1. #1

    Eliminitating gear all together and the bots

    It seems the only reason for people to bot in BGs is to get honor. But what if blizzard just removes gear or gives the players gear or whatever. I think this will make playing random BGs more enjoyable.

    Say what you want but random bgs are still a significant part of pvp in this game.

    Im not familiar with how things work at blizzard but what i do know is they dont seem to explore options. They seem to wait till things get in such a bad position where players are just screaming at them to change the problem at hand.

    Your thoughts/opinions?
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  2. #2
    You think it would be more enjoyable, but that 18 hour long queues because no one will ever want to do a random bg because there is no point will change your mind.

  3. #3
    Thats... egh... ya know? I mean you cant just remove items. Okay, fine, you get rid of boters farming honor for Items... I would play it without items too. But who else would? Probably not a lot of people. Also those folks that want to play Arena need BGs for their Start-Up gear i guess... and the shitstorm for removing items is likely a quadrillion times bigger then the trouble they have now with botters during the day.
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Vulpei View Post
    You think it would be more enjoyable, but that 18 hour long queues because no one will ever want to do a random bg because there is no point will change your mind.
    Yes, the same as geared people dont play arena.

  5. #5
    It would be fine with me if pvp gear was removed from honour. If people dont pvp because its fun for them then whats the point anyway. If its a gear race you want then go PvE

    Could be cosmetic rewards, its enough in other games.

  6. #6
    Bloodsail Admiral dacoolist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulpei View Post
    You think it would be more enjoyable, but that 18 hour long queues because no one will ever want to do a random bg because there is no point will change your mind.
    I agree though, that the only reason half the people even play is for gear. Without gear as a "Carrot on a stick" - this game will decline QUICKLY. This isn't GW2, this isn't StarWars, it's Wow - this is just IMO

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by z4x View Post
    Yes, the same as geared people dont play arena.
    Because the only reason to play arena is for gear.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by banur View Post
    Because the only reason to play arena is for gear.
    Because the only reason to play any form of pvp is for gear.

  9. #9
    I agree that Honor gear should be baseline. Farming BGs for Honor is nothing but a frustrating time sink where you're not able to effectively contribute until you get the full set. Give everyone a set of the Honor equivalent gear and have unrated BGs be for fun/practice and the main Focus being on arena/RBG and Conquest grinding.

  10. #10
    The Lightbringer Ermahgerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulpei View Post
    You think it would be more enjoyable, but that 18 hour long queues because no one will ever want to do a random bg because there is no point will change your mind.
    I queue for BGs to have fun after I'm fully geared. I can't have fun when there are 6 bots out of the 10 players. I also can't have fun when gearing up because I do 0 damage (gearing up enha shaman atm).

    So what's the point of BGs then? To have a bot playground? I personally wouldn't mind having honor gear removed. Maybe have cosmetic rewards that require you to put some effort into BGs or something, but I still wouldn't mind.

  11. #11
    Someone else who thinks the way to fix something is removing gear from it.

    All that would do is reduce the amount of nonbotters as well. A very small group of people play PVP cause its "fun". Most just play it as an epeen buffer.
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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Someone else who thinks the way to fix something is removing gear from it.

    All that would do is reduce the amount of nonbotters as well. A very small group of people play PVP cause its "fun". Most just play it as an epeen buffer.
    If the only reason to do unrated BGs is to grind Honor then abandon them, then the model is broken to begin with.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Bullettime View Post
    If the only reason to do unrated BGs is to grind Honor then abandon them, then the model is broken to begin with.
    A fair point. I've stopped doing Bgs entirely, except for occasional AB/WSG games in the off chance I get motivated to farm Conqueror. If I didn't have to gear up all my alts I'd probably spend more time in BGs but between bots, undergeared boosted players and 10-15 player premades, there's really little enjoyment to be had.
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  14. #14
    Pandaren Monk Archimand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by z4x View Post
    Because the only reason to play any form of pvp is for gear.
    your argument going nowhere.


    ppl do arena for rating, ppl dont do random bgs for fun (at least most of them).


    therfore you will have long bg queue if you remove gear from it.


    ppl will still do arena if there isnt gear cause of the end season rewards.
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  15. #15
    Elemental Lord Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullettime View Post
    If the only reason to do unrated BGs is to grind Honor then abandon them, then the model is broken to begin with.
    Welcome to grinding in MMOs. You think people would farm up shaohao rep if it didn't reward a snazzy dragon mount at the end? Hell no. Same with LFR. I don't pop back into LFR "for the life experience." I just don't do it anymore. Something similar can be said for random battlegrounds. The only reason I'd go back to doing random BGs after getting a full set of conquest gear is for achievements and the potential to wreck people.

