1. #461
    Moderator Stommped's Avatar
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    Stellar Flare and Starsurge weaved in there. But since there's only 3 charges of Starsurge, I'm not sure if you want use all 3 with Starfire or what, since in the past that was also superior DPS to Wrath but now they increased the cast time.
    Last edited by Stommped; 2014-05-23 at 07:44 PM.

  2. #462
    Quote Originally Posted by lappee View Post
    Sounds to me like they managed to make "hard to learn, easy to master" (comparing to todays "easy to learn, hard to master") but i guess that depends on the level one is playing.

    Anyhow, seems like the rotation will be very simple and there wont be that many "tricks" to be done since eclipse bar moves automatically. Difficulty and "hard to master" come in with movement, not because of the rotation
    It feels like they try to define our rotation with decisions and not with "tricks", but once the decisions for the fight are made it seems to be a very simple rotation.
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    It gets kinda boring after the millionth time, just like discussions on declawing cats, waiters wages in the USA, and anything Cybran has ever said.

  3. #463
    Quote Originally Posted by lappee View Post
    Sounds to me like they managed to make "hard to learn, easy to master" (comparing to todays "easy to learn, hard to master") but i guess that depends on the level one is playing.

    Anyhow, seems like the rotation will be very simple and there wont be that many "tricks" to be done since eclipse bar moves automatically. Difficulty and "hard to master" come in with movement, not because of the rotation
    I imagine a big part will be correct Starsurge usage. You can still do okay just casting it whenever it comes up, but for perfect play you want to line them up with Eclipse phases and burst phases.

    Also, do i understand it correctly that MF last 32 seconds? And SuF will apparently DoT everything in a 5y radius.

  4. #464
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post

    Also, do i understand it correctly that MF last 32 seconds? And SuF will apparently DoT everything in a 5y radius.
    Yes that is correct. Holy shit the aoe fights with that talent will be ridiculous. think of Garrosh phase 1 with that talent LOL

  5. #465
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    I imagine a big part will be correct Starsurge usage. You can still do okay just casting it whenever it comes up, but for perfect play you want to line them up with Eclipse phases and burst phases.

    Also, do i understand it correctly that MF last 32 seconds? And SuF will apparently DoT everything in a 5y radius.
    The Moonfire changes are very weird...MF multidotting will be broken and Sunfire as an AoE dot? Doubt this will stay. I am concerned about what happened to NG, if SS procs still make Starsurge instant and if Starfall is supposed to be our new lunar AoE, while Hurricane and Sunfire multidot will be our solar AoE.
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    It gets kinda boring after the millionth time, just like discussions on declawing cats, waiters wages in the USA, and anything Cybran has ever said.

  6. #466
    Dreadlord lappee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ayla View Post
    Im trying to understand this new rotation. My English comprehension sucks, but as far as I can tell its going to be

    .....

    Meanwhile Refreshing dots before each eclipse and after each eclipse. I think?
    It all depends on the DPET of wrath and starfire, but if the two were equal, then one would cast starfire whenever eclipse was at lunar side (no matter if its going there, or coming back) and vice versa with wrath. Now if starfire is alot stronger than wrath, then we can extend the line into solar eclipse before changing into wrath spam.

    We cant talk about dot usage before we have definite DPET values, but theres couple scenarios.
    1) We use them right after we get into, and right before we get out of eclipse state
    2) We use them once, at each end of the eclipse

    Most likely at the start of the expansion we'll go with option 2, but as our mastery gets higher we'll change into option 1

    Im not quite certain if Astral Showers is passive or on use, but it changes moonfire into being onehit wonder at the high end of lunar eclipse.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stommped View Post
    Stellar Flare and Starsurge weaved in there. But since there's only 3 charges of Starsurge, I'm not sure if you want use all 3 with Starfire or what, since in the past that was also superior DPET to Wrath but now they increased the cast time.
    Guessing we'll use it with starfires, but it totally depends on DPET's

  7. #467
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberowl View Post
    It feels like they try to define our rotation with decisions and not with "tricks", but once the decisions for the fight are made it seems to be a very simple rotation.
    Well, the major trick is going to be when and how to use starsurges. Each one buffs the next 2 starfire or 3 wraths, so you'll want to time them so that the buffed spells happen at the extreme edges of the eclipse bar and thereby hit the hardest possible. However, since the bar auto-moves, you can't sit on a high buff while you deal with fight mechanics. This should, in theory, mean there is a lot of room to differentiate a skilled moonkin that is making intelligent decisions as to when to starsurge and a random guy who just hits it whenever it is available. I think a person who knows what is going to happen next in a fight and is able to pre-plan around it will have a major advantage over someone who is just reacting.

  8. #468
    Pandaren Monk Lora's Avatar
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    the only change I really don't like is the auto cycle at 30 seconds.
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    I'm a prostitute. Men like to tell me secrets. And women.
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    Also....my condolences to whoever is Lora's lover. You got matched up with a madman, regardless of his alignment.

  9. #469
    Stood in the Fire grumpyoldman's Avatar
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    There's so many changes to moonkin that Blizzard should just summarize it all as this:
    "The Balance specialization for druids has been removed. A new specialization called Balance has been added."
    YOU CAN'T CUT BACK ON FUNDING! YOU WILL REGRET THIS!

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    WoW was always pretty much He-Man regarding the story and the characters.

