1. #1
    Warchief Ryan Cailan Ebonheart's Avatar
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    Feb 2012
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    Why does Ruthlessness Still Pull Enemies?

    I honestly can't believe they haven't fixed this. It's been a problem since 5.4 launched and yet its still here. They haven't even addressed it with the new hotfix. Instead they decide to hotfix a sprint/burst of speed bug and completely ignore Ruthlessness.

    And in case you don't play a Rogue or play a Rogue and still have no idea what I'm talking about let me get you up to speed. Basically, there's an unintended "bug" from Ruthlessness where your Rogue can essentially "Taunt" a targeted mob. Yes I mean literally Taunt a mob. How does this happen? After you kill an enemy that has left over combo points and target another enemy that's not in combat while using either Slice and Dice or Recuperate, you'll pull that enemy IF Ruthlessness procs. It doesn't happen to me all the time but its frequent enough that its a problem I can't ignore.

    Now some people will tell me to shut up and claim that its not a big deal and that I should just untarget the mob. But to me it's an issue that shouldn't even exist. I really don't care that it's a very minor problem. I am getting absolutely sick of randomly pulling mobs on my Rogue and having to deal with these instant mad Tanks that act like 5 man dungeons today are something out of H HoR.

    It's bad enough I play a Rogue. People literally just hate you for playing the class and its almost like they want you to do something wrong to have a reason to hate you. It's the same with DK, but at least DK is a bug free class.

    The worst part of all of this is there's more bugs with this class that you the player are forced to adapt to. Shadow Dance bug is another good example of this. I can only imagine that since almost nobody plays this class, these problems are just left on the backburner and Blizzard just waits till next expansion to fix it.

  2. #2
    Well yeah if you do things to a mob prior to the tank or somebody else it aggros to you, this isn't news. This is a player issue not a gameplay issue.
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  3. #3
    Warchief Ryan Cailan Ebonheart's Avatar
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    It's a gameplay issue. It's not intended for Ruthlessness to do that.

  4. #4
    Yeah aggroing a mob after issuing an attack is reaally absolutely surprising, and especially hunters never had any similar problem.

  5. #5
    For clarity, the ability in question is Ruthlessness. It procs off of finishers which do not, themselves, aggro a mob, but the triggered +1 CP does pull the mob, which is not an attack of any kind. Other rogue abilities (see Premeditation) can put CP on a target without pulling it. I've never noticed this (I'd use an offensive, or use the CP still targeting the dead mob), but that doesn't mean it's not mechanically clunky. It does, however, mean that both of you are wrong -- doing things to a mob (adding CP) doesn't necessarily pull, and it's not an attack.

  6. #6
    Warchief Ryan Cailan Ebonheart's Avatar
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    The sad part about all of this is that it hasn't even been addressed once by Blizzard. Not once. It's as if the problem doesn't exist. That's just bothersome to me that they add an ability into the game and just let this knowingly slide.

    And since most people don't care, they don't care.

  7. #7
    Your title is really misleading, a taunt rips aggro from another source while you're just gaining aggro. This is like calling Havoc a taunt, simply because it gains aggro.

    I've never had this problem, and it seems like no one else in this thread has had this issue either. This leads me to believe that maybe blizz doesnt know about this.

    Also, you sound more mad at the class than the bug.

  8. #8
    I am Murloc! Raugnaut's Avatar
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    A similar thing for Ferals, T16 4 piece, which adds +3 combo points after using a finishing move, also aggros creatures. I also think Redirect did the same thing when it was first introduced, as did Marked for Death. It requires special coding that blizz just hasn't entered for Ruthlessness. Should be fixed next expansion with combo points on the rogue instead of targets.
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  9. #9
    Why would you complain about a hidden feature?

  10. #10
    That is not a taunt. That is putting you in combat.

    And honestly who cares? If you're going to refresh slice and dice with old combo points, don't target a new mob when you do it if it's such a big deal. Or if it is really uncommon, why not just vanish as soon as it happens? Should drop your threat and solve the problem.

    I don't think blizzard cares to fix it since it won't be an issue in 6.0 since combo points are going on the rogue instead of targets. You can deal with a minor inconvenience that occasionally happens, especially when a slight change in playstyle can prevent it from happening.
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  11. #11
    This just happened to me in raid, doing something I have been doing almost every week. I would redirect from a dead trash to the boss for a free 5 pt SnD before pre-pot, and I pulled once I casted SnD.

    I've never had this happen before so I wouldnt say its been around since 5.4 launched, or maybe I've been casting SnD after my prepot this whole time.

  12. #12
    This feature has been live since 5.4

    At first I wondered how I failpulled a Boss during a raid but then I found out that ruthlessness procs are hostile actions. Then the fun part began.
    I leveled a rogue twink as combat on another realm. A Tank doesn't want to do a trash pack? Ruthlessness proc lure them from 100y away - no one suspects the rogue. And since it's a hostile action with 0 actual threat the healer immeadiatly aggros. And if the group dies... you vanish - another rogue feature.

    I rate it as probably 400% - 500% more effective than the Battle Horn as it has no visual, no line of sight restriction and at least 2.5 times the range and no direct CD.

    Your raid doesn't like to do trash? No problem you can accelerate the pullrate. Your Group forgot to pull the add for the malkorok achievement? no worries you can still pull it even though the walls for the bossfight are up. Need to pull the Dark Shamans but don't want to bother going inside? Just pull them from outside.

    This is the best ninjapull in the game!

    This must be intended, just like how ruthlessness blocks the 5th anticipation charge.


    Taken from Wowhead ruthlessness comments posted on 2014/02/18 By BlizzardCS
    Wondering why the Combo Point granted by Ruthlessness puts you back in combat straight away? The reason is a known issue, but don’t worry: we know about it and we are already investigating it in order to find a solution.
    Last edited by RylixTV; 2014-05-18 at 11:57 AM.

  13. #13
    Absolutely reminds me of when there was a bug where casting stealth OoC, while targeting a mob, would pull it. I think that was way back in BC.
    And I do agree that moving the combo points to the rogue should fix the problem and they will most likely not change this beforehand.

  14. #14
    Never had that happen to me, but I always found it weird marked for death on something out of combat can pull, but doesn't always. I've had it happen that I sap them, use marked for death (free 5 point recup for some added healing, not even going to kill it) then it re-aggroes once the sap wears off, even though I was out of combat.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Cailan Ebonheart View Post
    The sad part about all of this is that it hasn't even been addressed once by Blizzard. Not once. It's as if the problem doesn't exist. That's just bothersome to me that they add an ability into the game and just let this knowingly slide.

    And since most people don't care, they don't care.
    To be honest, I've played a rogue for 9 years and I've never noticed that, so I wouldn't consider the lack of 'fix' by Blizzard to be out of spite or incompetence. It's ultimately not game breaking or that noticeable, they just might not have heard complaints about it.
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