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  1. #401
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyand1337 View Post
    Good thing is its long cast time. You can keep cancelling the cast and chase them around with that big glowing void zone that somehow seems to follow that rogue :O
    You're a terrible person.

  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    You're a terrible person.
    /Jack Sparrow/

    Warlock!

  3. #403
    OK so now we know where gosyn stands, no CD but only 1.3333rppm leaving us with 3.75 DPS increase, fairly sure that's half of what gosup gives and 35% of what goserve gives seems a lil on the weak side

  4. #404
    simple test 5 minute in combat 40.7% uptime on pet and 22.9% for my me. Burning Rush also procs it for your pet right now too.
    Last edited by DesireKT; 2014-07-30 at 08:01 AM.

  5. #405
    The Lightbringer Lovestar's Avatar
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    Hey guys, I'm currently swooning over the new Demo Lock I'm leveling — so cool, so much fun. And, as is my wont, I'm getting ahead of myself and daydreaming about Demo in WoD and its new toys.

    One thing that strikes me is that Grimoire of Synergy — while an improvement over Grim Sac, which IMO was never realized very well — is still pretty bland. Demo already has Grim Sup as the "easy" / "passive" talent (if you don't count redoing macros / pet bars), and Synergy doesn't really add as much as the other Grimoire designs.

    Gaming the big damage buff to coincide with Meta / AoEs is probably compelling gameplay-wise, but it doesn't have the flash and punch that Sac did and Sup / Service still do (in the sense of big "HA HA HA, I AM A WARLOCK" buttons).

    Sooooo I was imagining alternatives for Demo that could replace Sac, but still keep the spirit of that talent option instead of arbitrarily replacing it (like Synergy does). I was going to make graphical mock-ups and stuff, but then I thought it might be smarter to run my idea past experienced Demo Locks so you guys can abusively shoot it full of holes (haha ) and/or help refine it first. So:

    Demonology: Grimoire of Fusion
    • Teaches you the ability Demonic Fusion. You and your demon merge souls, combining into a fused Demon Form with improved abilities. Replaces Metamorphosis.
    • Your demon disappears while in Demonic Fusion, and reappears when you return to caster form.
    • The fused Demon Form looks like Meta, but with visual characteristics of your demon. For example, Felguard fuses into Meta with Felguard armor on and an Arcanite Reaper; Imp is a gnome-sized Meta form with oversized wings, horns, and tail (lol); Felhunter has creepy Felhunter spikes instead of wings. You get the idea.
    • While fused, you can use the same abilities as Grimoire of Sacrifice provides, plus a few others depending on the demon (because you're Demo and you're special).
    • Your Meta abilities change while fused based on the demon you fused with. For example, if you fuse with Felhunter, Touch of Chaos merges with Shadow Bite to become Chaos Bite: 10yd range, bites the enemy for Chaos damage. Also consumes 1 Magic effect, healing you if an effect is consumed, but this effect can only occur once every 10 seconds.
    • Behaves like Meta mechanically — you need Fury to maintain it.
    • The spreadsheet benefit is that your Meta just does more damage this way, either through the altered abilities or just a damage boost. Of course, it's balanced to be on par with Supremacy and Service overall.

    So, this still has the Sacrifice idea of "getting rid" of your demon, but does it in a Demonology-flavored way that doesn't really get rid of your demon — just temporarily absorbs them for personal power!

    Thoughts?

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by Lovestar View Post
    [*]The fused Demon Form looks like Meta, but with visual characteristics of your demon. For example, Felguard fuses into Meta with Felguard armor on and an Arcanite Reaper; Imp is a gnome-sized Meta form with oversized wings, horns, and tail (lol); Felhunter has creepy Felhunter spikes instead of wings. You get the idea.[*]While fused, you can use the same abilities as Grimoire of Sacrifice provides, plus a few others depending on the demon (because you're Demo and you're special).[*]Your Meta abilities change while fused based on the demon you fused with. For example, if you fuse with Felhunter, Touch of Chaos merges with Shadow Bite to become Chaos Bite: 10yd range, bites the enemy for Chaos damage. Also consumes 1 Magic effect, healing you if an effect is consumed, but this effect can only occur once every 10 seconds.[*]Behaves like Meta mechanically — you need Fury to maintain it.[*]The spreadsheet benefit is that your Meta just does more damage this way, either through the altered abilities or just a damage boost. Of course, it's balanced to be on par with Supremacy and Service overall.

