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  1. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by CR77 View Post
    I don't think the item upgrade is to make SoO easier, it is to give people a reason to continue to farm valor to upgrade their items further.
    It doesn't really matter what you think the reason is. It will make SoO easier.

  2. #242
    Herald of the Titans Marxman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by klogaroth View Post
    If the Heart of the Valorous buff makes it to live you'll cap valor just by clearing Siege. Which would be nice.
    If this makes it to live, my complaints are unwarranted and I'll be totally happy with these changes. At the moment it was only enabled on PTR for a short time.

    If it's just a temp testing buff... UGH. I absolutely hate capping VP on alts. I really do.
    Last edited by Marxman; 2014-05-17 at 01:01 AM.

  3. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    It's ironic that this argument is being used by many of the same people crying about LFR losing tier. When the hardcore players use this exact argument as to why LFR doesn't deserve tier, they call us Snowflakes. I just find it funny.

    Clearly we're willing to put forth effort when it's called for. The problem is, we're at the end of a tier (the end of a tier which will last longer than the tier's relevancy) and the expectation for players like me is we're on cruise control. Log in 2 days a week, raid for 3 hours, then back to playing alts, other games, or dealing with RL. Now there's this extra little annoyance we have to deal with every week, which adds nothing to my enjoyment of the game. It can also be better accomplished in other ways, like blanket nerfing SoO.

    The ONLY reason they don't like blanket nerfs is because it makes the people struggling feel like they're being shown pity... which is exactly what this change is doing. Blizzard is just disguising it well.
    Why do you have to deal with it every week? Your guild downed Heroic Garrosh months ago. Sure you'll probably want to get upgrades here or there, but I can't even imagine that anyone in your guild would expect you to full upgrade your gear at this point.

    Just doing SoO will give you 560 valor a week, enough to fully upgrade an item. If you go into Patch 5.4.8 with 3k valor you can upgrade 6 items. Now assuming you're using an offhand, that leaves you ten items to upgrade. Those items will take you 9 weeks to upgrade completely. Now if you want to speed it up a little bit, you can spend thirty minutes a week grinding Heroic Scenarios (seriously, try it. Grab three BiS DPS and you can knock out 3 scenarios in no more than 20-30 minutes). Otherwise, without any additional effort you'll finish upgrading in 9 weeks. If your guild really needs you to upgrade before that point...well I don't even know what to say in that case.

  4. #244
    Herald of the Titans Marxman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    Why do you have to deal with it every week? Your guild downed Heroic Garrosh months ago. Sure you'll probably want to get upgrades here or there, but I can't even imagine that anyone in your guild would expect you to full upgrade your gear at this point.
    Then you don't understand how high-end raiding works. "We're done" does not mean "We can slack off completely and not try". If there are still avenues of improvement, we must follow them.

  5. #245
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Then you don't understand how high-end raiding works. "We're done" does not mean "We can slack off completely and not try". If there are still avenues of improvement, we must follow them.
    "We're done" means "We're done". If there are avenues to improve then you are not done high-end raiding or learning English comprehension for that matter.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Then you don't understand how high-end raiding works. "We're done" does not mean "We can slack off completely and not try". If there are still avenues of improvement, we must follow them.
    Doesn't sound like fun or a game. Sounds like you've made WoW into a job.

  7. #247
    Quote Originally Posted by Tennisace View Post
    Doesn't sound like fun or a game. Sounds like you've made WoW into a job.
    The point of WoW is character progression so it may sound like a job because you have progression in your occupation. That 40yr old that is still flipping burgers. he does LFR.

  8. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by Khorm View Post
    The point of WoW is character progression so it may sound like a job because you have progression in your occupation. That 40yr old that is still flipping burgers. he does LFR.
    I think you got it the otherway around.

    the point of WoW is to defeat the end boss on hardest difficulty, character progression is a means of doing just that.

  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Thoris View Post
    "We're done" means "We're done". If there are avenues to improve then you are not done high-end raiding or learning English comprehension for that matter.
    Considering his sig stating he's in a top 50 US guild with Garrosh heroic down, I think he knows about high-end raiding. And the fact you seem to think max level raiders don't keep improving and farming for true BiS shows you don't know anything about it.

    Even if they weren't selling off carries or staying on top of their game for the next expansion, or just getting BiS for slightly faster leveling next expansion... Some people just like being the best they can possibly be.

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    Considering his sig stating he's in a top 50 US guild with Garrosh heroic down, I think he knows about high-end raiding. And the fact you seem to think max level raiders don't keep improving and farming for true BiS shows you don't know anything about it.

    Even if they weren't selling off carries or staying on top of their game for the next expansion, or just getting BiS for slightly faster leveling next expansion... Some people just like being the best they can possibly be.
    More comprehension lessons are in order it seems. If you say "We're done" but you keep going again and again to improve / farm BiS then you aren't done. I'm not denying he wants to improve, therefore hes not done is he? Is that hard to grasp?

  11. #251
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    Considering his sig stating he's in a top 50 US guild with Garrosh heroic down, I think he knows about high-end raiding. And the fact you seem to think max level raiders don't keep improving and farming for true BiS shows you don't know anything about it.

    Even if they weren't selling off carries or staying on top of their game for the next expansion, or just getting BiS for slightly faster leveling next expansion... Some people just like being the best they can possibly be.
    top 60 US 25 man guild is not nearly the same as top 50 US guild though.

