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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by hullaballoonatic View Post
    Pandemic + No Snapshotting + No DoC + CPs stack on player + No shred/mangle choice + No multidot raking neuters the complexity and depth of Feral. Bye bye, fun.
    Fixed that. And yeah.

    ...but alpha...
    They've definitely shown which way they are going to go with feral. Changes similar to these will stick around. What happened to their "feral playerbase enjoys the added complexity" -statement from the start of mists? Bullcrap just like their "accelerated release schedule" or "we're much further on development" -statements.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Kraineth View Post
    I believe arrowset was talking about the fact that shred (as it is now) and ravage for that matter, both effectively ignore evasion, since these abilities currently require you to be behind the target. This is obviously only a pvp concern, with shred no longer having its positional requirement, it can no longer be used to bypass evasion.
    Yes, on live, when a rogue pops evasion I spam shred. I'll likely just run and kite in WoD when they pop it.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Arrowset View Post
    Yes, on live, when a rogue pops evasion I spam shred. I'll likely just run and kite in WoD when they pop it.
    Imo this gives me even more justification to go for the lazer kitty talent.

  4. #44
    Crit rating was strengthened with direct damage buffs. Snapshots were not mentioned. Haste was strengthened, but not enough,

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also choosing moonfire talent, you are going to devalue mastery.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Assuming 'holy power' combo points, moonfire talent is going to compete with thrash-rake talent in aoe scenarios.
    Last edited by mmokri; 2014-04-08 at 02:37 AM.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Kraineth View Post
    I believe arrowset was talking about the fact that shred (as it is now) and ravage for that matter, both effectively ignore evasion, since these abilities currently require you to be behind the target. This is obviously only a pvp concern, with shred no longer having its positional requirement, it can no longer be used to bypass evasion.
    That's not really looking at it right if you are shredding you are behind someone which also means they can't dodge or parry you. With no positionals you'll still be able to do this you'll just have to figure out when you're at their back on your own.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by mmokri View Post
    Crit rating was strengthened with direct damage buffs. Snapshots were not mentioned. Haste was strengthened, but not enough,

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also choosing moonfire talent, you are going to devalue mastery.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Assuming 'holy power' combo points, moonfire talent is going to compete with thrash-rake talent in aoe scenarios.
    For PvE, perhaps. However, moonfire will be superior to other two in PvP with the exception of comps like Kitty Cleave and Ebola where Thrash maybe good.

  7. #47
    And for our next trick - In Warcraft 4 we are going to remove every unit except the Footman and the Grunt but they a BOTH getting 20% more health and 20% more damage!

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by mmokri View Post
    Also choosing moonfire talent, you are going to devalue mastery.
    No you won't, seeing as your bleed uptime shouldn't suffer.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Karlzone View Post
    No you won't, seeing as your bleed uptime shouldn't suffer.
    Ya but does Blizzard treat the cat moonfire as a bleed or magic dot? If it is consider a magic dot, does haste boost it, as mastery only works on bleed. The cat moonfire might be excellent at the start of expansion but as we progress and we getting more mastery, the cat moonfire may not scale as well as our mastery boosted bleeds and might end up being a sub-par talent 1 or 2 tier into expansion.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by trifrost View Post
    Ya but does Blizzard treat the cat moonfire as a bleed or magic dot? If it is consider a magic dot, does haste boost it, as mastery only works on bleed. The cat moonfire might be excellent at the start of expansion but as we progress and we getting more mastery, the cat moonfire may not scale as well as our mastery boosted bleeds and might end up being a sub-par talent 1 or 2 tier into expansion.
    it's magic that scales with our attack power i believe.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Kojo View Post
    it's magic that scales with our attack power i believe.
    And that will be a problem 1 or 2 tier into expansion as both our rip/rake/thrash bleed get boost by AP/Mastery and cat moonfire only get boosted by AP. The power scaling between the 3 bleeds and cat moonfire will widen over time. Even if Blizzard make cat moonfire scale with haste, do we really want to go for haste over mastery?

  12. #52
    The Lightbringer Elunedra's Avatar
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    maybe moonfire dot looses value later on in the expansion, but i could still see it having a higer DPE then shred (as shred doenst scale on mastery either)
    so in the end you could still want to use it, evne if does a lower % of your overall dps

    since it likely takes up the spot of 1 shred every x seconds, in your rotation
    TREE DURID IS 4 PEE

  13. #53
    I don't know why people are so sure they will use moonfire for pvp.