    That being said, "dissuading the use of bots" by not "rewarding them" is not the right way to go. Bots shouldn't be gently encouraged away from. They should be crushed.
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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    Welcome to grinding in MMOs. You think people would farm up shaohao rep if it didn't reward a snazzy dragon mount at the end? Hell no. Same with LFR. I don't pop back into LFR "for the life experience." I just don't do it anymore. Something similar can be said for random battlegrounds. The only reason I'd go back to doing random BGs after getting a full set of conquest gear is for achievements and the potential to wreck people.

    That being said, "dissuading the use of bots" by not "rewarding them" is not the right way to go. Bots shouldn't be gently encouraged away from. They should be crushed.
    The difference being, mindless runs through unrated BGs for nothing more than Honor Points and dealing with the frustrating aspects of super undergeared boosted players and the botting epidemic is nothing but a stepping stone to the actual competitive PvP content. And going into BGs undergeared will get you crushed against a team that has gear.

    Grinding Shao Hao rep as an undergeared fresh 90 isn't a requirement to earn gear for flex.

    The Honor grind, esp from Ally side, is a monotonous and tedious grind of trying to carry bots while being fed to the meatgrinder. You spend so much time being a punching bag for others just to get the gear so you can outright abandon unrated BGs.

    The entire model could use some clean up. Unrated BGs should be like normal blind pick in League. There's not much of a gain or a loss. You queue for them because you want to kill time and don't care about ratings. If you do care about rating, then you have the ranked option but everyone is on a similar level.

    Doing away with the Honor grind and just giving people a baseline set of Honor equivalent gear would make unrated BGs less frustrating as there's less reason to bot, more competitive with everyone on a significantly more level playing field, and increase arena and RBG participation as everyone has the opportunity to participate. Conquest gear can still exist as the extra incentive for doing the rated content but removing unrated BGs from the mandatory gear progression path would do a lot of good for PvP and make it more competitive and enjoyable even in unrated environments.
    Last edited by Bullettime; 2014-03-23 at 10:43 PM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by z4x View Post
    Because the only reason to play any form of pvp is for gear.
    However, some people (me for example) no longer play PvP because of the ridiculous gear differentials.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Smudge View Post
    However, some people (me for example) no longer play PvP because of the ridiculous gear differentials.
    The barrier for entry was also made even higher by them not increasing the ilvl of the crafted PvP gear for the new season while also increasing base resilience.

  19. #19
    Elemental Lord Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullettime View Post
    The difference being, mindless runs through unrated BGs for nothing more than Honor Points and dealing with the frustrating aspects of super undergeared boosted players and the botting epidemic is nothing but a stepping stone to the actual competitive PvP content. And going into BGs undergeared will get you crushed against a team that has gear.

    Grinding Shao Hao rep as an undergeared fresh 90 isn't a requirement to earn gear for flex.
    LFR is. And that's just as much of a slogging grind. Hell, you're guaranteed some form of advancement in BGs if you stick at it. That's not even in the case in LFR if you get bad RNG on loot rolls.

    The Honor grind, esp from Ally side, is a monotonous and tedious grind of trying to carry bots while being fed to the meatgrinder. You spend so much time being a punching bag for others just to get the gear so you can outright abandon unrated BGs.
    You'll have gained a decent set of PvP gear by the time you're ready to "outright abandon" BGs, meaning you are no longer the bottom of the ladder. And if everyone is indeed "ditching out the second they get full honor gear" then your set of partial honor or near-full honor gear would in fact put you at the top of the ladder, now wouldn't it?

    Of course, that's not what happens.

    The entire model could use some clean up. Unrated BGs should be like normal blind pick in League. There's not much of a gain or a loss. You queue for them because you want to kill time and don't care about ratings. If you do care about rating, then you have the ranked option but everyone is on a similar level.
    You'd be sitting in queues for a very long time, as there's no incentive for most people to play them.

    Doing away with the Honor grind and just giving people a baseline set of Honor equivalent gear would make unrated BGs less frustrating as there's less reason to bot, more competitive with everyone on a significantly more level playing field, and increase arena and RBG participation as everyone has the opportunity to participate.
    I foresee far fewer people participating, as randoms offer them nothing. If they were inclined to do PvP, they'd just start on ranked. People that don't like PvP... just wouldn't do PvP.

    LoL is a false parallel. LoL is ABOUT PvP. WoW is not strictly a PvP game.
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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimand View Post
    ppl do arena for rating, ppl dont do random bgs for fun (at least most of them).


    therfore you will have long bg queue if you remove gear from it.


    ppl will still do arena if there isnt gear cause of the end season rewards.
    If BGs were more balanced, more people would start playing them for fun eventually.


    BTW. I play every form of pvp for FUN. Most people dont, because they arent true PVP players.
    Last edited by z4x; 2014-03-24 at 01:16 AM.

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