1. #1

    Balance haste breakpoints Q

    So Im starting to get some decent gear finally on my boomy and my haste is at 5,423. My question is is there a certain ilvl i should look at hitting before I aim for the 10,296 haste? And also if my gear with enchants/reforges is able to hit that point will AskMrRobot know and optimize my toon if that level of haste is reachable or will it always follow the crit>haste>mastery priority. Ty in advance =)

  2. #2
    The Balance guide says that 5,000 Crit should be your minimum, so get the closest HBP you can while maintain the Hit cap and 5,000 Crit and you should be good.

    Honestly though, at such a low gear rating, you're probably getting gear quickly (LFR?). I wouldn't throw too much into reforges if pieces are being replaced very quickly. Following AMR you'll be spending 300g+ every time you get a new piece and it tries to maximize your stats.

    Just my .02, but I did the catch-up thing on gear and never really noticed a drastic difference until I finally had the gear to support high haste/crit and had LMG/Cloak.

  3. #3
    Bloodsail Admiral xtramuscle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acousticferret View Post
    So Im starting to get some decent gear finally on my boomy and my haste is at 5,423. My question is is there a certain ilvl i should look at hitting before I aim for the 10,296 haste? And also if my gear with enchants/reforges is able to hit that point will AskMrRobot know and optimize my toon if that level of haste is reachable or will it always follow the crit>haste>mastery priority. Ty in advance =)
    With gear varying so much in MOP from 483 (boosted 90s) to my 588 main for example an armoury would be really helpful. What prag said is pretty close to right, in that you don't want to drop below 5k crit, but again with ilv like mine i can minatain 10k+ haste and mastery and be swimming in 17k crit, where as on my 540 boomkin alt I needed to fully gem haste to meet the 10289 break point and would still recommend doing so. (The extra 7 haste is only required to GCD Cap wrath under lust iirc).

    As for MrRobot, it will always tell you the 5.2k hbp is what you want until: you go to edit stat weights, edit haste and then select the 10289/10296 haste option and save your settings. From there it'll assume you want to keep it each time. In the past AMR was pretty bad, but they've put alot of work in and now it's really good. Providing you know and edit the weights yourself. Without doing so its utterly useless.

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  4. #4
    While on the subject of haste, how much haste are we looking at keeping for 6.0? I've just been picking up haste/mastery gear in our H clears the past few weeks but wasn't sure if we had a number to aim for.

  5. #5
    Bloodsail Admiral xtramuscle's Avatar
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    As much as you can get/comfortable with. Haste is BIS for single target and mastery is better for aoe. Havn't sim'd if u want a balance or all of one etc yet though, sorry. Crit will be what ever we're stuck with but last on our list.

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  6. #6
    With DoTs having fixed durations and not snapshotting, the main reason for finding Haste breakpoints is gone.

    We may find some edge cases (the ability to complete one more nuke during CA) but the effect will be much smaller than in 5.x, so I don't know that anyone has bothered to see how much difference it makes.

  7. #7
    Bloodsail Admiral xtramuscle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erdluf View Post
    With DoTs having fixed durations and not snapshotting, the main reason for finding Haste breakpoints is gone.

    We may find some edge cases (the ability to complete one more nuke during CA) but the effect will be much smaller than in 5.x, so I don't know that anyone has bothered to see how much difference it makes.
    This couldn't be more wrong.
    Firstly DOT durations arn't fixed #hellopandemic.
    You'll mostly be using CA glyph, which is limited by casts, not duration.

    The reason you want haste is it'll allow you to cast more spells using the 'peak' in the sine wave.

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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by xtramuscle View Post
    This couldn't be more wrong.
    Firstly DOT durations arn't fixed #hellopandemic.
    You'll mostly be using CA glyph, which is limited by casts, not duration.

    The reason you want haste is it'll allow you to cast more spells using the 'peak' in the sine wave.
    Nothing you said means that there is any meaningful haste breakpoint. A haste breakpoint would only really help with fixed-duration buffs that are aligned with your casts (unglyphed CA, Macro'd on-use trinkets or potions, ...) Haste speeds DoTs as much as it speeds nukes, so Haste does not give you more (or fewer) ticks during glyphed CA.

    If losing 1 haste means losing 1 nuke during peak, the "lost" nuke will still land at over 99% of peak. That change is trivial compared to 5.x where 1 haste at a breakpoint adds a full DoT tick per cast.

    I'm not saying haste can't be valuable. I'm saying that you will be hard-pressed to find a point where 1 haste is a 1% DPS boost to your rotation. Something similar to that is what we mean by a Haste breakpoint in 5.x.

  9. #9
    Bloodsail Admiral xtramuscle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erdluf View Post
    Nothing you said means that there is any meaningful haste breakpoint. A haste breakpoint would only really help with fixed-duration buffs that are aligned with your casts (unglyphed CA, Macro'd on-use trinkets or potions, ...) Haste speeds DoTs as much as it speeds nukes, so Haste does not give you more (or fewer) ticks during glyphed CA.

    If losing 1 haste means losing 1 nuke during peak, the "lost" nuke will still land at over 99% of peak. That change is trivial compared to 5.x where 1 haste at a breakpoint adds a full DoT tick per cast.

    I'm not saying haste can't be valuable. I'm saying that you will be hard-pressed to find a point where 1 haste is a 1% DPS boost to your rotation. Something similar to that is what we mean by a Haste breakpoint in 5.x.
    You started talking about break points, not me. I said its the best stat for single target which remains true. There will be a point (or more accurately a range) that you want haste to, to BALANCE with mastery, but it is not a haste plateau like currently (aka 10289 haste = good, 10288 may aswell be 5300 for dot purposes because without that extra one you don't get the extra tick).

    You're correct in what you're saying, in that +haste will be + damage, and it'll be a smooth curve, whereas before at certain (break) points there was an abnormal increase in the curve. That will not be the case in 6.0.1. I think you had the right idea but worded it poorly, and inaccurately.

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