1. #1

    Garrosh Heroic mage question

    Hey there all.

    I have a question to all those mages that have progressed on Garrosh heroic.

    My guild have been working on the boss for quite a while now, and are almost i phase 4, as we have multiple sub 7% phase 3 attempts.

    I was originally Fire on this boss, but as we had problems meeting the dps requirements to enter phase 3 before the 3rd whirling the other mage in my guild convinced me to go arcane.

    As it turns out, even though i'm pretty bad at arcane, which is shown by the fact that I do like 15% less dmg to garrosh on avg than our other mage, I do seem to do more dmg to garrosh at least during phase 1 and phase 2 than I did as fire. I'm a lot less sure about phase 3, as my arcane dps seem to plummet here, even though I find my own little spot. That matters less however as we are normally stopping dps to not push him over right as he does his 2nd whirling.

    My question comes here.
    What are people's expirience with fire vs. arcane for phase 3, as that is pretty much the part of the fight that is stopping us from getting to phase 4. I suspect that I would be able to do quite a bit more dmg as fire with all that movement, especially considering that my arcane dmg under heavy movement is very bad. I will get better with practice of course, but to me it just seems like fire might be the way to go for phase 3.

    What I would also like to know is what the difference is between the two specs once we get to phase 4.

  2. #2
    Blademaster Myxel's Avatar
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    I only played Fire on this boss, both on progress and now after farm so I can't really give much detail from an Arcane PoV. But for me I've always been doing a decent amount of damage in Phase 3 and I'd definatly say that you should play whatever spec you can play the best yourself, since all three specs are very close to eachother DPS-wise. The DPS race between Fire-Arcane will vary from pull to pull.

    Some tips for Phase 3 as Fire.

    -Don't use 3 minute cooldowns after you leave 2nd transmission, you need them up for P3. (Using combustion during 2nd transmission is fine.)

    -Use 2nd pot as soon as P3 begins along with Bloodlust.

    -PRAY for trinket procs.

    Now you essentially just want to get as many pyro's onto Garrosh with Alter Time like you would do during the pull, when the Ignite is at its peak, combust. For the rest of the phase, regular single-target rotation and use Engineer-gloves and other profession attributes.
    Myxel-Immersion 14/14H-EU-Frostmane 25M

  3. #3
    Field Marshal
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    Go Frost.

    In all seriousness though what is your raid size and what other responsibilities do you have? If you're dropping weapons you're probably losing a lot playing Arcane.

    Memorize the average times your trinkets proc throughout the fight so you can synergize cooldowns better. Often you'll be better off holding them for a bit if you're expecting your procs to be up shortly. As with all other encounters keep your uptimes on Bombs as close o 100% as possible and snapshot with your procs; this should yield a noticeable increase in DPS if you're not doing this already.

    Fire will likely net you more damage in P3 unless you're fairly experienced with Arcane and RoP. It does have a large amount of movement, which isn't nearly as detrimental to Fire. That being said Arcane is still playable in that phase. I would recommend placing your secondary RoP in advance when you're moving out for Whirling and sitting at the front of it so you can still be in it while killing your add without moving closer and taking more damage.

    Phase 4 is pretty simple for Mages in general. Assuming you're not in the group spawning the Iron Star (you shouldn't be) taking malice stacks out of bombardment phases is your only true requirement. Fire may have a slightly easier time with this due to Scorch, but if you're comfortable with Icy Floes that should be more than enough to make Arcane work. You're essentially planted behind the boss and dipping in and out of the edge of the Malice circle.

  4. #4
    I'm not sure if you're referring to 10 man or 25 man, but for 10 man I've played both specs several times, in my experience arcane does slightly more boss damage than fire, assuming you don't have to move for desecrated weapons. Fire can beat arcane with good 4-pc rng though.

    For phase 3, arcane is slightly faster at killing the minions of y'rsharaaj and is also faster/safer for freeing people from MC. If you're lacking damage to push him to the phase 4 transition before the 2nd whirling, you can also spam 4-stack arcane blasts and missiles to burn half your mana, as you will regenerate it during the RP anyway. You didn't mention intermission 1, but Arcane is also slightly better there.

    In the end, the are pretty close, I recommend playing fire as you're most comfortable with it, unless you can get comfortable with arcane in the short term. I have a video of a 10HC Arcane PoV in the video thread in case you need some pointers.
    Last edited by Kathos; 2014-05-14 at 06:59 AM.

