[6.0] Shadow Priest Discussion

[Deleted]

that's when you flay.

Oh right, we still have that, haha.

So we use Mind Flay when Devouring Plague is up, if not, Mind Blast > Mind Spike

[Nestar]

Yeah that's my point.
Isn't this makes it a no-brainer for single target fights?

Only if the damage it does is greater than 1 cast of dp that you sacrifice at the beginning of the fight. With current tuning, its more than a minute before that damage catches up. Unfortunately just catching up isn't good enough when you consider you're losing the damage of either of the other two talents as well.

If they were to make it say, refund orbs if used on a target without the dot up. It may be a different story.

[Dierdre]

If they were to make it say, refund orbs if used on a target without the dot up. It may be a different story.

That could work. Make DP apply and refresh Void Entropy. It'd still need tuning though.

[Deleted]

So they nerfed some aoe and buffed some aoe of a lot of classes. Yet they still haven't touched our bleh sear.

You would have thought that with it being so bad, they would have actually placed it first on their priority list.

But no.

[Shahad]

Name Changed from Haste Attunement to Mastermind

That name... Haste Attunement was better.

[Yvaelle]

That name... Haste Attunement was better.

Should have been Mind Quickening now that I think about it - then we're like sweet Mental Highlanders. I'd tweet it to Celestalon, but if he responded to that - while ignoring all the other problems - I'd feel bad (

[Kaesebrezen]

Should have been Mind Quickening now that I think about it

Uhm... http://wod.wowhead.com/spell=49868

[Shahad]

We already have Mind Quickening though, it's the name of our Haste/MS buff.

[Valkaneer]

Spriest AoE is the one problem that's I think is a big problem. All other classes have some pretty rocking AoE. Fire Mages have tremendous AoE power, I think Spriest are going to have a real problem keeping up in these kind of situations.

[Dierdre]

Spriest AoE is the one problem that's I think is a big problem. All other classes have some pretty rocking AoE. Fire Mages have tremendous AoE power, I think Spriest are going to have a real problem keeping up in these kind of situations.

There are various bigger problems. Mind Sear can be easily tuned just by turning a knob, spell/talent/stat interactions not so much. As things stand right now you might have to get two different sets of gear in order to use different t100 talents with stat weights varying so much from one talent to the other. We are rather squishy, we lack raid utility outside of VE, which sucks big time outside of a raid environment. We pay for burst on pull with blood via GoMH as opposed to any other spec of the game except WW. Void Entropy still doesn't work. Neither do cascade nor divine star. Mindbender is still very situational and doesn't interact with any spell or talent in our toolkit.

It's the things that can't be fixed by just turning a knob that should be worrying us. Those are the things that will remain broken until another content patch unless they're fixed before 6.0.

[Ragetacular]

Yay mana cost nerfs?

[Dierdre]

And I honestly doubt locks will stay nerfed.

Called it.

[Baconeggcheese]

Called it.

You realize celestalon said they'd fix demo like 3-4 builds ago right... like almost immediately after the build that nerfed the fuck out of it.

It just brought it back in line with our other 2 specs, it's nothing crazy.

[Jimjam38]

Mastermind huh... they're really pushing this mind related flavor huh, almost like the spec is actually called "Mindfuck priests" or something. I don't think its a terrible name, it kinda *kinda* fits in with Mental Anguish and the fact that half our spells have the word mind in them.
Wonder if we'll see any passive effect added.. would be a nice courtesy. Typically these stat attunements that have an extra effect have something to do with the stat they're attuning, so what kind of haste related effect could they add...

- - - Updated - - -

Okay so I went and looked at every spec - there's actually hardly any that have extra effects. MW Monk, Disc, Holy Priest, Unholy DK, Blood DK, Combat, Sub and that's it I think. I don't play rogues, so I'm not sure if those extra effects were already existing passives like Icy Talons for Frost Dk. I expect they are, because they get them before level 90, as frost does.

But still, who doesn't want cool new effects...

It actually seems like most of the time the extra effect is just an attempt to make that stat more appealing or have some extra functionality, and is mostly for specs with multistrike attunements, since no spec had existing interaction with multistrike.

[Deleted]

Tier sets are in , and oh boy our 4pc is insane. On 3+ target multidot with AS, I could hold 12 stacks forever. It seems really strong and meaningful compared to blunt/boring and borderline useless 4 pc bonuses from all MoP tiers.

[Annesh]

Tier sets are in , and oh boy our 4pc is insane. On 3+ target multidot with AS, I could hold 12 stacks forever. It seems really strong and meaningful compared to blunt/boring and borderline useless 4 pc bonuses from all MoP tiers.

This is what bothers me about VEnt design. We've always been good at multi-dotting, including "council" fights. The other two talents also work very well with extra targets to off-dot. So why do we need an entire talent dedicated to just council fights, when the other talents are just as good at it AND plenty of other gameplay modes as well?

And this complaint is just about its core design philosophy. The precise way they've implemented it, including its current number tuning, presents worlds of new problems.

Also, thoughts on new build:

Heavy freaking druid nerfs, yeesh. Boom chickens don't get free instant heals anymore, OoC only gives free cat moves, and Rejuv number nerfed pretty hard.

Still no melee nerfs or AoE tuning.

Mana's already infinite for us, why bother slicing our mana costs even further? Is it part of some bigger change of making Flash Heal meaningful but mana intensive? That would be cool.

The name Mastermind for our attunement is kinda dorky. I don't mind it terribly much but it doesn't feel very shadowpriesty. Ultimately it's just a passive tooltip on the abilities pane and doesn't mean anything. The whiny side of me thinks it's further evidence of a lack of creative interest in our spec but hey whatever, as long as I'm having fun playing the game - and I am, and think I will in WoD.

[Dawnrage]

http://downloads.simulationcraft.org...id-9-9-14.html

Was done before this patch I believe, but since spriests got no changes, is this accurate? I'm surprised VE is better than AS if so.

- - - Updated - - -

Also regarding 4pc, any theorycrafter able to answer if it's better to pool DPs to keep the stack at maximum for as long as possible or does using DP whenever you have 3 orbs and letting the buff stack and fall make no real difference?

[Deleted]

I must say the set bonuses are pretty fun. But I'm really hoping they don't balance our effectiveness around it, otherwise highmaul will suck.

[Blackmorgrim]

http://downloads.simulationcraft.org...id-9-9-14.html

Was done before this patch I believe, but since spriests got no changes, is this accurate? I'm surprised VE is better than AS if so.

- - - Updated - - -

Also regarding 4pc, any theorycrafter able to answer if it's better to pool DPs to keep the stack at maximum for as long as possible or does using DP whenever you have 3 orbs and letting the buff stack and fall make no real difference?

For Vent, I'd say keeping VEnt maintained is a higher priority than the 4pc.
For CoP, especially if Dot weaving is in play, the 4pc will only get you more out of that when you pool orbs.
For AS, you're going to be casting DP every time you have 3 orbs anyway.

Otherwise, AS only falls behind on single target... the minute you add a second target, its damage starts spiking pretty fast.

[Deleted]

How many fights would we not consider AS on? I know butcher for sure isn't, but which others ?