Targeted Siege of Orgrimmar Nerf Suggestions

[Deleted]

Watcher seems to only want to use targeted nerfs this tier instead of blanket nerfs to here are some suggestions that will give all struggling raid groups this late in the tier an easier time but not turn this into DS at the same time.

Immersues - I think we all can agree 10 mans have A LOT more trouble on this boss than 25 mans. After doing the fight on both difficulties I can say dying due to too many stacks on 25 man is not anywhere as close to an issue as it is on 10 man.

(Heroic Only) - Swelling corruption damage has been reduced by 50% on 10 player difficulty only.

Norushen - To help some raiders who might be struggling to make the dps check. Especially those just getting started on heroics.

Amalgam of Corruption's health has been reduced by 5% in all difficulties.

Sha of Pride

(Heroic Only) - Damage taken from closing unstable corruption rifts has been reduced by 20%. Damage taken from being hit by a bolt from it has been reduced by 20%.

(Heroic Only) - Banished players now require 10% less damage to break them out.

Swelling pride damage has been reduced by 10% on all difficulties.

Galakaras

(Heroic Only) - The health of the grunt attacking the demolition crew has been reduced by 20%.

The amount that the tidal shamans heals and their health has been reduced by 20% on all difficulties.

Iron Juggernaut - So much RNG when being hit by ricochet and a laser burn at the same time and maybe a tick of damage from bone drill, globaling you. ALSO almost ALL guilds use the stack in the corner bitch pussy strat in phase 2 completely ignoring the mortar barrage mechanic, we should lower it so guilds feel more comfortable staying in range of the boss.

(Heroic Only) - Ricochet damage has been reduced by 20%.

(Heroic Only) - Mortar Barrage damage has been reduced by 20%.

Boner Drill damage has been reduced by 10% in all difficulties.

Laser burn damage has been reduced by 5% in all difficulties.

Dark Shamans - Iron Prism completely unfair mechanic, holy shit.

(Heroic Only) - Iron Prism now inflicts 95% of your health in physical damage, down from 100%.

Falling Ash damage has been reduced by 15% on all difficulties.

Toxic Mist damage has been reduced by 20% on all difficulties.

Malkorok - step up in difficulty it wayyyyy too big coming from nazgrim.

(Heroic only) - Essence of Y'shaarj orbs spawn every 3.5 seconds, up from 3 seconds.

(Heroic only) - Damage taken from orbs of corruption has been reduced to 120,000 shadow damage, down from 150,000.

Imploding energy damage has been reduced by 20% on all difficulties.


Spoils of Pandaria

(Heroic Only) - The amount of health unstable sparks have has been reduced by 20%.

Thok, The Bloodthirsty - The bats are probably the hardest part of the fight but it happens in the earliest part of the fight, this should not be the case with any fight.

(Heroic Only) - Captive Cave bats damage done and health has been reduced by 20%.

Damage taken by deafening screech has been reduced by an additional 5% on all difficulties.


Will update for blackfuse + later. I really hope Watcher sees this.

[qwee]

No thanks.
They are easy enough at the moment imo.

Commit to the game and you'll eventually get there.

[Bullettime]

No thanks.
They are easy enough at the moment imo.

Commit to the game and you'll eventually get there.

Summer is coming, content burnout is going to come to a head, and progression slowing down and will inevitably flatline due to previous mentions. I don't want nerfs but they're inevitably going to come, just to try to keep some people from leaving. Keeping 2 or 3 out of 10 who would have left is still a success.

[Haywire5714]

I can't imagine them making the first 8 bosses easier.

[Mrbleedinggums]

"Dark Shamans - Iron Prism completely unfair mechanic, holy shit."

Lol, now i know you're joking. Having to use a cooldown is not unfair at all. Either learn how to raid or don't bother trying to do past flex/normal.

[Bullettime]

I can't imagine them making the first 8 bosses easier.

I imagine more along the lines of a couple target nerfs to "wall" bosses. Mainly say a 10 or 15% health nerf to Dark Shaman, Malkorok, and Thok+, severity depending on the encounter.

[DarkShawoman]

I read all these "nerfs" and well quite frankly, if you cannot kill them with your raid, either find a new raid group or you don't deserve to do heroic raids. They are heroic for a reason, for them to be challenging, not faceroll like LFR or flex, heck even normal was a joke, it was cleared so easily by many in the first week. Plus upgrading your gear with valor makes up the difference, if we didnt have the upgrades then our item levels would be lower which make a difference in the difficulty by just about the amount you are wanting the damage of certain abilities to be nerfed.

As for the Iron Prison mechanic, I play a resto shaman, before having a holy paladin healing with me, that was an annoying mechanic to survive because I had to use Stone Bulwark (1 minute cd) and it absorbed such a low amount of damage, i was almost dead everytime I got hit by Prison, now with a holy paladin I always have some absorb on me, or if worse case scenario i can be BoP'd (HoP'd now) or even Sac'd and it makes a huge difference.

All in all, learn the fights as they are, figure out how to use your raid's cooldowns on people and the fights become so easy and farmable you don't need the nerfs you are crying for.

Happy Raiding!

