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  1. #341
    Didn't think about it like that actually. Doubt it will, but i wonder if it'll double dip for pets.

  2. #342
    Quote Originally Posted by Maleific View Post
    Didn't think about it like that actually. Doubt it will, but i wonder if it'll double dip for pets.
    It's just baseline how buffs work now, of course it will, it's not double dipping, it grants buff on you which in turn buffs you and your minions.

  3. #343
    A bit OT since I saw the guy's screenshot above, why would one want to use Afffdots now that dots update their power dynamically?
    Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.

  4. #344
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    It's just baseline how buffs work now, of course it will, it's not double dipping, it grants buff on you which in turn buffs you and your minions.
    sorry, i meant do you think your pets will benefit from the 15% increase on you, as well as the buff on them. sry if the question sounds stupid lol.

  5. #345
    Quote Originally Posted by Maleific View Post
    sorry, i meant do you think your pets will benefit from the 15% increase on you, as well as the buff on them. sry if the question sounds stupid lol.
    No its very very very unlikely; they wouldn't let it double dip.
    Last edited by DesireKT; 2014-07-23 at 07:34 AM.

  6. #346
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    GoSyn will certainly not double dip for pets... Everytime ANYTHING double dips on ANYTHING it's a bug.
    My expectation is that when the caster has the Demonic Synergy Buff the caster's spells and abilities will do 15% more damage and when the pet has the Demonic Synergy buff, the pet's spells and abilities will 15% more damage; strictly separated.


    Also since GoSyn is a fixed %-damage-increase buff will almost certainly (in my humble and flawed estimation) Snapshot the way that Eclipse-energy and Tiger's Fury and Bloodtalons snapshot for Druids... so it will almost certainly snapshot on Doom and Corruption and HoG's Shadowflame DoT...

    GoSyn is for all those Demonologists who miss snapshotting and Proc-gaming.
    Last edited by Grubjuice; 2014-07-23 at 05:20 PM.
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  7. #347
    My problem with GoSyn is that it adds yet another layer of RNG to an already very RNG/proc dependent spec. I would have been happier with a increased fury regen GoSac, but this is better than nothing.

  8. #348
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taninsam View Post
    My problem with GoSyn is that it adds yet another layer of RNG to an already very RNG/proc dependent spec. I would have been happier with a increased fury regen GoSac, but this is better than nothing.

    some players LOVE LOVE LOVE gaming procs and snapshotting their DoTs... snapshotting was essentially removed in WOD... but this will bring it back for those who want to choose for themselves to do it.

    if you don't like RNG you just take a different talent; might i recommend Grimoire of Supremacy for sustained non-RNG-based damage, and Grimoire of Service for on demand burst damage?
    Last edited by Grubjuice; 2014-07-23 at 05:21 PM.
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  9. #349
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post

    Also since GoSyn is Damage-increase buff will almost certainly Snapshot the way that Eclipse-energy and Tiger's Fury and Bloodtalons snapshot for Druids... so it will almost certainly (in my humble and flawed estimation) snapshot on Doom and Corruption and HoG's Shadowflame DoT...
    i doubt it will snapshot anything that isnt already snapshottable which means nothing for locks.

  10. #350
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    GoSyn will certainly not double dip for pets... Everytime ANYTHING double dips on ANYTHING it's a bug.
    My expectation is that when the caster has the Demonic Synergy Buff the caster's spells and abilities will do 15% more damage and when the pet has the Demonic Synergy buff, the pet's spells and abilities will 15% more damage; strictly separated.


    Also since GoSyn is a fixed %-damage-increase buff will almost certainly (in my humble and flawed estimation) Snapshot the way that Eclipse-energy and Tiger's Fury and Bloodtalons snapshot for Druids... so it will almost certainly snapshot on Doom and Corruption and HoG's Shadowflame DoT...

    GoSyn is for all those Demonologists who miss snapshotting and Proc-gaming.
    Doubtful. They just removed Eclipse snapshotting so Boomkins can spam Moon/Starfire while moving :S

  11. #351
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Doubtful. They just removed Eclipse snapshotting so Boomkins can spam Moon/Starfire while moving :S
    Tiger's Fury and Bloodtalons are still examples of functional DoT snapshotting... I have no reason to believe GoSyn is any different than an RnG based Bloodtalons until stated otherwise.

    I would also add the Nether Tempest/Living bomb/Frost bomb talent which snapshots Incanter's Flow
    Last edited by Grubjuice; 2014-07-23 at 07:15 PM.
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    When someone asks you if you're a god, YOU SAY 'YES'!

  12. #352

  13. #353
    wonder what they'll change demonbolt into since they said that they were making changes to it.

  14. #354
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    wonder what they'll change demonbolt into since they said that they were making changes to it.
    i am hoping it will still be a powerful spell saved for taking advantage of trinket procs and buring off high-levels DF...
    i wouldn't mind if that fiddly refund mechanic was made somehow less fiddly...

    perhaps it will be scrapped altogether... i can't imagine what it would be replaced with, maybe some alteration to ToC?
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  15. #355
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    some players LOVE LOVE LOVE gaming procs and snapshotting their DoTs... snapshotting was essentially removed in WOD... but this will bring it back for those who want to choose for themselves to do it.

    if you don't like RNG you just take a different talent; might i recommend Grimoire of Supremacy for sustained non-RNG-based damage, and Grimoire of Service for on demand burst damage?
    Snapshotting is gone for WoD. You can't "game" PPM procs (i.e. Black Blood), so with those two things you can see my point. So... yeah, I would have liked to play demo pet-less and non rng dependent, and now that possibility is gone.

