Do you agree "if you don't raid, you don't need raid gear"?

[Deleted]

They are going about it the wrong way in my opinion..

New tier-gear is part of the new game content and even the casual player will want a chance to wear it. Removing the Tier recolors from the LFR system is a bad choice because it will remove they joy of owning a piece of the end-game gear from many players.

I can understand Blizzard wanting to push more people into doing the normal/hard raids.. but when their system already demands alot of preperation, add-ons, external communication programs, studying role tactics and adjusting your gear with external guides, with this exclusion, they are shooting down the casual player who wants a taste of an end-game set.

Honestly.. not many people have the hours to do a proper raid. I don't think this is a smart choice.

[Kelimbror]

And that world content would be...

Asking for the same subpar design is not what we should be doing, so no, I don't agree. Nothing needs to be a stepping stone to anything. People like different content. They want to progress through that content. Just let them. You generally don't understand the concept at all, but that's ok. Not going to waste another 5 minutes trying to explain it. Acting like raiding is the end all, be all is your deal...not mine. But hey, I'm sure you'll really love you some WoD. Enjoy it before they flip flop to the other extreme where raiding is marginalized in favor of other content you don't understand. Leaving this train wreck thread before I read anymore of these 'wonderful' posts.

[Txiv]

I guess I would have to ask why people do not want to raid? That's wow now. It wasn't like that in vanilla bu IT IS that now for pve content. Dungeons are filler to get to raiding. Exploration and quests are supplements to story not the focus. You can feel free to not raid but this game is designed by blizzard with the intention everyone wants to raid. You kind of have to get on board if you want gear and progression.

[Tisane]

Depends, it doesn't have to be equally good as raiding gear, but I'd still like non-raiding gear to be at least close to it, even if it's just for the sake of farming mobs. Farming mobs all year long using low DPS gear would be quite boring to me. Farming mobs while still having the opportunity to use higher DPS gear would make it more 'enjoyable' to me.

[Lesali]

What is the point of getting raid gear if you don't raid? Also, how do you intend to get raid gear without raiding?

[Cute Chen]

I mostly agree, but there needs to be some sense of item level progression for non-raiders. It just feels right to get a slight upgrade every now and then, making questing (and other casual stuff) easier.

[Tychus]

Well, is there any "Raid Gear" in the game, per se? I don't mean gear-that-drops-in-raids, I mean gear with +Raid Power or something. Otherwise what does the term even mean? Lootmilling is how themepark MMOs a la WoW string people along, even the nonraiders and minraiders; so if you just leave "raid gear" (aka "gear") to just "raids", then it'll probably be a fiscal negative for the Blizz Boys when people get bored and start wandering off.

[Buu]

They are going about it the wrong way in my opinion..

New tier-gear is part of the new game content and even the casual player will want a chance to wear it. Removing the Tier recolors from the LFR system is a bad choice because it will remove they joy of owning a piece of the end-game gear from many players.

I can understand Blizzard wanting to push more people into doing the normal/hard raids.. but when their system already demands alot of preperation, add-ons, external communication programs, studying role tactics and adjusting your gear with external guides, with this exclusion, they are shooting down the casual player who wants a taste of an end-game set.

Honestly.. not many people have the hours to do a proper raid. I don't think this is a smart choice.

Give and take. As they remove set pieces from LFR, which is, again, a scenic route to follow the story of the patch, they are re-tunning Normal and Heroic to be FLEXIBLE. So you can have a spot in raids, without compromising yourself.
If you have enough skill to carry your weight, fine, you can keep doing it with different groups, as much as you can. Same way as LFR. If you can not carry your weight, it's not really their fault.

Of course there is a negative side in doing so, but I'm with the "wait and see" people in this one.

[markdall]

I like WoD less the more I hear.

[Merchy3]

I definitely agree, I think players should always try to improve and set a goal for yourself higher than lfr. I'm sick of people saying they don't have time because that's just a lame excuse people tell them self but isn't true. Shoot to higher stars, you'll have sooo much more fun.

[Hardkorr]

It's a step in the right direction, but for it to make sense, the fundamental focus of the game would need to change completely. Such as all the quests didn't reward gear, but the main rewards were just story and xp. Gear is currently the main focus/driving point of WoW, but it always wasn't that way and it always needn't be.

[Natiry427]

You only deserve rewards equal to the amount of effort you wish to put into what you do. The rewards will be there, waiting for those who deserve them. Do you deserve them? That remains to be answered by you and you alone, through action, not words.

This guy gets it.

[Deleted]

The whole Topic Franchise of no Tier in LFR and Raid Gear and such has become trivial and boring.

Here's the thing. If you don't intend to Raid you don't need the Gear as much as others, doesn't mean you won't get it, but usually you aren't the highest Priority on Blizz's list. Simple as that.