[Last Starfighter]

Watcher seems to only want to use targeted nerfs this tier instead of blanket nerfs to here are some suggestions that will give all struggling raid groups this late in the tier an easier time but not turn this into DS at the same time.

Immersues - I think we all can agree 10 mans have A LOT more trouble on this boss than 25 mans. After doing the fight on both difficulties I can say dying due to too many stacks on 25 man is not anywhere as close to an issue as it is on 10 man.

(Heroic Only) - Swelling corruption damage has been reduced by 20% on 10 player difficulty only.

Norushen - To help some raiders who might be struggling to make the dps check. Especially those just getting started on heroics.

Amalgam of Corruption's health has been reduced by 5% in all difficulties.

Sha of Pride

(Heroic Only) - Damage taken from closing unstable corruption rifts has been reduced by 20%. Damage taken from being hit by a bolt from it has been reduced by 20%.

(Heroic Only) - Banished players now require 10% less damage to break them out.

Swelling pride damage has been reduced by 10% on all difficulties.

Galakaras

(Heroic Only) - The health of the grunt attacking the demolition crew has been reduced by 20%.

The amount that the tidal shamans heals and their health has been reduced by 20% on all difficulties.

Iron Juggernaut - So much RNG when being hit by ricochet and a laser burn at the same time and maybe a tick of damage from bone drill, globaling you. ALSO almost ALL guilds use the stack in the corner bitch pussy strat in phase 2 completely ignoring the mortar barrage mechanic, we should lower it so guilds feel more comfortable staying in range of the boss.

(Heroic Only) - Ricochet damage has been reduced by 20%.

(Heroic Only) - Mortar Barrage damage has been reduced by 20%.

Boner Drill damage has been reduced by 10% in all difficulties.

Laser burn damage has been reduced by 5% in all difficulties.

Dark Shamans - Iron Prism completely unfair mechanic, holy shit.

(Heroic Only) - Iron Prism now inflicts 95% of your health in physical damage, down from 100%.

Falling Ash damage has been reduced by 15% on all difficulties.

Toxic Mist damage has been reduced by 20% on all difficulties.

Malkorok - step up in difficulty it wayyyyy too big coming from nazgrim.

(Heroic only) - Damage taken from orbs of corruption has been reduced to 120,000 shadow damage, down from 150,000.

Imploding energy damage has been reduced by 20% on all difficulties.


Spoils of Pandaria

(Heroic Only) - The amount of health unstable sparks have has been reduced by 20%.

Thok, The Bloodthirsty - The bats are probably the hardest part of the fight but it happens in the earliest part of the fight, this should not be the case with any fight.

(Heroic Only) - Captive Cave bats damage done and health has been reduced by 20%.

Damage taken by deafening screech has been reduced by an additional 5% on all difficulties.


Will update for blackfuse + later. I really hope Watcher sees this.

LOL you don't have to exploit Iron Jug. It's faceroll dude. lol. Nobody needs to stack lol. And sorry, but Iron prison is not a "Completely unfair mechanic holy shit" XD

You just went through the dungeon journal and listed the abilities with a 20% nerf beside them. Not constructive and nothing worth seeing.

[Imbalanced]

Yeah those aren't targeted nerfs those are random nerfs to the whole raid. No targeted nerf would affect anything before seigecrafter.

[Marxman]

A lot of these are way overkill.

ALSO almost ALL guilds use the stack in the corner bitch pussy strat in phase 2 completely ignoring the mortar barrage mechanic

I didn't even know this was a thing. I thought people, like, used their eyeballs and dodged. This is heroic content, dodging isn't hard.

Dark Shamans - Iron Prism completely unfair mechanic, holy shit.

You understand how physical damage works, right? I have never died to this mechanic. Actually, I don't know that anyone in my raid has ever died to this mechanic. It rarely does more than 50% of your life, or 60-70% as a caster I guess. Get a Priest bubble or use a personal and you're completely fine.

(Heroic only) - Damage taken from orbs of corruption has been reduced to 120,000 shadow damage, down from 150,000.

This does literally nothing. The only thing that makes the orbs matter is they remove your shield completely. The damage is negligible. I'm also of the opinion that this is an easy boss, but I guess it depends on your healers. Soaking puddles is extremely easy aside from rare circumstances where your quadrant has 2, in which case you communicate. If you can't communicate, get out of heroic raids.

[Deleted]

If anything needs to be nerfed, it's the last three. The pulls needed on those bosses commonly exceed 100, often well into the 200s or more. Before that, it's a lot less. There's countless outliers ("my guild killed siegecrafter heroic in like 15 pulls with 540 gear durr"), but I don't remember the bosses in ToT requiring that many pulls. We certainly didn't have a problem downing council or durumu in 535 gear, but we certainly wouldn't have been able to kill siegecrafter in 566 gear (or only with an excessive amount of pulls).

When a boss takes many good, overgeared guilds 200+ pulls when it isn't even the end boss, it's likely overtuned. I know in SoO's case it's to offset the lack of difficulty on the first 8/11 bosses, but the step-up in difficulty is really harsh. The fact they nerfed the last four significantly on 10-man is quite telling. I wouldn't be surprised if they nerfed them a bit more.