  16. #356
    Field Marshal Leyl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taninsam View Post
    Snapshotting is gone for WoD. You can't "game" PPM procs (i.e. Black Blood), so with those two things you can see my point. So... yeah, I would have liked to play demo pet-less and non rng dependent, and now that possibility is gone.
    I kind of think you just proved your original statement invalid though. The entire spec centers around stance dancing, and maximizing procs like Molten Core, and also managing cooldowns like Dark Soul. Demonless demonology? Please tell me how that makes any bit of sense whatsoever for a spec reliant on pets? Zero. I'd say look at the other specs, and classes if you want no pet constantly. Chaos and mayhem are the equivalent of RNG and the bread and butter of warlocks. Steering this chaos to your favor is the heart and soul of the class. If this was not the case, then what would we be? Simple shadow mages who sit murmuring glibly in a corner? That role is filled by Shadow Priests.

    The addition of GoSyn just means we will have to watch for it to hit, with our trinkets, then pop Dark Soul, and then throw Demon Bolt and other CDs. I don't believe I see an issue with any of this at all. Snapshotting going away makes all this easier. The DoTs briefly get more powerful, then go back to being normal dots is how I thought the new non-snapshotting method of DoTs worked in WoD. With a nuke, it works the same way, so you cast Demon Bolt when GoSyn procs, and if you have CDs up - great.

    Since they are changing Demonbolt though we'll see what happens...

  17. #357
    Quote Originally Posted by Count Zero View Post
    Yeah. They should just call the talent "Bound in Blood" or something like that, idk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    i am hoping it will still be a powerful spell saved for taking advantage of trinket procs and buring off high-levels DF...
    i wouldn't mind if that fiddly refund mechanic was made somehow less fiddly...

    perhaps it will be scrapped altogether... i can't imagine what it would be replaced with, maybe some alteration to ToC?
    What if it replaced Soul Fire in Meta, had it's damage/cost normalized to be high but not scale with Fury, didn't auto crit but refunded X amount of Fury when it crits?
    Last edited by Roujeaux; 2014-07-24 at 02:24 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by pingdan View Post
    When life gives you lemons, throw them back and say, "WTF life?"

  18. #358
    Quote Originally Posted by Leyl View Post
    I kind of think you just proved your original statement invalid though. The entire spec centers around stance dancing, and maximizing procs like Molten Core, and also managing cooldowns like Dark Soul. Demonless demonology? Please tell me how that makes any bit of sense whatsoever for a spec reliant on pets? Zero. I'd say look at the other specs, and classes if you want no pet constantly. Chaos and mayhem are the equivalent of RNG and the bread and butter of warlocks. Steering this chaos to your favor is the heart and soul of the class. If this was not the case, then what would we be? Simple shadow mages who sit murmuring glibly in a corner? That role is filled by Shadow Priests.

    The addition of GoSyn just means we will have to watch for it to hit, with our trinkets, then pop Dark Soul, and then throw Demon Bolt and other CDs. I don't believe I see an issue with any of this at all. Snapshotting going away makes all this easier. The DoTs briefly get more powerful, then go back to being normal dots is how I thought the new non-snapshotting method of DoTs worked in WoD. With a nuke, it works the same way, so you cast Demon Bolt when GoSyn procs, and if you have CDs up - great.

    Since they are changing Demonbolt though we'll see what happens...
    Why am I proving it invalid? And why is petless demonology a "nonsense"? I play demo simply because I enjoy the "become a demon" theme and because of the complexity/versatility of the spec, not because the reliance on demon pets for fury regen. Actually, the most fun I've had with demo was on 5.2, when you could go GoSac on multitarget encounters due to UVLS imp army + t15 2pc/4pc.

    While I enjoy RNG and meta dancing, sometimes I'd like more predictability and control, and that's why I would've had enjoyed the option to run petless demo with a fixed increased regen.

    GoSyn is another thing we have to watch for, another layer of RNG. And I feel we have too much of that already. YMMV, of course.

  19. #359
    still waiting for them to give us back carrion swarm, I'm not sure about the rest of you but it was a great utility spell during pve gameplay. I used it a ton and am not sure why they don't want warlocks to have a simple knockback when they gave it to hunters through a glyph.

  20. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    some players LOVE LOVE LOVE gaming procs and snapshotting their DoTs... snapshotting was essentially removed in WOD... but this will bring it back for those who want to choose for themselves to do it.

    if you don't like RNG you just take a different talent; might i recommend Grimoire of Supremacy for sustained non-RNG-based damage, and Grimoire of Service for on demand burst damage?
    Off the top of my head, the best way to game this proc for Demo would be to pop into Meta and use your Molten Core stacks. As well as casting HoG/Cataclysm/Demonbolt (if they make it better).

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