  12. #252
    Fluffy Kitten Wilderness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Then you don't understand how high-end raiding works. "We're done" does not mean "We can slack off completely and not try". If there are still avenues of improvement, we must follow them.
    Ok, that's fine but how does the item upgrade impact you all that much? That you'll "need" to farm up a bit of VP each week outside of raiding in order to cap your 1k VP and make sure you upgrade your items as much as possible? Its not like that's a big time commitment, particularly if you already have a bunch of timeless isle coins you can spend instead of your time.

    Its also completely your choice to do that, since you've been farming H SoO for months now obviously the item upgrades aren't going to do anything except speed up those runs. Those faster runs will also offset the small amount of time outside of raiding that you need to farm up the extra VP. I'd also hardly call not capping your VP weekly to maximize these new upgrades "slacking off and not trying" but I get that you want to maximize your character, go for ranks, or whatever. However, the extra effort to cap VP outside of raiding is going to be ridiculously small, particularly once they add in the timeless isle coin trade-in.

    A blanket SoO nerf would change nothing for you but speed up your clears, while this isn't quite as convenient even though the extra effort needed is going to be minimal, so I get why you'd prefer the former. However, doing it this way, in my opinion, is much better for many more players and a minor inconvenience for you at best.

  13. #253
    Quote Originally Posted by Mbison View Post
    No, you playing all 4 (lol) specs on your druid is your own choice, do you even realize how stupid that sounds?

    Please think before you decide make a thread next time.
    Indeed. You sound like your guild's bitch. The time needed to respec 2-4 times per raid (potentially more) along with the gold required to do all that shit must be insane. No druid plays 4 specs. Not even druids in world 1-10 guilds. Your guild is just using you hard and laughing, while the other potential tanks / healers / dps sit and go "good, i dont have to dps, this little bitch will do that job for me"

    Brought it on yourself, simply put.

  14. #254
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mbison View Post
    No, you playing all 4 (lol) specs on your druid is your own choice, do you even realize how stupid that sounds?

    Please think before you decide make a thread next time.
    First post nailed it.

  15. #255
    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Thoris View Post
    More comprehension lessons are in order it seems. If you say "We're done" but you keep going again and again to improve / farm BiS then you aren't done. I'm not denying he wants to improve, therefore hes not done is he? Is that hard to grasp?
    Actually it's your comprehension that is lacking. YOU are failing to grasp the concept of context.

    In the context of the sentence in which it was used the phrase "we're done" means "we're done with progression" not "we're done with doing the instance entirely".

    If you take every phrase completely out of context and use its absolute literal meaning then the world must not make a lot of sense to you.

    This is a topic close to my heart means it is point of discussion, an abstract, that is in close physical proximity to the muscle that pumps blood round my body.

    Do you have any actual points to the discussion to add now that that's out of the way or are you going to continue to attack the way people write instead of focusing on the topic they are writing about?
    Last edited by klogaroth; 2014-05-17 at 01:24 PM.

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    Considering his sig stating he's in a top 50 US guild with Garrosh heroic down, I think he knows about high-end raiding. And the fact you seem to think max level raiders don't keep improving and farming for true BiS shows you don't know anything about it.

    Even if they weren't selling off carries or staying on top of their game for the next expansion, or just getting BiS for slightly faster leveling next expansion... Some people just like being the best they can possibly be.
    Death Jesters is hardly "high-end" raiding. They took nearly 2 months from their first Paragons kill to kill Garrosh...

    Being 588 is meaningless for everyone (read: 14/14H). It's just something to inflate already cheesed dps rankings.
    Zinge
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  17. #257
    Quote Originally Posted by Zinge View Post
    Death Jesters is hardly "high-end" raiding. They took nearly 2 months from their first Paragons kill to kill Garrosh...

    Being 588 is meaningless for everyone (read: 14/14H). It's just something to inflate already cheesed dps rankings.
    there are people in full 574 gear that is struggeling with siegecrafter - garrosh, thus being 582 instead will provide a progression path for them, for people who have cleared the raid for 4 months ago it doesn't really matter.

    yes it will inflate dps rankings, but what does those even matter.

  18. #258
    Blizzard is only doing this to give you the illusion of "content" don't fool yourselves, as for the upgrades it sucks but not much can be done about as blizz is quite adamanent in doing bullshit stuff all the time and calling it "exciting" "content" or worse "immersion".

  19. #259
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Salech View Post
    Blizzard is only doing this to give you the illusion of "content" don't fool yourselves, as for the upgrades it sucks but not much can be done about as blizz is quite adamanent in doing bullshit stuff all the time and calling it "exciting" "content" or worse "immersion".
    Its helping guilds progress further by upgrading their characters, how this "sucks" or is "bullshit" is beyond me..

  20. #260
    Quote Originally Posted by theburned View Post
    there are people in full 574 gear that is struggeling with siegecrafter - garrosh, thus being 582 instead will provide a progression path for them, for people who have cleared the raid for 4 months ago it doesn't really matter.

    yes it will inflate dps rankings, but what does those even matter.
    Did you not read what I wrote? I said that being 588 is useless for everyone that's 14/14 Heroic ALREADY. This was about people being in guilds that have clearly cleared the content, not ones struggling on nerfed content.
    Zinge
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