You understand how physical damage works, right?

You obviously don't understand how Iron Prison works. The fact it deals physical damage doesn't mean it gets reduced by armor. Because it doesn't. If you don't have a defensive cooldown/shield or a damage reduction passive through your class/spec, you're going to die, no questions asked.

Thok also deals physical damage, but he deals the same amount to plate wearers as to cloth wearers.

If you like being aggressive to support your arguments, at least make sure they're true.

[Belloc]

"Dark Shamans - Iron Prism completely unfair mechanic, holy shit."

Lol, now i know you're joking. Having to use a cooldown is not unfair at all. Either learn how to raid or don't bother trying to do past flex/normal.

Cooldown? You mean some people do more than just PW:Shield it?

Honestly, though, it's such an easy ability to deal with and most classes have some way of handling it. As a warlock, it doesn't even budge my healthpool... ever... even if I get it multiple times in a row.

- - - Updated - - -

I didn't even know this was a thing. I thought people, like, used their eyeballs and dodged. This is heroic content, dodging isn't hard.

No, but the healing requirement is quite large and, with people spread out, it can be quite difficult to heal. That, more than the barrage, is the difficulty. Not that I'm arguing with you, because dodging isn't hard :P

You understand how physical damage works, right? I have never died to this mechanic. Actually, I don't know that anyone in my raid has ever died to this mechanic. It rarely does more than 50% of your life, or 60-70% as a caster I guess. Get a Priest bubble or use a personal and you're completely fine.

I've seen plenty of people die to it. Unlike most physical abilities, this one is NOT reduced by armor (which, I think, is what you were suggesting). Still an easy mechanic to handle, but I wanted to correct that physical thing.

This does literally nothing. The only thing that makes the orbs matter is they remove your shield completely. The damage is negligible. I'm also of the opinion that this is an easy boss, but I guess it depends on your healers. Soaking puddles is extremely easy aside from rare circumstances where your quadrant has 2, in which case you communicate. If you can't communicate, get out of heroic raids.

100% agree. It gets harder on 25-man, but it's still not that bad of a fight. Well, let me say that differently: It's not a bad fight if you have players that learn from mistakes. It did take us a TON of attempts to kill on 25-man, but it was really easy on 10 and still pretty easy after everyone knew it on 25.

[cityguy193]

Whats the point of this vs a 30% raid nerf? Let people faceroll heroic in the last few months of the xpac, Soo is over 9 months old already. If anything, a blanket nerf will encourage more raiding, for heirloom weapons.

[dean771]

Nothing targeted at all about your listed nerfs

[PrairieChicken]

Blanket nerfs please.

[cFortyfive]

I didn't even know this was a thing. I thought people, like, used their eyeballs and dodged. This is heroic content, dodging isn't hard.

It's not that dodging is hard but that it makes it easy as fuck to heal even with slightly less competent healers.
Don't know I still think they should just go with a couple blanket nerfs. Other than that there are things on the list I agree with I suppose even though I find your commentary let's call it quite funny.
I'd probably add decrease aura damage from the big bug on spoils.
Siegecrafter - I guess a hp decrease would probably be the most efficient nerf as being able to deal faster with the weapons and adds already provides a nice edge. Paragons no idea reduce damage from fire and fiery edges.

[Radio]

Iron Jugg:

>'RNG'
>Richochet
>Borer Drills
>Avoidable mechanics
>wat

[Deleted]

Iron Jugg:

>'RNG'
>Richochet
>Borer Drills
>Avoidable mechanics
>wat

To be fair, getting hit by Laser Burn and either a Ricochet or cannon blast can gib someone with mostly normal gear.
Ricochet is pretty hard to dodge on its way out.

[britishbubba]

Dark Shamans - Iron Prism completely unfair mechanic, holy shit.

(Heroic Only) - Iron Prism now inflicts 95% of your health in physical damage, down from 100%.

wat. This isn't even a punishing mechanic. Use a minor defensive. You have a MINUTE warning. If you have a disc priest or a holy paladin in the raid, you toss some absorbs on them and you don't even have to use a defensive.

Outside of shamans the first 8 bosses shouldn't be touched. Drop all damage on shamans by ~5%, and lower their health a few %. Will make the boss a little less of a wall, although I would assume a bigger barrier for a 10m would be lacking a 3rd tank cuz reasons making the fight harder than it has to be.

Malk can have a small health nerf, raid damage can be toned down on spoils a bit (maybe a mob health nerf too), thok is fine after the last round of nerfs, and you can't really do anything to seigecrafter without just gutting the fight. Most fights this tier are harder due to mechanics, you can't really nerf mechanics without just removing them or dropping the damage they do by such a large margin as to effectively remove the mechanic from the fight.

Paragons could have a few things done to make it less punishing on 25m (it's already really easy on 10m), and garrosh shouldn't be touched imo.

With the stuff listed in OP, might as well just blanket nerf stuff. personally I'd be fine with a 10% nerf, would make farm less tedious.

[dancers]

There's already a better SoO nerf in game... item upgrades.