  5. #5
    Stood in the Fire Deithy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasted View Post
    Go Frost.
    ^- This. All tho my guild is in early progression on him (100 wipes) in my opinion that spec is best suited for progression on Garrosh. My toon has always been arcane and im quite confident in my skills regarding the spec. At one point i was even doing the engineer, no prob. But that fight really forced me to change spec due the high movement strategy we use (we have only 2 caster dps in the setup) and that hurt my dps quite a lot as arcane.
    Tried first with fire. It was nice. Opening burst was comparable to our warlock burst 1mln+ dps(due adds cleave), but then it started falling off. Especially in first transition room. I really don't see what fire can do there after first pack. I felt pretty useless on the second pack of adds to witch i was assigned. Fire really lack proper aoe. Couple that with the lack of proper fire gear (managed to get only to 45% crit) Got mad at it cuz we really struggled to clear the room before Garrosh reach 24 energy.

    Respeced to frost. And i felt reborn. First to second on damage done on Garrosh. First to second on damage done on adds in first transition room. I think those two parameters are the more important ones, especeialy for progress fight ^-^

    My many cents
    Grant me the Serenety to accept the things i cannot change, the Courage to change the things i can and the Wisdom to know the diffrence.

  6. #6
    ^For progress you should save combust and pom for the first intermission room as fire. That's how you do damage in the intermission.

  7. #7
    The Patient Abraxis's Avatar
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    Just do pure BossDPS.

    That means just passive cleave on adds, all CDs on boss, don't even multidot except of the farseer.
    The faster the boss get low, the more easy the fight will be, many people tend to scumbag on adds but the most important task for you as firemage ist pure BossDPS.

    If you look at garroshlogs, take at look a damage dealt on garrosh and not overall.
    Last edited by Abraxis; 2014-05-14 at 10:09 AM.

  8. #8
    Some strats use a lot of movement, idk how your guild does it, but just based off how my guild does phase 3 i would never go arcane

  9. #9
    Frost seems the best if progressing, it rapes in first transition (usually where most wipes generally occur) has decent burst for mc's and solid reliable boss damage to make it a decent choice during progression.

  10. #10
    I tried arcane and fire on this boss. My experience with them is that arcane win in mostly everything atleast with 578+.
    You have more damage in p1 to the adds, you have more damage in the intermission, and you burst in p3 will be higher than as fire. If you have problem in p3 to have enough damage you can try to save you alter time,(arcane power and so on) to when you get hero in p3, and then you should do really high damage.
    On the first couple of kills i did use alter time only with immerseus trinket, then it also timed up with p3, but theres ofc difference between kill time.
    So try to figure when you can use alter time, so it will be up for p3 without delaying it to much.

    For the p4 its just about using rune of power the right time and the right place. When there is bombardment, you can use rune of power somewhere between the place boss coming from and the place you need to go, so you can pull dps on the boss all time.

    Fire will do more dps to the boss in p1, because you obviously will use alot of arcane explosion instead of single targeting the boss. But in the length im pretty sure you will do more damage as arcane, atleast if you good at playing arcane.

    My kill from yesterday, maybe you can see some placement of rune of power in p4, so you can see what i ment(even tho were failing on the 4'th malice).
    http://www.twitch.tv/rixers/c/4300576

    else goodluck

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Rixers View Post

    Fire will do more dps to the boss in p1, because you obviously will use alot of arcane explosion instead of single targeting the boss. But in the length im pretty sure you will do more damage as arcane, atleast if you good at playing arcane.
    If you are padding with AE, maybe, otherwise arcane does just as good boss damage in P1.

  12. #12
    Grunt Nissinn's Avatar
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    Every guild has a different strategy but if you are allowed to tunnel the boss whole encounter and not have to soak weapons or do anything else funky I would stay arcane. Frost is also viable worldoflogs.com/reports/luwreghkqapvohcx/.

  13. #13
    Tbh if U go are arcane u shouldn't be give any job there. Basically as arcane U are staying at boss all the time. Arcane is better than fire yes. Fire provide a bit more dps on garrosh but overall as arcane u should pull more.
    Last edited by Mejn; 2014-06-01 at 08:16 AM.

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