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  1. #1

    Talking 584 iLvL WW... Stat weights problem

    Having some doubts in my stat weights, as I am not pulling the numbers I should be.

    http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...done&source=11

    This is my guilds latest Jugg kill, and I feel as though my dmg could be higher. Sure my trinket uptime isn't the best on that particular fight, but still.

    I currently weigh my stats at...

    Haste to 12.5k > Crit to 60% raid buffed > Mastery

    Should I go more into haste? I really dont have much downtime, but I guess like 1k more haste wouldnt hurt. Is crit higher value than mastery even after soft cap? Sims I've ran have gone either way.

    Thanks for any/all advice here, helps me a ton.

  2. #2
    First of all ignore crit cap, crit is still better than mastery after 60%, get more of it. Haste is preference to be honest, I like 13174 > Crit > post13174 > Mastery. But its up to you on haste, anything above 12.5 is fine, some go as high as 13.7k-14k anyone with more than that is wasting energy.

    Hit/Exp - 7.75
    Agi - 6.0
    Haste to 13174 - 2.9
    Crit 2.5
    Haste above 13174 - 1.5
    Mastery - 1.35
    Hit(7.5-26.5%) - 1

    EDIT: I just took the liberty of looking you up, you have 9600 mastery, thats no good, follow what I said and you will be fine, obv change the haste in the stat weights to a number that works for you.
    Last edited by Zenlogic; 2014-06-07 at 03:44 AM.

  3. #3
    I would really like to know what silly website is telling people to stop at 60% crit so we can talk to them and fix it at the source. I mean you'd have to have heard it from somewhere...

  4. #4
    Herald of the Titans Hinalover's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    I would really like to know what silly website is telling people to stop at 60% crit so we can talk to them and fix it at the source. I mean you'd have to have heard it from somewhere...
    I believe here. People keep saying a "soft cap" and usually people tend to think "soft cap" = stop there but there is a higher cap. What is not getting pointed out is the fact that crit after that "soft cap" is still higher than mastery.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    I would really like to know what silly website is telling people to stop at 60% crit so we can talk to them and fix it at the source. I mean you'd have to have heard it from somewhere...
    Everywhere that I read, elitest jerks, here, wow fourms, etc... all said to stop getting crit @ soft cap...

    Just ran some sims with max crit reforge, 10k increase. damn. I know sims arent the best tool to tell you whats better, but we will see on tuesday during raid.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Verytrickyx View Post
    First of all ignore crit cap, crit is still better than mastery after 60%, get more of it. Haste is preference to be honest, I like 13174 > Crit > post13174 > Mastery. But its up to you on haste, anything above 12.5 is fine, some go as high as 13.7k-14k anyone with more than that is wasting energy.

    Hit/Exp - 7.75
    Agi - 6.0
    Haste to 13174 - 2.9
    Crit 2.5
    Haste above 13173 - 1.5
    Mastery - 1.35

    EDIT: I just took the liberty of looking you up, you have 9600 mastery, thats no good, follow what I said and you will be fine, obv change the haste in the stat weights to a number that works for you.
    Appreciate it man, reforged according to those weights. I did think something was off with my stats, but I just couldn't find evidence to back it up lol.
    Last edited by WonderPoop; 2014-06-06 at 01:50 AM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by MMO-Champion
    hit/exp caps > haste softcap > agility > crit > haste beyond softcap >>>>> mastery
    Quote Originally Posted by Elitist Jerks
    Your short, basic stat prioritization:
    Hit/Exp (7.5%) > Haste (5K-8K, depending on fight and player skill) > Crit > Mastery >= Hastae after 8k
    Quote Originally Posted by WoW forums
    Agi > Hit/Exp cap > Haste (between 5 and 7k) > Crit > Mastery

    Okay, so barring the fact that the latter two haven't been updated since 5.4 PTR and are wrong on the haste levels, none of the stat priorities say to stop at 60% crit. The section all about Crit on Elitist Jerks says there is a "cap" at 57%, so that's not even 60% and it fails to mention what that cap even means. The battle.net guide doesn't even mention the crit cap, and the guide at the top of this forum says it only applies to auto-attacks but specifies that it's still better than mastery.

    Maybe it's AskMrRobot which tells people to add a cap in their stat weights if they can reach 57% crit, but even that is still not 60% (and whoever runs the website over there doesn't seem to be responding to the forum thread about stat weights that Rotund/Hina/Babylonius have posted on).

    So maybe this is just affecting people that are trying to look beyond just a simple stat priority but aren't using multiple sources? Even so there are posts on AMR, Elitist Jerks, and the battle.net forum in the respective guide threads about the problems with the horribly out of date suggestions. I don't really know how much more we can do about that.

  7. #7
    Brewmaster Slirith's Avatar
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    White hit crit soft cap is 60% for dual wield and 79% for 2h.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    So maybe this is just affecting people that are trying to look beyond just a simple stat priority but aren't using multiple sources? Even so there are posts on AMR, Elitist Jerks, and the battle.net forum in the respective guide threads about the problems with the horribly out of date suggestions. I don't really know how much more we can do about that.

    Guess it was my short attention span. I tend to float between things way too quick, one moment I'll be doing sims, the next I'm on Left for Dead 2...

