[Mage-WoD] Mage Beta Discussion

[Magemaer]

Are you happy with arcane no longer having a multi-dot, shangalar? I'm not happy at all with that. Playing against multiple target was really fun factoring charges, dots and abarr.
After this it will be just like most classes. Use x them y, them spam x. Lame.

[Elegiac]

Couple of things.

First off, something not Mage specific but still beneficial is the change to Intellect no longer providing Critical Strike. This is a good change from my viewpoint since it helps alleviate Fire scaling somewhat (since Mages will no longer double dip crit as they gain more intellect). However, the lack of mention of Fire's crit scaling is troublesome.

Secondly, I am very interested in the fact that with the removal of the 90 talents' mana regeneration, the burn phase may become a thing with Arcane again given that we gain Evocation again. I am a little worried about Arcane's AoE, however, given that our primary means of AoE damage will be a point blank spell - something that I don't think is very congruous with us being a ranged class.

Still not very impressed with the retention of Rune of Power and Prismatic Crystal.

[Deleted]

If they manage to pull of the transition of fire from purely 'late' game to being balanced and viable throughout the entire expansion then I will be impressed. Do I believe they can do it? Probably not.

[Rhov]

Not happy with Alter Time change. By far my favourite spell, it added a lot of depth overall despite some drawbacks and reward you greatly dps wise on correct use. Some small tweaks would be fine, but now they removed totally its purpose in PvE situations..

[Elegiac]

Are you happy with arcane no longer having a multi-dot, shangalar? I'm not happy at all with that. Playing against multiple target was really fun factoring charges, dots and abarr.
After this it will be just like most classes. Use x them y, them spam x. Lame.

Multidotting was one of the things degrading Arcane's identity, which will once again become a nuke spec. Very happy with that.

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Not happy with Alter Time change. By far my favourite spell, it added a lot of depth overall despite some drawbacks and reward you greatly dps wise on correct use. Some small tweaks would be fine, but now they removed totally its purpose in PvE situations..

Actually, no. It's gained a lot more of a purpose in PvE since it has become a survivability cooldown rather than "stack it with your other DPS cooldowns and procs".

[schwarzkopf]

Except because it's a maintenance buff still, it's going to be the best one, making it even more mandatory for both Fire and Frost now.

A maintenance buff would infer you need to to maintain your 'standard' dps - as RoP is currently with Arcane. Without RoP as Arcane, I'm losing more than just a damage buff.

They have removed the maintenance part of it - and put it on equal flooring with 2 other dps buffs depending on play style. That is awesome news.

[Magemaer]

Not happy with Alter Time change. By far my favourite spell, it added a lot of depth overall despite some drawbacks and reward you greatly dps wise on correct use. Some small tweaks would be fine, but now they removed totally its purpose in PvE situations..

It was one of the most awesome and fun aspects of playing a mage. I don't see why remove it. It's a huge disappointment.

[taishar68]

Except because it's a maintenance buff still, it's going to be the best one, making it even more mandatory for both Fire and Frost now.

Honestly, I just went through this, and not only are "most of the talents changed" AFAIK, but they barely even tried to fix Fire. Also, making AT a talent that replaced TS and seeing those "new" L90 talents just ruined it all for me. IW isn't even really changed, it's just even more passive now.

GG is all I say. I'll be a Doomsayer until they take Mages seriously.


PS: Sticking Improved Blink on Arcane only almost feels like a personal attack on me ;_;

PPS: Yes, I know this is "alpha". I'm just saying it doesn't seem like they really put too much effort into fixing Mages in the Alpha. Still keeping an open mind, but I'm just saying, in this specific iteration, it's like they're not even trying.

Just curious...if Blizzard intends to have RoP/MI/IF on the same tier, and be relatively equal in DPS, why would RoP be mandatory? I see MI as being the winner for simple gameplay, RoP a little more challenging, and IF an addon talent-watch your stacks and cast nukes accordingly. Maybe I am missing something though?

I am a little disappointed in Arcane's lack of AoE from distance-I don't mind that they demarcated the spells, but AE still requires proximity to melee we don't want or need.

[Polarthief]

Maybe it is a personal attack on you Polar

Just something to add to the discussion - the minor talents, or Draenor Perks as they are now calling them, will be learned in a random order from levels 91 to 99.

Wouldn't be surprised :< I fucking adore ImpBlink, but to tax it on Arcane like that ;_;

Yeah, though most of them are pretty bland. +Damage is dumb for a "perk".


All in all, unless they make some bigger, serious, changes, I'm most likely not coming back. L90 talents feel even worse than before because we're an expansion ahead and they've REgressed from T14 days in this alpha.

