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  1. #1

    Is warlock too nerfed this exp?

    I havent played the Beta so I dont know how warlocks are performing in raiding but I have read that they are at the bottom of the DPS meters in PVE, with all the specs, even Demonology with Demonbolt

    May someone comment about that?

    I only raid as a warlock

  2. #2
    nobody can tell you what class will be top or bottom yet. Wait and see. Blizzard is still doing tuning just recently.

  3. #3
    The numbers arent the problem-they can be fixed.The problem is utility,mobility,and class tools,which is an area where warlocks were completely destroyed,in all three specs.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    The numbers arent the problem-they can be fixed.The problem is utility,mobility,and class tools,which is an area where warlocks were completely destroyed,in all three specs.
    Thanks ,about utility are you talking about hearthstones with only one charge per fight and the teleport gates right?

  5. #5
    My guild was doing normal Highmaul yesterday, and I (destro) was somewhere between 1-5 for basically every fight. On the last boss (imperator?) I was top 2 every attempt.

  6. #6
    Healthstones gutted(Alchemy item Health Tonics are better versions so they pretty much dont exist in proper raiding),gateway a shadow of its MOP version.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    Healthstones gutted(Alchemy item Health Tonics are better versions so they pretty much dont exist in proper raiding),gateway a shadow of its MOP version.
    tonics are from first aid

  8. #8
    Warlock always get the major nerf bat after they were buff for an expansion. I too main a warlock.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    The numbers arent the problem-they can be fixed.The problem is utility,mobility,and class tools,which is an area where warlocks were completely destroyed,in all three specs.
    Seems you need to read up on more than just Destruction, and read up on the changes to all classes regarding these issues. Destruction requires you to stand perfectly still like you are fighting Patchwork. But that's not an uncommon issue for any except Hunters now. They removed the mobility from virtually every single class in game, again Hunters being the exception. Its an intentional design choice, and one that has been used in the past with Hunters being the "utility" class.

    There are other options though. I made the switch to Affliction in 6.0.2 because of the changes made to the game. Yes Destruction will sim higher, but I am overall more useful to my raid as Affliction since I can't stand in one spot, attacking 1 target, for every boss fight. I also use my Fel Imp instead of my Observer for better raid utility as well. Yes my Observer does a little more DPS than my Fel Imp, but with my Fel Imp I get a free heal on a 30 second CD and my Imp can free me from Stuns, Silences, Fears, Horrors, etc. That's all on top of the main benefits of Affliction with my DoTs allowing me to maintain better consistent DPS on high movement fights.

    The problem that you, and countless others seem to be facing, is you are upset that the top DPS spec doesn't have access to the same raid utility. Blizzard has made a specific design change that forces you to pick one or the other, but you don't get both any more. The only two issues that need to be addressed is the low health from health stones and the range on the gateways. I have no issue with healthstones having the same limits as health potions, sharing a CD and not refreshing until out of combat. But if they are going to do that, then the healthstones need to provide the same amount of healing as a health potion.

    As for the gateways, maybe 70 yards was too far, but 40 yards is not enough. Its too small for it to make any difference and the exists now despawn if you get too far out of range. This is for doing the same fights, like Thok, from before the patch when your exit would have been even further away from you. But now, you drop your gate and go to your stacking spot, and the exit just disappears. The entrance stays up, even though it becomes useless.

    I didn't go over Demo in depth because I haven't messed with it too much, but it has better mobility than Destro as well. So again, there are other options to go with for Warlock.
    Cooler Master HAF X : Intel Core i7 2600K @ 4.7GHz : Corsair A70 cooler : 8GB DDR3 1600MHz Corsair Vengeance LP : ASUS P8Z68 V-PRO/Gen3 : EVGA GTX GTX 670 FTW SIG2

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    They removed the mobility from virtually every single class in game, again Hunters being the exception.
    And here we go again. It is unbelievable how many people bought into this.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    They removed the mobility from virtually every single class in game, again Hunters being the exception. Its an intentional design choice, and one that has been used in the past with Hunters being the "utility" class.
    No... they didn't.

    Pretty much only warlocks and ele shaman got the mobility nerf. I can log my resto druid and run around with just as much mobility as I had pre-patch. Same with most specs.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by andromalia View Post
    And here we go again. It is unbelievable how many people bought into this.
    Even if we just got old Nightfall back it would feel better. (A random free instant cast shadowbolt demo, incenerate destro etc.)

    I leveled a mage to 90 recently and it feels more enjoyable, warlocks feel so clunky now.

  13. #13
    They removed the mobility from virtually every single class in game, again Hunters being the exception. Its an intentional design choice, and one that has been used in the past with Hunters being the "utility" class.
    They removed none of the mobility of Shadowpriests,Mages,and Balance Druids.They also removed or indirectly nerfed other things too,such as removing Drain Life and Health Funnel from Destro,adding a Soul Shard cost to Soul Swap(multidotting too op dude) and countless other ability removals disguised as"pruning".