    Really appreciate the definitive answers, btw.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by WonderPoop View Post
    Guess it was my short attention span. I tend to float between things way too quick, one moment I'll be doing sims, the next I'm on Left for Dead 2...

    Really appreciate the definitive answers, btw.
    No it's not short attention span, you go the extra mile to attempt to understand how stats work by reading every part of the guide, but if it's just not really clear and you don't go check another website entirely you might not get the full story even though you should. You really shouldn't have to look at multiple sites just in case one of them is horribly wrong, it's just generally assumed that people that makes these kinds of things will actually, you know, bother to maintain them.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    No it's not short attention span, you go the extra mile to attempt to understand how stats work by reading every part of the guide, but if it's just not really clear and you don't go check another website entirely you might not get the full story even though you should. You really shouldn't have to look at multiple sites just in case one of them is horribly wrong, it's just generally assumed that people that makes these kinds of things will actually, you know, bother to maintain them.
    Very true. Should be a "Vote to un-sticky" button on forums so that we can get up to date guides/info up. With this patch lasting so long, some of the information is 8-9 months old, and needs to be replaced.

    Speaking of Un-sticky, why is the transmog thread unstickied?
    Last edited by WonderPoop; 2014-06-06 at 02:59 AM. Reason: spelling.

  11. #11
    I imagine the "crit soft cap" information is being confused from advice given to Brewmasters. It's pretty common to recommend Brewmasters go up to the crit cap (60% raid buffed) and then pushing Mastery from there.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Verytrickyx View Post
    First of all ignore crit cap, crit is still better than mastery after 60%, get more of it. Haste is preference to be honest, I like 13174 > Crit > post13174 > Mastery. But its up to you on haste, anything above 12.5 is fine, some go as high as 13.7k-14k anyone with more than that is wasting energy.

    Hit/Exp - 7.75
    Agi - 6.0
    Haste to 13174 - 2.9
    Crit 2.5
    Haste above 13173 - 1.5
    Mastery - 1.35

    EDIT: I just took the liberty of looking you up, you have 9600 mastery, thats no good, follow what I said and you will be fine, obv change the haste in the stat weights to a number that works for you.
    Im assuming those stats plug into Askmrrobot for the "Edit Weights" section.....but idk if its just the website, but its wanting me to reforge to 10.59% hit as dual welding when I hit the "Optimized" tab. Am I missing something about hit? Its always been 7.5%

  13. #13
    Deleted
    i dont understand. 2 patch ago, the hast cap was 7-8k, now it's more than 12k. i Dont understand

  14. #14
    @Silywily I have not edited the hit or expertise in any way on the AMR, it would be easier to dissect the problem with an armory link so I can look it up, been using these weights for awhile now.

    Make sure - Hit(7.5-26.5%) - 1
    Last edited by Zenlogic; 2014-06-07 at 03:45 AM.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Arcabaz View Post
    i dont understand. 2 patch ago, the hast cap was 7-8k, now it's more than 12k. i Dont understand
    Chi Brew eclipsed Ascension because of the added Tigereye Brew stacks that were added to it in 5.4.

    Also all throughout 5.2/5.3 RoRo was used the instant you could get it, meaning everyone in at least 522 ilvl probably had it, so haste values much higher than 8k weren't even possible without gemming for it. These days with Ascension it's around 9k, but Chi Brew is much much better.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Verytrickyx View Post
    @Silywily I have not edited the hit or expertise in any way on the AMR, it would be easier to dissect the problem with an armory link so I can look it up, been using these weights for awhile now.

    Make sure - Hit(7.5-26.5%) - 1
    yeah heres my armory link http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ywily/advanced

    also i do have it set at 1 for the Hit(7.5-26.5%)
    Last edited by silywily; 2014-06-07 at 03:59 AM.

  17. #17
    The results I got are..
    Hit 2592
    Exp 2273 (you are an orc with ax MH)
    Agi 31118
    Crit 17367
    Haste 13082
    Mastery 3869

    And I did this with exactly the weights i posted, also I set the haste at 13174, that changes from person to person.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Verytrickyx View Post
    The results I got are..
    Hit 2592
    Exp 2273 (you are an orc with ax MH)
    Agi 31118
    Crit 17367
    Haste 13082
    Mastery 3869

    And I did this with exactly the weights i posted, also I set the haste at 13174, that changes from person to person.
    yeah idk man....im putting those exact stats in AMR and its still telling me to do 10.59% hit...this is for sure the biggest mystery of my life ha

  19. #19
    Sometimes AMR gets some weird bug up its butt and doesn't want to suggest changes that make any sort of sense. Make sure that, on the Edit Weights popup that you have the pulldown menu on the right set to Raid/Challenge mode, and that you don't have the "At least" check box checked.

    Question in regards to the Edit Weights page - should I have the crit soft cap box filled in with 60%, or leave it blank?

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by silywily View Post
    yeah idk man....im putting those exact stats in AMR and its still telling me to do 10.59% hit...this is for sure the biggest mystery of my life ha
    In the edit weights window try swapping hit 7.5%-26.5% to value = 0. This might solve it. AMR sucks that way.

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