[Shakapopolus]

My advice is to look at the notes as a whole (its quite large so you will be there for a while) but seems everyone is getting PvP cut backs to level the playing field. Playing in the beta will give a better understand with everything on the table.



Coming out of Cata and into lvl 90 mana was changed to suit the talents. Im going to assume that mana will return to something similar to cata mana without those talents (maybe even improved with the removal of evocation, time will tell) As the blog says lvl90 was about mana but tacked on spell power to make frost/fire want them too, but lost sight of goal early into the xpac.

O I agree, I am sure that they will revert it an older version of our mana regen. My big thing is we still had evocate for some sort of regen when needed, I am just really trying to picture longer fights where we would be drained with no option, but hey, It's alpha patch notes so I hope I'm right in being sure something more will be clarified. Still happy with most changes.

[schwarzkopf]

Not happy with Alter Time change..

Problem with Alter Time as it stands is that there was no way to use it creatively without gimping DPS. You used it at point X in your CDs. The new alter time is more about creative uses (e.g. casting before imprison etc).

The only issue I have with the new one is that it should remember both mana and health, or not remember either.

[Sereas]

Finally scrap RoP, I really really hate this damn maintanance buff, especially for Fire Mages.

[Magemaer]

Multidotting was one of the things degrading Arcane's identity, which will once again become a nuke spec. Very happy with that.

Arcane identity? It fits way more a versatile spec, being able to both controlling its burst and to aoe via multidot, via cleave, via melee range, via ranged.
It's getting dumbed down, bored down.

[MrExcelion]

Really, really hope RoP doesn't math out to be the best talent. Might me make reroll =( Lot of other good stuff though.

[Polarthief]

A maintenance buff would infer you need to to maintain your 'standard' dps - as RoP is currently with Arcane. Without RoP as Arcane, I'm losing more than just a damage buff.

They have removed the maintenance part of it - and put it on equal flooring with 2 other dps buffs depending on play style. That is awesome news.

1m or 3m, I still see it as an annoying maintenance buff, just not as annoying.

Just curious...if Blizzard intends to have RoP/MI/IF on the same tier, and be relatively equal in DPS, why would RoP be mandatory? I see MI as being the winner for simple gameplay, RoP a little more challenging, and IF an addon talent-watch your stacks and cast nukes accordingly. Maybe I am missing something though?

I'm sorry, but you have to be pretty blind to assume Blizzard can actually maintain 3 damage increasing talents without having one be ahead of the others. Did you not learn anything from this entire expansion and the L90 talents?
The problem is keeping a stupid "damage-increasing" tier in the first place (when really it's a way to keep us doing just as much damage as everyone else)

Zero mention of the problems with Fire and their plans going forward but they wrote up a paragraph on changes to Frost.

Cool.

I was curious about that myself. Cool that Fireball gets a very slow-stacking (old) Combustion effect, but that doesn't fix the issue at hand.

Also, wtf is up with "Brain Freeze not making FFB instant, and stacking to two"? They didn't say what BF does then... If I'm to assume, it decreases the cast time of FFB by 50%.

[Elegiac]

Arcane identity? It fits way more a versatile spec, being able to both controlling its burst and to aoe via multidot, via cleave, via melee range, via ranged.
It's getting dumbed down, bored down.

Arcane's burst was nonexistent thanks to the level 90 talents; these changes may see the burn phase reintroduced along with emphasizing its abilities as a nuke spec. If you want to multidot, go play a priest or warlock.

[schwarzkopf]

Finally scrap RoP or make it a CD, I really really hate it as a maintanance buff, especially for Fire Mages.

RoP is no longer a maintenance buff. It is now only a dps buff. It seems like they have done well with RoP.

[Polarthief]

Arcane's burst was nonexistent thanks to the level 90 talents; these changes may see the burn phase reintroduced along with emphasizing its abilities as a nuke spec. If you want to multidot, go play a priest or warlock.

Or Fire supposedly. Living Bomb will be multi-dottable, but probably with a target limit.

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RoP is no longer a maintenance buff. It is now only a dps buff. It seems like they have done well with RoP.

Except you still have to stand in it and it doesn't have a cooldown. It's a maintenance buff that still ball-and-chains you to it.

[schwarzkopf]

1m or 3m, I still see it as an annoying maintenance buff, just not as annoying.

Well - they removed the maintenance aspect of RoP, that's the key point of the new change.

[Shangalar]

This will make Alter Time a 100% fun spell to use defensively or for movement. Imagine the Garrosh fight, in those 15 seconds you can go kill one of the Engineers and then magically poof continue dps on Garrosh. Or you can use it as a defensive cooldown to restore your health on some fights. It will still remain a PvP choice, more than a PvE choice, but it's definitely going to be used in more fun ways than just part of a macro.