  10. #470
    Dreadlord lappee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynarii View Post
    Well, the major trick is going to be when and how to use starsurges. Each one buffs the next 2 starfire or 3 wraths, so you'll want to time them so that the buffed spells happen at the extreme edges of the eclipse bar and thereby hit the hardest possible. However, since the bar auto-moves, you can't sit on a high buff while you deal with fight mechanics. This should, in theory, mean there is a lot of room to differentiate a skilled moonkin that is making intelligent decisions as to when to starsurge and a random guy who just hits it whenever it is available. I think a person who knows what is going to happen next in a fight and is able to pre-plan around it will have a major advantage over someone who is just reacting.
    Its true, but the rotation itself isnt difficult at all. As i said previously, the difficulty comes with movement.

  11. #471
    Quote Originally Posted by grumpyoldman View Post
    There's so many changes to moonkin that Blizzard should just summarize it all as this:
    "The Balance specialization for druids has been removed. A new specialization called Balance has been added."
    Agreed lol

  12. #472
    Quote Originally Posted by lappee View Post
    Im not quite certain if Astral Showers is passive or on use, but it changes moonfire into being onehit wonder at the high end of lunar eclipse.
    The way it's being described, i'd say passive.


    Celestalon wasn't kidding when he called these fundamental changes, though. Now to see how these work out.
    It certainly solves the problem of Mastery not affecting all of our damage, even though it doesn't really do anything new.

    Quote Originally Posted by lappee View Post
    Its true, but the rotation itself isnt difficult at all. As i said previously, the difficulty comes with movement.
    I think a lot of that comes with us being so used to these things. I could imagine it looking rather daunting to somebody who's never player Moonkin before.

  13. #473
    A tweet said that Shooting Stars no longer make Starsurge instant. Hope they have a solution for our movement DPS, it already was bad ._.
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    It gets kinda boring after the millionth time, just like discussions on declawing cats, waiters wages in the USA, and anything Cybran has ever said.

  14. #474
    Quote Originally Posted by lappee View Post
    It all depends on the DPET of wrath and starfire, but if the two were equal, then one would cast starfire whenever eclipse was at lunar side (no matter if its going there, or coming back) and vice versa with wrath. Now if starfire is alot stronger than wrath, then we can extend the line into solar eclipse before changing into wrath spam.

    Guessing we'll use it with starfires, but it totally depends on DPET's
    The thing is, the DPET of each spell is going to be changing on a per-second basis. If you think about it, you CAN'T spend all your starsurges effectively for starfires. One starsurge buffs 2 starfires, but that's 6 seconds worth of cast time. By the time you'd hit the next starsurge, you'll already be losing a significant amount of your arcane bonus, the balance would have to be off by a fairly large amount if a halfway buffed starfire is still more DPET than a fully buffed wrath. At the very base, you'll probably want to be hitting one starsurge at either end of the eclipse bar (since you get one every 30 seconds, and it's 30 seconds end to end), but then we'll be getting extra charges by DOT proc, so there's still a lot of room for variance.

  15. #475
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberowl View Post
    A tweet said that Shooting Stars no longer make Starsurge instant. Hope they have a solution for our movement DPS, it already was bad ._.
    I think that was intentional. They're really trying to move casters away from moving unless necessary.

  16. #476
    Mechagnome Challenge's Avatar
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    Yes that was my tweet. Moonfire and sunfire would prob be the spam able move on the go with 100% base damage increase.

  17. #477
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberowl View Post
    A tweet said that Shooting Stars no longer make Starsurge instant. Hope they have a solution for our movement DPS, it already was bad ._.
    This is the expansion of "fuck casters' mobility" so I doubt it.

  18. #478
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynarii View Post
    The thing is, the DPET of each spell is going to be changing on a per-second basis. If you think about it, you CAN'T spend all your starsurges effectively for starfires. One starsurge buffs 2 starfires, but that's 6 seconds worth of cast time. By the time you'd hit the next starsurge, you'll already be losing a significant amount of your arcane bonus, the balance would have to be off by a fairly large amount if a halfway buffed starfire is still more DPET than a fully buffed wrath. At the very base, you'll probably want to be hitting one starsurge at either end of the eclipse bar (since you get one every 30 seconds, and it's 30 seconds end to end), but then we'll be getting extra charges by DOT proc, so there's still a lot of room for variance.
    Also keep in mind that it shares charges with Starfall.

  19. #479
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynarii View Post
    The thing is, the DPET of each spell is going to be changing on a per-second basis. If you think about it, you CAN'T spend all your starsurges effectively for starfires. One starsurge buffs 2 starfires, but that's 6 seconds worth of cast time. By the time you'd hit the next starsurge, you'll already be losing a significant amount of your arcane bonus, the balance would have to be off by a fairly large amount if a halfway buffed starfire is still more DPET than a fully buffed wrath. At the very base, you'll probably want to be hitting one starsurge at either end of the eclipse bar (since you get one every 30 seconds, and it's 30 seconds end to end), but then we'll be getting extra charges by DOT proc, so there's still a lot of room for variance.
    I think still gotta see how it's going to work but, I think these changes will make boomkin rotation alot more intelligent and fun to play personally. That's just me though. Choosing when to use your starsurges because you can go with euphoria and gain a haste buff as well if anyone saw that too.

  20. #480
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Also keep in mind that it shares charges with Starfall.
    Yes, but if you look at the change to Starfall, it's going to be mechanically very different than it is now. I don't think starsurge and starfall will actually be competing with each other, you'll use charges on starsurge for single target, and starfall for AE.

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