    With passive SR and the SR glyph you can pounce + 5 CP RIP out of the opener, it is pretty OP. Also, keep in mind that the pounce DOT was buffed and may end up doing decent damage. If it does, you will apply a 40% stronger version of it, you will have 3 dots rolling before the stun finish.

    If you go for moonfire instead, you will need to pounce + SR - which costs 80 energy! Even with TF you will still need some time to get a 5 cp RIP rolling, and you are likely to be controled even before you can set a rip on the target.

    Unless moonfire dot is very powerful, I don't see myself using it instead of perma SR.
    Last edited by Knolan; 2014-04-08 at 08:03 PM.

  14. #54
    After seeing the powerful new druid glyphs, including a 10% damage reduction in cat form glyph and one that heals you for 5% of your health when you change forms, I'm starting to change my mind and now leaning now towards taking perma SR for pvp since I won't have to use a precious glyph spot on savagery.

    The new glyphs are just too good to pass up.

    Incidentally, as someone with both a hunter and a druid, druids seem to be faring a lot better with this development team than hunters.
    Last edited by Arrowset; 2014-04-08 at 08:37 PM.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Arrowset View Post
    one that heals you for 5% of your health when you change forms,
    http://beta.wowdb.com/spells/159453-...he-shapemender
    Balance, Restoration

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Knolan View Post
    I don't know why people are so sure they will use moonfire for pvp.

    With passive SR and the SR glyph you can pounce + 5 CP RIP out of the opener, it is pretty OP. Also, keep in mind that the pounce DOT was buffed and may end up doing decent damage. If it does, you will apply a 40% stronger version of it, you will have 3 dots rolling before the stun finish.

    If you go for moonfire instead, you will need to pounce + SR - which costs 80 energy! Even with TF you will still need some time to get a 5 cp RIP rolling, and you are likely to be controled even before you can set a rip on the target.

    Unless moonfire dot is very powerful, I don't see myself using it instead of perma SR.

    What are you talking about? If you take the SR passive talent you wouldn't take the SR glyph since it would be redundant. The way I see it you have two options:


    Option 1: SR glyph + moonfire talent.
    Keeping up SR isn't that hard, but it's most problematic during the opener because given enough reaction time people can get away after Pounce wears out, before you get a 5cp rip off (less so with TF thrown in, but in can happen - especially in an arena setting with team cc).

    The glyph giving a 40ish sec SR means there's plenty of time for an opener, and you have a great utility spell in a ranged cp builder that can be used to keep people in combat and stomp totems from range (something that was really annoying before), eat a grounding totem, interrupt a flag cap, etc.

    Option 2: SR passive talent + a free glyph slot
    I use the SR passive talent which frees up a glyph spot. Seeing as some of the new glyphs are really good - for e.g. Nine Lives glyph being mandatory for most comps we run - this is the only reason i find passive SR to be a compelling talent.


    However, after consideration I feel that I have to go with option 1 simply because passive SR means i will no longer have a ranged cp dump and no way to proc PS unless they give us some other finisher. I believe this makes SR passive a deal breaker.


    Quote Originally Posted by Arrowset View Post
    After seeing the powerful new druid glyphs, including a 10% damage reduction in cat form glyph and one that heals you for 5% of your health when you change forms, I'm starting to change my mind and now leaning now towards taking perma SR for pvp since I won't have to use a precious glyph spot on savagery.

    The new glyphs are just too good to pass up.

    Incidentally, as someone with both a hunter and a druid, druids seem to be faring a lot better with this development team than hunters.
    In regards to glyphs our current mandatory ones were Barkskin, Cat Form, Savagery. Barkskin can probably be swapped out for Nine Lives as I have a feeling the latter will be much better.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by wow View Post
    Hmm, ok- but this one still seems essential:

    http://wod.wowhead.com/spell=159444

  18. #58
    Oh I completely misunderstood the glyph effect, I checked it again on wowhead, you are indeed correct.

    Well, I will have to check for the damage done by FB and moonfire and the amoung of stuns my comp will have before deciding.

  19. #59
    I guess 10% reduction is gift for melees, otherwise I cant understand logic.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by mmokri View Post
    I guess 10% reduction is gift for melees, otherwise I cant understand logic.
    A number of classes get 10% damage reduction or something close to it, but making it a glyph is dumb since who in their right mind wouldn't take that glyph? Either make it baseline or not a part of the spec at all.

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