Has there ever been a competent Draenei combatant?

[Skarssen]

I haven't read all the books, so I'm a bit ignorant here.

But why does it seem Blizzard really wants the Draenei to come off as incompetent, pacifist weaklings? I don't recall mention of any Draenei combat prowess (whether it be warriors or mages) in Rise of the Horde. The males appear bigger than orcs, and there was mention of their running speed while on a hunt, but do they really lack any sort of fighting ability? They seem to get cut down by Orcs and Blood Elves with barely any resistance. These are a people with great intellect and longevity, yet they seem wholly incompetent as fighters, repeatedly losing every battle/skirmish they are involved in. Sick of them constantly being attacked and watching them roll over and die like cowards. If Blizzard wants a weakling victim race for the Alliance we have gnomes ready to assume that role; lets give the only beefy Alliance race a backbone for once!

[Super Kami Dende]

From the looks of Yrel and some of the other Draenei mentioned so far for WoD, they may very well be getting their backbone.

[Quenden]

Given how little lore there has been for any real draenei character development, it isn't surprising that we don't have much in the way of notable combatants.

[Martyn 470]

Think of it this way.

Beautiful tranquil civilization, things going great.
Two of your most beloved leaders make a pact with the devil, 90% of your civilisation get turned into the devils minions and try to kill you.
You get saved by Beautiful beings of light and are tought the ways of the light.
You land on a new planet and start to rebuild your civilisation, then the other inhabitants of the world suddenly decimate whats left of your population, leaving a very small amount of you left.

Yes, they may be bigger, but after all the SHIT they've been through, I think anyone would be a pacifist, I understand wanting vengeance, but being taught in the way of the light would quell that and even if it didn't, what are you going to do, kill the entire Orc Population?
It isnt a crime to be a pacifist.

The Draenei are all about the path to enlightenment, violence has never been bred into them, there's also never been a need to have warriors, hunters, sure, but not protectors or warriors.

[Skarssen]

Well when your race has been butchered and hunted to near extinction multiple times I would think maybe someone would consider "hey, maybe we should learn how to defend ourselves so we don't get slaughtered for the uptenth time!" Being taught not to engage in preemptive violence and aggression is different from just sticking your head in the sand and refusing to develop a martial capability for self defense. These are a people that clearly have the physical and mental capacity to create a formidable fighting force, yet they seem more partial to being decimated over and over.

It isn't a crime to be a pacifist

Crime, no. But it IS incredibly foolish to continue that strategy when you have ample evidence that others don't share your philosophy. You can "stick to your guns" and refuse to fight, but those without swords can still die by them.

[shoc]

Until now, Draenei never really had the chance. Draenei lore was heavily neglected all through WoW until now, so it will be nice to see some emergent Draenei characters take the spotlight for once. Maraad is lined up to be the Tirion of this expansion and Yrel is supposedly going to kick some butt too.

[Martyn 470]

Well when your race has been butchered and hunted to near extinction multiple times I would think maybe someone would consider "hey, maybe we should learn how to defend ourselves so we don't get slaughtered for the uptenth time!" Being taught not to engage in preemptive violence and aggression is different from just sticking your head in the sand and refusing to develop a martial capability for self defense. These are a people that clearly have the physical and mental capacity to create a formidable fighting force, yet they seem more partial to being decimated over and over.

They've only been decimated once really, I wouldn't count 90% of the population turning into Demonic Eredar as being butchered / hunted, the non corrupted Draenei just ran away and were saved by Velen and the Naaru, I don't think any conflicts between Demonic Eredar and Draenei actually happened, they only ever got "Slaughtered" by the Orcs and Blood elves, in which they did build up warriors and an army, until the Orcs attempted Genocide, they only had hunters, who would have probably acted as the Town defenders.

As soon as they got near slaughtered to Extinction, they ran again and created the "Draenei Combatants" as we know them.

[Lord Pebbleton]

No idea.
Every time i think about a draenei, I image a blue squid with a male voice telling me "Guuud forrrtune".

[Combatbutler]

Well when your race has been butchered and hunted to near extinction multiple times I would think maybe someone would consider "hey, maybe we should learn how to defend ourselves so we don't get slaughtered for the uptenth time!" Being taught not to engage in preemptive violence and aggression is different from just sticking your head in the sand and refusing to develop a martial capability for self defense. These are a people that clearly have the physical and mental capacity to create a formidable fighting force, yet they seem more partial to being decimated over and over.

The only time the Draenei were actually butchered was by the orcs, otherwise they were experts at running away, it took the legion 25k years to catch up to them. You can see their capabilities working together with the blood elves on Quel'danas pushing back the legion, they are quite good, but it is strange why they can't get things done in the Alliance.

Crime, no. But it IS incredibly foolish to continue that strategy when you have ample evidence that others don't share your philosophy. You can "stick to your guns" and refuse to fight, but those without swords can still die by them.

The main goal of the dreanei is to create the army of the light, to fight the burning legion and as such they usually don't meddle in the affairs of others, only if they think it is important to their task do they really interfere and commit themselves fully to battle.

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They've only been decimated once really, I wouldn't count 90% of the population turning into Demonic Eredar as being butchered

Actually it was more than 90%, less than a thouand Draenei fled from Argus and 25k years later 80% of their population was killed by the horde.

[Ratyrel]

Rise of the Horde suggests that the Draenei were definitely capable of defending themselves, there were simply far more Orcs than Draenei, who were also on the defensive from the start.

