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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    This why I(and others) suggest give tanks an ability to take X amount of damage of a party member , like in swtor and warhammer.
    What does that add to gameplay? Why not bring more healers instead?

  2. #42
    The crux of the issue for me is the way Blizzard designed tanks. They're essentially gods, designed to absorb multiple hits (without healing) from a mob who would put out 4x the DPS of any player. Tanks in other games aren't ever that defensively stacked, they're mandatory to tank a boss for an extended period (due to long periods of mitigating damage), but they couldn't hero mode the last 5-10% of a boss or go 2+ white hits without healer intervention. On top of that Tanks do very limited damage outside of vengeance, usually in other games tanks do what they aim for them to do in WoD; decent but not competitive DPS without the aid of gimmicky buff.

    If they toned down boss white damage, they could revoke tank's god status. Slap on taunt mitigating damage, and they'd have a place in PvP again as moderate damage, high survival, moderate to high control characters. But in the current climate, tanks are too godly for PvP.
    Last edited by RapBreon; 2014-04-29 at 06:21 AM.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    This why I(and others) suggest give tanks an ability to take X amount of damage of a party member , like in swtor and warhammer.
    That is a change I'm hoping for since SW:TOR came out. Example wish list for Prot Paladins (blatant copy of SW:TOR Guardian abilities + a bit of editing):

    Reckoning - 15 sec cooldown - Taunts the target to attack you, and increases threat that you generate against the target by 200% for 3 sec. Player targets deal 30% less damage when attacking anyone other than you. Lasts 5 seconds.

    Blessing of Righteous Defense - no cooldown - Place a blessing on a friendly target. While active, the protected player takes 5% less damage. In addition, so long as you remain within 15 yards of the protected player, 50% of all incoming damage from enemy players is transferred back to you.

    Divine Surge - 1 minute cooldown - Taunts all enemies within 15 yards, forcing them to attack the Paladin for 5 seconds. Also causes affected player targets to deal 30% less damage when attacking anyone other than you. Lasts 5 seconds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reveries1 View Post
    Tanks in RBG's make sense I hope more specs are played in 6.0 besides bears.
    Unfortunately not going to happen. That would mean expanding other tanks toolkit significantly. I share your hope though
    Last edited by mezmer1411; 2014-04-29 at 06:55 AM.

  4. #44
    Herald of the Titans Matt0193's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    My Mistweaver will give you nightmares.

    Why doe dps and healers 'deserve' a role in pvp? What makes them so special?
    Because you can lockout a healer from healing but you can't lockout a Tank from using defensives. Without DPS you'd just be slapping each other to death, very much like Holy Paladin duels in Vanilla where whoever got the first hit in generally won a very long drawn out fight. That's the problem with Tanks, they force a long drawn out fight that's boring as fuck for anyone except the Tank. I played a Warr/HPriest/Dpriest in Arena last night and it was fucking aids. Between strong defensives and double healer he might as well have been a Tank for all we could do to him or his partners. How many people hate teams that wait for Dampening as it is? How much more of a nightmare would it be with variants of ATC?

    Tanks don't belong in 2/3/5 brackets, they basically ruin the enjoyment for everyone simply because of the nature of their role. If they do no damage they serve no purpose yet if they have damage and the survival of a cockroach then they retarded. They shouldn't even be in RBGs because of how broken avoidance is and how much they seem to hardcounter Melee while letting wizards enjoy the game. Either Tanks need drastic reworking or they need to be pushed out of PvP alltogether and considering how Blizzard have already said they like tanks as they are in PvE and they're shedding buttons already, I wouldn't expect a brand new toolkit.

    Quite frankly if it's the choice between trying to balance what we have and adding in another role and trying to balance it, I'd rather they didn't. If they go out of their way to bring tank gameplay into Battlegrounds they might as well have added a new class.
    "Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it." - Ayn Rand

  5. #45
    I thought Tanks were relevant in RBGs for Flag carrier maps. Then again I don't do RBGs...I would like too, looks fun. I never really figured they mattered in Arena. More than likely I'm all together wrong. I don't mind Tanks having a place in PvP though, absorb damage from your glass cannons etc. But it would be hard to balance out.

  6. #46
    But the game has evolved a lot from wrath ATC games. The tanks have some buttons that let them get hit by big bad bosses, but those buttons largely don't function as well in pvp because of the lack of vengeance currently. What that leaves them with is the toolkit that their dps specs also have. I think what people are asking for is something that the WoD changes will allow blizzard to actively pursue, which is a role for tank classes in general PvP. Look at the steps they have taken...

    1.) Changed tank dps from vengeance based to just straight up damage, but lower than a dps.
    2.) Removed button bloat and CC options and moved most of that from baseline to talent choices
    3.) they say that they are going to slow down damage and healing, but who knows if that will actually happen

    I think in an environment where games are based around mana usage, smart CC and timed burst that a tank would have a very useful role in pvp. I do think though, that in order for it to work, the tanks would have to get a pvp variant of their taunt much like what people have talked about. So the tank role would essentially be to support and protect players, while putting out constant low pressure. I think that is something that can both be interesting and fun for everyone involved.

    Now, with all that said I don't think it will ever happen. The current Blizzard dev team does not seem to have the interest in expanding on gameplay to include more players and styles. They seem more interested in making the game easier to start (dwindling subscriber base) while preserving the fantasy of the game (younger audience needed to sustain income).

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrean View Post
    The current Blizzard dev team does not seem to have the interest in expanding on gameplay to include more players and styles. They seem more interested in making the game easier to start (dwindling subscriber base) while preserving the fantasy of the game (younger audience needed to sustain income).
    This is very true. They are too set in their support of the triad in PVE, and the DPS/DPS/Healer situation in PVP. Tanks throw a wrench in that, and the developers either don't like it or don't know what to do about it (I suspect its the former). The whole "tanks are irritating in PVP" is at best a strawman argument; if being irritating is the criteria for removal from PVP frost mages wouldn't exist.

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