1. #1

    Help with optimising combat

    So I made a post here a while ago about how to improve my dps, and it seriously helped a lot, started pulling much much higher numbers.
    I still have a question however, when I look at the parses raidbots.com/epeenbot/us/baelgun/wodah/
    Looking at Malkorok im able to do ~323k dps however some people who I assume are really near my ilvl can do 400k
    world of logs: worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-bsro5wbnplyhuyfj/details/10/?s=27&e=389

    Any help would be appreciated, Thanks!

  2. #2
    That is a pretty easy answer actually. You aren't cleaving.

    As with any combat parse on a fight with multiple adds, the parse that has the highest cleave uptime will almost always be at the top. In most situations, the top rogues will specifically be designated to cleave targets down (we are the most efficient at it) while the other classes focus globals on the boss for faster kill times. Those faster kill times along with the higher cleave damage are certainly a larger portion of the damage discrepancy you are experiencing than anything to do with your rotation or gameplay.

    Just looking at your parse information gives me little to go on, unless I could actually see you do the fight via a stream or something similar. I did notice that your SnD uptime was at 94% which is a little low considering the fight itself. I would expect something along the lines of 97-99% uptime but even that is negligible to overall damage so long as you were doing some kind of damage during that 3% downtime.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by drattack View Post
    That is a pretty easy answer actually. You aren't cleaving.

    As with any combat parse on a fight with multiple adds, the parse that has the highest cleave uptime will almost always be at the top. In most situations, the top rogues will specifically be designated to cleave targets down (we are the most efficient at it) while the other classes focus globals on the boss for faster kill times. Those faster kill times along with the higher cleave damage are certainly a larger portion of the damage discrepancy you are experiencing than anything to do with your rotation or gameplay.

    Just looking at your parse information gives me little to go on, unless I could actually see you do the fight via a stream or something similar. I did notice that your SnD uptime was at 94% which is a little low considering the fight itself. I would expect something along the lines of 97-99% uptime but even that is negligible to overall damage so long as you were doing some kind of damage during that 3% downtime.
    What exactly does that have to do with Malkorok? Malk is a single target fight. It isn't possible to cleave on it.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by SinAscendant View Post
    What exactly does that have to do with Malkorok? Malk is a single target fight. It isn't possible to cleave on it.
    he spawns blobs that slow players movement speed

  5. #5
    Heroic Malk has adds IIRC?

  6. #6
    Oh, my mistake. Don't know why I was assuming Norm, haha

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by drattack View Post
    Just looking at your parse information gives me little to go on, unless I could actually see you do the fight via a stream or something similar. I did notice that your SnD uptime was at 94% which is a little low considering the fight itself. I would expect something along the lines of 97-99% uptime but even that is negligible to overall damage so long as you were doing some kind of damage during that 3% downtime.
    It's possible for SnD to fall off if he was assigned orb-soaking duty during the blood rage phase (and hence not on the boss) or something. There are circumstances in most fights that can lead to SnD downtime. Lower SnD uptime doesn't say anything without context. Point in fact, in my guild I am assigned to melee puddle soaking (so I spend some time out of melee range of the boss). Not really a huge effect on SnD uptime but it does lead to damage loss (and I'm lower on meters than most other fights because of it).

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowboy View Post
    It's possible for SnD to fall off if he was assigned orb-soaking duty during the blood rage phase (and hence not on the boss) or something. There are circumstances in most fights that can lead to SnD downtime. Lower SnD uptime doesn't say anything without context. Point in fact, in my guild I am assigned to melee puddle soaking (so I spend some time out of melee range of the boss). Not really a huge effect on SnD uptime but it does lead to damage loss (and I'm lower on meters than most other fights because of it).
    Yeah, thats exactly what im appointed to doing. I am the one who soaks orbs and who soaks melee puddle so keeping SnD up 100% of time is proving to be rather challenging (for me anyways).

    As for the cleave, I thought it might be that, but I was wondering if there was something else because people seem to be able to do similar damage on Iron juggernaut despite that one having no adds.

  9. #9
    The add really doesn't have a lot of health and if everyone is cleaving it, it's gonna die fast anyway, so it won't be very impactful on anyone's damage if everyone is hitting it. In general you want the add to die pretty fast anyway for reasons of mobility.

  10. #10
    Again, we aren't discussing proper boss mechanics, were discussing why damage is lower than other rogues. The answer remains, you aren't cleaving.

    As for Iron Juggernaut, that is simply a matter of doing the strategy where you never leave during the siege mode, and you properly manage insight, trinket procs, and cooldowns. Other than that, you need a very good amount of raid dps to kill the boss as fast as possible so that lust uptime is more of factor. For those of you rogues who think you are doing everything right but can't compete with top parsing rogues, you might be right. It is possible that you are messing something up in the rotation, or not optimising properly. However, a majority of the time, the top parses are a combination of good mechanics, and fast kill times. The less healers you bring to a fight, the more damage you and your group can do effectively, the more vengeance your tank can stack to do more damage the faster the boss will die.

    I am willing to look at your Juggernaut parses if you link me specific parses and point out any mistakes or improvements that can be made.

  11. #11
    Blademaster Bojos's Avatar
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    You aren't using ks in your opener before ar+sb which you should. You should be using 2 ks between every other ar+sb, as in 1 killing spree just before ar is ending and 1 ks before ar+sb is off cd.

    It should look something like this. ks-ar+sb-ks-ar+sb-ks-ks-ar+sb-ks-ar+sb-ks-ks.

    This standard cd sequence also works quite well on malkorok to ks the adds with blade flurry, you can delay in the ar+sb downtime cycle where you only use 1 ks inbetween, you can't however delay ks in the cycle where you should use 2 inbetween, because that means either waiting extra seconds for both ks+ar or skipping another ks entirely which is bad.

    Anyway the most important thing to note is that you are using to few killing spree's and that gimps your dps by quite a bit.

    Edit. The way to most effectively do as many ks as possible without delaying ar+sb is to either cut ar+sb when they are both up, or at the end of ar (at 5-4 sec) start building up to around 8 cps and use ks as late as possible, maxium output is to cut in on ar with as little as possible.

    According to pathal cutting ar+sb with killing spree yields the greatest dps according to simcraft in bis gear but stating that it might not be true for every gear level.
    Last edited by Bojos; 2014-04-17 at 11:34 PM.

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