Still, LFR is (sadly) a Raid. More like a Simulator, but still - a Raid. So you get "Raid Gear". Now in WoD, though, they actually make a good move here. You won't get Tier Sets from it. You won't get that specific Style the Tier Set has. There's incentive to MOVE ON from LFR, into Flex, which then might again light a Spark and might get you into Normals/Heroics. The thing was that everything Raiding stood for has been given to you via LFR, making some people and especially New Players just run LFR for the sake of it. Why care for higher iLvL/different Color? YOU HAVE TIER, you have a Jackpot - Give a fuck about Color or iLvL. Now than incentive is for Flex and Higher. It tricks a certain kind of Player into actually being interested in Raiding. And it's fine if that is just Flex. As long as they don't sit in some LFR Queue and socialize with other Players, from their Server, or put in the time to actually find a Group via Trade or w/e. You do LFR, see the Story, the Bosses, see the Content - Tourist Mode. You get Gear faster, because Droprates in LFR will be Buffed. But the Gear in LFR will be much more inferior, JUST BECAUSE you don't have Tier. Just because you don't have the Gear Models of normal Non-set Drops from the other Raid Difficulties. Those that do LFR because of Convenience or because of lazyness - whatever floats your boat - will be forced to run at least Flex or higher to get Tier. For whatever Reason they want Tier, doesn't come into play here. It's just that they can't just stop Progressing all of a sudden, because LFR gives you everything, but weaker. Those that do LFR for.. just reasons will probably get divided from those that do LFR because LFR is their only Platform of either, learning, experiencing or playing. Everybody will be FORCED into their proper Place in the Game, because in the past the Game has shown that if people aren't forced into their kind of Alley, they might just take the short way and thus interfere with the Experience of others, that simply can't grow beyond that for whatever Reason.

It's Blizzards way of literally FIXING Progression. But in the End it will all End up at the same place: Mythic. Three different Progression Lines that can be mixed and matched as you like.
The New Player/Limited-by-time-Player
Normal 5 Mans - LFR(Tourist Mode) -> Incentive to do Normal(Flexmode) -> Might get you into Heroic(Flexmode) -> Might get you into Mythic

Quests/Normal 5 Mans - Heroic 5 Mans(Organized Groups OR Semi-save Matchmaking with Medal Requirement) - Normal(Flexmode) - Heroic(Flexmode) - Mythic
The Experienced Player

Quests - Heroic 5 Mans (Organized Groups) - (Normal/Heroic until Mythic is opened for Gear) - Mythic
(!OPTIONAL!)


With Professions easily accesible via your Garrison/Profession Alts w/e you like/have - to make some Epic Craftin Gear to have an easier Start on all Progression Lines.

[Iyotanka]

Well...I would say on that exact statement I would agree completely. You don't NEED the gear. Just like if you don't do competitive PvP like Arenas or Rated BGs you don't NEED Valour Gear. That doesn't mean you don't want it. BUT raiding is all about teamwork and coordination. It isn't by any means difficult, it's just hard work and determination. I don't see any issue with requiring raiding to get raiding gear. That having been said I also didn't care when LFR provided said gear. I rarely did LFR because it's a horrible experience but I've done it enough to know that it isn't a place of teamwork and coordination.

[Blur4stuff]

even if you are ultra casual with an erratic play schedule you can still do flex/normal

there are no good excuses for not being able to get tier gear in WoD

[DarkArchon]

Blizzard is crazy about gear lately.
The last patch creates 4 tiers. ilevel difference is 50+.

Now it tries to give LFR no tier bonus and bad looking gear.
The argument is "if you don't raid, you don't need raid gear".

Do you agree?

If you don't raid you don't need raid gear at all. You WANT raid gear. You don't need it. Even tho all raid difficulties will be more convenient and be able to gear faster removing the set bonuses gives a little more incentive to not stay in training wheels raiding for years. So yes i agree.

[freighttrain]

Blizzard is crazy about gear lately.
The last patch creates 4 tiers. ilevel difference is 50+.

Now it tries to give LFR no tier bonus and bad looking gear.
The argument is "if you don't raid, you don't need raid gear".

Do you agree?

You seem to not understand the difference between need and want. If you do not raid you do not need that gear. You may definitely want it, but you do not need it. Raid gear is needed for progression into harder raid modes or new raid tiers. A non raider has no need for said gear. They may want it because it looks cool but again, it is not needed.

- - - Updated - - -

If you don't raid you don't need raid gear at all. You WANT raid gear. You don't need it. Even tho all raid difficulties will be more convenient and be able to gear faster removing the set bonuses gives a little more incentive to not stay in training wheels raiding for years. So yes i agree.

Damn you by 10 min. :P

[Deleted]

Its more like: if Blizzard dont give upgrades to non raiders they unsub. So they need better gear out of raids. Be it raid gear or raid ilvl gear, but they need upgrades.

[l33t]

Yes, I do, because it is logical. Do you need pvp gear if you don't pvp? Nope, same thing.

The case of most people in this thread is they don't "need" gear, and instead "want" it. People want gear, because game lacks progression beyond gear threadmill.

I don't understand the point of this topic, to be honest.

[Hardkorr]

Yes, I do, because it is logical. Do you need pvp gear if you don't pvp? Nope, same thing.

The case of most people in this thread is they don't "need" gear, and instead "want" it. People want gear, because game lacks progression beyond gear threadmill.

I don't understand the point of this topic, to be honest.

Maybe to imply that Blizz needs to implement alternative modes/means of progression for players who don't raid?