[Martyn 470]

Actually it was more than 90%, less than a thouand Draenei fled from Argus and 25k years later 80% of their population was killed by the horde.

Yeah, I know, I knew it was more but I couldn't be bothered to source that, I knew it was at least 90% so I just went with that for quickness.

[Deleted]

No idea.
Every time i think about a draenei, I image a blue squid with a male voice telling me "Guuud forrrtune".

Haha, I'm afraid you've inspired me...


Yes, I realize he's not blue...

[Lord Pebbleton]

Haha, I'm afraid you've inspired me...
Yes, I realize he's not blue...

Ahah, that's awesome!!

[Mental Surge]

Thats odd. It's been a while since I read Rise of The Horde but I recall them being very GOOD combatants. In fact I recall them being described as having better 'magic' than the Orcs' shamans, implying their mages, priests, and paladins were better in combat than the Orc shamans were. Although I guess you could argue that that was because the elements were abandoning the Orcs around that time. Didnt the Draenei only lose because they were incredibly outnumbered? Not to mention the Orcs had demons and ogres on their side. There are also numerous battles in the novel which illustrate that the Draenei are good combatants. In fact, doesnt Durotan lose to a Draenei while invading a city, and only survives because of his pet wolf?

The real question is; what was Velen doing all this time? Isn't Velen suppose to be incredibly powerful? I realize he's a pacifist but when his people are being slaughtered you'd think he would actually do something about it rather than run away and sacrifice civilians for others to escape. Can someone tell me if this was ever actually explained?

[Yig]

Vindicator Maraad is the quintessential Draenei melee bad ass. He is in the TBC cinematics and many of the WOW comics, has a DC Direct figure and a Sideshow Collectables statue, and is featured as the iconic Draenei in a number of illustrations.

http://www.sonsofthestorm.com/viewer...warcraft&art=5

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They are also among the most powerful magi in the universe, and chosen of the Naaru, making them quite formidable with the Light as a race in general. And they are shown to be far from benign when necessary, as you see in the interrogation of Blood Elves in their starting zone.

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Their paladins also serve as main guard forces around the Shieldwall Offensive.

[Matt0193]

Vindicator Maruud was meant to be a competent fighter. He's also one of the few Draenei who are quick to work with his own instinct and insight rather than wait for the guidance of the Triumvate or Velen to act. The downside is that he's Me'dan's uncle, so ofc he's got to be different. Restalaan was meant to be a reasonably strong fighter as well.

But yeah, apart from Akama (Who became a fighter as a result of having to fight to survive), there isn't really any Draenei fighters who are notable. They're meant to be powerful Paladins, something like Alexandros Mograine who used his holy power rather than raw strength much of the time, but that's not really been shown. WoD might change that but I fear it'll be "Look, there's Yrel. Ignore all our faltering Vindicators, she's good!"

[Wyrt]

The draenei were pretty competent in BC. The SOO was lead by the draenei after all. Prior to that they were always vastly outnumbered so it didn't matter how good they were, they didn't stand a chance. After BC they were completely neglected by Blizzard.

[Anevers]

I haven't read all the books, so I'm a bit ignorant here.

But why does it seem Blizzard really wants the Draenei to come off as incompetent, pacifist weaklings? I don't recall mention of any Draenei combat prowess (whether it be warriors or mages) in Rise of the Horde. The males appear bigger than orcs, and there was mention of their running speed while on a hunt, but do they really lack any sort of fighting ability? They seem to get cut down by Orcs and Blood Elves with barely any resistance. These are a people with great intellect and longevity, yet they seem wholly incompetent as fighters, repeatedly losing every battle/skirmish they are involved in. Sick of them constantly being attacked and watching them roll over and die like cowards. If Blizzard wants a weakling victim race for the Alliance we have gnomes ready to assume that role; lets give the only beefy Alliance race a backbone for once!

It doesn't seem you are very familiar with Draenei Lore. They aren't pacifists, and they aren't incompetent, if you couldn't catch that from that from the lore you might want to revisit some books and in game quests.

[Yig]

Meh, don't force Maraad into being connected with the community loathing people have for Med'an. Maraad existed with the conception of the race and Med'an was just something shoe horned into Medan's relations in the comic books. Garona and Medivh are no less bad ass, I shall posit. From the very beginning of TBC he was front and center in artwork and the cinematic, I think people had best just forget Med'an and remember we're all ourselves only so many cousins so many times removed anyways. All non African ethnicities are descended from a single group of approximately 300 people who left Africa at one time, and before leaving Africa all modern humans were once wiped out to less than around 10,000 individuals, human genetic diversity sucks donkey rhubarb.

Hitler was like you're 15th cousin once removed or less or something. I won't hold it against you if you won't hold it against me.

Let's just focus on Carl Sagan or something and look at how awesome Vindicator Maraad is when Glen Rayne and Wei decide to play with him. Yessireee.

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It doesn't seem you are very familiar with Draenei Lore. They aren't pacifists, and they aren't incompetent, if you couldn't catch that from that from the lore you might want to revisit some books and in game quests.

Some people seem to confuse being reasonable and valuing serenity and enlightenment with weakness or something, but if you see a Buddha on the road, kill him.

[Deleted]

But why does it seem Blizzard really wants the Draenei to come off as incompetent, pacifist weaklings?

Actually, that's a completely wrong vision of the Draenei, even based on the in-game only. The Draenei are actually very militant, for example of Hand of Argus control of the Azuremyst Isles or Maraad. What happens is the focus has been on Velen and, since the Draenei are too alien for the Alliance, they are actually refused to participate on the military campaigns.