DPS make in dungeons. That's never going to change. Those roles are easy targets for abuse.

    Image created by Brienna

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleshield View Post
    I'm waiting to see. To be honest, Active Mitigation is what turned me off from tanking (I just don't like how it feels), so we'll see if I like how it feels in WoD.
    The ACTIVE MITIGATION model also turned me off to tanking with my Paladin. However I found leveling a new Monk and learning to play it from the ground up with ACTIVE MITIGATION already in play was fine. Infact I like it. So MoP didn't force me out of tanking it just pushed me to play another tank. I played the Paladin tank since BC. The changes just ruined my Paladin. It didn't feel like my toon.

    I don't know what to expect from WoD, but I am on record with players who refuse to buy a product when we don't know what we are getting. So I am a wait and see if I even buy WoD and my journey in Warcraft continues.

  13. #93
    Field Marshal Nydith's Avatar
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    Leveling a prot warrior is way more fun than arms/fury. but thats the only tank class i like to do leveling with.

  14. #94
    This thread is overlooking a new change.

    Gear will change depending on your spec - This will encourage people to be whatever they want. Then they can also easily switch to a dps role to do their solo activities.

  15. #95
    I am Murloc! Firebert's Avatar
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    MoP decreased the number of all specs, not just Tanks and Healers. It's the ratio between all the specs that's important.

    Assuming each account has exactly one character and assuming that each class has an equal distribution of specs:



    The ratios have barely moved (0.17 more DPS per tank and 0.04 less healers per tank).
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  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Farabee View Post
    Except tanks need a whole second set of gear to do their job. At least WoD is fixing that a bit.
    you will still need a second set of gear. you just wont be punished for not having one if you decided to tank, heal, or dps with the gear you have.
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Zanjin/simple horde main
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...2#post25856782
    Coming soon Expansion ideas: Age of N'zoth, Assault on Agrus.

  17. #97
    I am Murloc! Firebert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milkwolfgang View Post
    If you have an easy solution (tip: it's not easy) please solve the "problem" of so many games.
    Bot/Lore Hero tanks (Varian/Tirion Fordring/etc), or the GW2 method of no trinity (everyone can tank, DPS and heal).
    37 + (3*7) + (3*7)
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  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Firebert View Post
    Bot/Lore Hero tanks (Varian/Tirion Fordring/etc), or the GW2 method of no trinity (everyone can tank, DPS and heal).
    So should WoW/Rift/SWTOR/Tera/FFXIV give up on being WoW/Rift/SWTOR/Tera/FFXIV and adapt itself to Bot tanks/GW2 model?

    Or should players who want that go play GW2, for example?

  19. #99
    I am Murloc! Firebert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milkwolfgang View Post
    So should WoW/Rift/SWTOR/Tera/FFXIV give up on being WoW/Rift/SWTOR/Tera/FFXIV
    I don't see how the WoW/Rift/Star Wars/Final Fantasy/TERA lore prevents bot tanks/hero tanks/GW2 model.

    Quote Originally Posted by Milkwolfgang View Post
    Or should players who want that go play GW2, for example?
    I don't see how the players that like the WoW lore (for example) should leave the game they like just for mechanics. It's always the other way around (see LFD being added to basically all the above MMOs).
    37 + (3*7) + (3*7)
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    SK: 0/1/1 | VT: 1.5/3.5/5 | Cult: 1/0/1
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  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Firebert View Post
    I don't see how the WoW/Rift/Star Wars/Final Fantasy/TERA lore prevents bot tanks/hero tanks/GW2 model.


    I don't see how the players that like the WoW lore (for example) should leave the game they like just for mechanics. It's always the other way around (see LFD being added to basically all the above MMOs).
    I had posted very quickly so I didn't really put much effort :P sorry.

    My point was:

    Is there enough evidence that such changes would be healthy for the game? What's the % of players that would point that as dumbing down? What about players that like Tanking and Healing nowadays? How would that impact subscribers? How would that shape community? Is it a needed changed? Should all games adapt to that or just some? Why WoW should? If WoW did, why not Tera?

    A lot of questions, I know. But these are probably just a few of a much vast pool of questions that must be raised upon proposing a solution. It's not just "Blizz should do this and it would be much better". There are way more variables on the table, but none of us here on forums have their job depending on a possible good outcome of a drastic change like that.

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