    But if they are going to do that, then the healthstones need to provide the same amount of healing as a health potion.
    Healthstones are NO LONGER NEEDED in a raid.Anyone with First Aid can create his own,superior versions now.They pretty much dont exist in game,if you dont mind gathering Tonic materials.

  14. #14
    They started this journey telling everyone locks would barely be touched this time owing to the significant changes last time.I don't think I've ever been so underwhelmed with a new expansion.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    They removed none of the mobility of Shadowpriests,Mages,and Balance Druids.They also removed or indirectly nerfed other things too,such as removing Drain Life and Health Funnel from Destro,adding a Soul Shard cost to Soul Swap(multidotting too op dude) and countless other ability removals disguised as"pruning".



    Healthstones are NO LONGER NEEDED in a raid.Anyone with First Aid can create his own,superior versions now.They pretty much dont exist in game,if you dont mind gathering Tonic materials.

    Exactly if a mage has always been frost they wont barely see a difference they have utterly eviscerated the lock class why is anyone's Guess.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    My guild was doing normal Highmaul yesterday, and I (destro) was somewhere between 1-5 for basically every fight. On the last boss (imperator?) I was top 2 every attempt.
    You are, however, hardly the benchmark of generic Destruction performance.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    They removed none of the mobility of Shadowpriests,Mages,and Balance Druids.They also removed or indirectly nerfed other things too,such as removing Drain Life and Health Funnel from Destro,adding a Soul Shard cost to Soul Swap(multidotting too op dude) and countless other ability removals disguised as"pruning".



    Healthstones are NO LONGER NEEDED in a raid.Anyone with First Aid can create his own,superior versions now.They pretty much dont exist in game,if you dont mind gathering Tonic materials.
    Sorch for mages is even better now that it provides a movement speed buff. Shadowpriests got buffed since they can now fully spam Shadow Word Pain for instant damage while moving since snapshotting has been removed. I'm not sure about Balance Druids since I've never played one.

  17. #17
    I main a lock, and the mobility is just horrible (non-existant). I logged on my hunter who I haven't played in months and the mobility is exactly the same. There will definitely need to be some tweaks made

  18. #18
    Spec by spec destro is probably the least mobile, ele close to it, then spread spectrum with hunters on the maximum mobility end of things. Healthstones need to at least equal what non locks can get from first aid or alchemy, don't see how that is game breaking short of saving your guild/mates some mats/reagents.

    Gateway has been a buggy steaming pile of poo since its MoP beta inception. Locks have nothing like amp magic, nothing special numbers wise, and require some babysitting from healers due to lifetapping so much more. Please take gateway out, buff lock mobility slightly, and give us something for our lvl 87 skill that has reliable non buggy raid utility.

    Too nerfed is subjective but the way decisions/actions are being made I hold out very little hope for 100 or the rest of the expansion.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    Seems you need to read up on more than just Destruction, and read up on the changes to all classes regarding these issues.
    No. It seems like you do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    They removed the mobility from virtually every single class in game, again Hunters being the exception. Its an intentional design choice, and one that has been used in the past with Hunters being the "utility" class.
    This is incorrect. Balance Druids, Shadowpriests, Frost Mages, Fire Mages and Arcane Mages have all had their damage-on-the-move options improved in WoD. You're right about hunters, though. The only classes to have their damage-on-the-move options nerfed are Shamans and Warlocks, most notably Destruction Warlocks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    The problem that you, and countless others seem to be facing, is you are upset that the top DPS spec doesn't have access to the same raid utility. Blizzard has made a specific design change that forces you to pick one or the other, but you don't get both any more.
    Odd choice of words. Raid utility is most commonly used to describe spells and abilities that allow you to offer something unique or worthwhile to your raid as a whole. Healthstones, Gates, Heroism, Amp. Magic, Stampeding Roar etc. In that department Blizzard has not made any intentional design changes that forces us to choose between two different things. Gates have been nerfed, as have Healthstones. As you point out yourself:
    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    The only two issues that need to be addressed is the low health from health stones and the range on the gateways.
    If you are, in fact, referring to the KJC nerf, then yes, we have to choose. We also had to choose before, though. It was just a simpler choice. To that end, I don't think I've seen anyone complain about having to choose. I've seen plenty people upset that all T90 options are generally horrible, though.
    Last edited by Shamran; 2014-10-28 at 09:47 PM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Sorch for mages is even better now that it provides a movement speed buff. Shadowpriests got buffed since they can now fully spam Shadow Word Pain for instant damage while moving since snapshotting has been removed. I'm not sure about Balance Druids since I've never played one.
    Balance Druids have had their spammable instant improved in that Sunfire is now automatically spread to all targets inside a 5 yard radius (Lunar Shower reworked into Astral Showers). And the benefit from snapshot-removal applies as well, of course. Also, Starsurge made instant with Lperks.
    Last edited by Shamran; 2014-10-28 at 07:15 PM.

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