    You dream so big.

  7. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Lovestar View Post
    Hey guys, I'm currently swooning over the new Demo Lock I'm leveling — so cool, so much fun. And, as is my wont, I'm getting ahead of myself and daydreaming about Demo in WoD and its new toys.

    One thing that strikes me is that Grimoire of Synergy — while an improvement over Grim Sac, which IMO was never realized very well — is still pretty bland. Demo already has Grim Sup as the "easy" / "passive" talent (if you don't count redoing macros / pet bars), and Synergy doesn't really add as much as the other Grimoire designs.

    Gaming the big damage buff to coincide with Meta / AoEs is probably compelling gameplay-wise, but it doesn't have the flash and punch that Sac did and Sup / Service still do (in the sense of big "HA HA HA, I AM A WARLOCK" buttons).

    Sooooo I was imagining alternatives for Demo that could replace Sac, but still keep the spirit of that talent option instead of arbitrarily replacing it (like Synergy does). I was going to make graphical mock-ups and stuff, but then I thought it might be smarter to run my idea past experienced Demo Locks so you guys can abusively shoot it full of holes (haha ) and/or help refine it first. So:

    Demonology: Grimoire of Fusion
    • Teaches you the ability Demonic Fusion. You and your demon merge souls, combining into a fused Demon Form with improved abilities. Replaces Metamorphosis.
    • Your demon disappears while in Demonic Fusion, and reappears when you return to caster form.
    • The fused Demon Form looks like Meta, but with visual characteristics of your demon. For example, Felguard fuses into Meta with Felguard armor on and an Arcanite Reaper; Imp is a gnome-sized Meta form with oversized wings, horns, and tail (lol); Felhunter has creepy Felhunter spikes instead of wings. You get the idea.
    • While fused, you can use the same abilities as Grimoire of Sacrifice provides, plus a few others depending on the demon (because you're Demo and you're special).
    • Your Meta abilities change while fused based on the demon you fused with. For example, if you fuse with Felhunter, Touch of Chaos merges with Shadow Bite to become Chaos Bite: 10yd range, bites the enemy for Chaos damage. Also consumes 1 Magic effect, healing you if an effect is consumed, but this effect can only occur once every 10 seconds.
    • Behaves like Meta mechanically — you need Fury to maintain it.
    • The spreadsheet benefit is that your Meta just does more damage this way, either through the altered abilities or just a damage boost. Of course, it's balanced to be on par with Supremacy and Service overall.

    So, this still has the Sacrifice idea of "getting rid" of your demon, but does it in a Demonology-flavored way that doesn't really get rid of your demon — just temporarily absorbs them for personal power!

    Thoughts?
    its kindof like another iteration of GrimSac only under the impression that you and your demon are pulling a voltron instead of just axe-ing the demon altogether.

    I think blizzard would like this, whether or not theyd put the time into giving each pet fusion a different meta model i dont think so.
    Adds a lot of flavor but again, I don't think this would happen.

    EDIT: I say blizzard would like this only because they seem to have a disdain for pet specs ditching their pet. I feel like this fits demonology a bit more, although fusing with my pet seems a little too cuddly to me. I prefer SACRIFICING HIM IN THE NAME OF HIS DARK LORD AND MASTER

  8. #408
    Epic! Skayth's Avatar
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    Meh grim of sac should simply be that, sac. You shouldnt make demonology "beast Master" when demonology cant even enslave different demons to do their bidding, like how a hunter can tame beasts.

    But, grim of sac should simply make it so that you get more fury from your abilities (to sub the demon's fury generation rather than a straight passive most people have been saying) and do more damage. In pve, it would put it on the same level as the other grims, in pvp, it would be less desirable, as ur dots can be cleansed, = less fury.

  9. #409
    Moderator Alarinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skayth View Post
    You shouldnt make demonology "beast Master" when demonology cant even enslave different demons to do their bidding, like how a hunter can tame beasts.
    Can't "even"?

    Are you comparing Infernals...

    Quote Originally Posted by Wowpedia
    Infernals have been known to destroy entire cities before their energies dissipated
    ... Annihilan (which we can't control, for good reason)...

    Quote Originally Posted by Wowpedia
    The annihilan pit lords are described as engines of destruction. They are driven by pure rage and bloodlust. [...] they are unimaginably powerful.
    ... Doomguards...

    Quote Originally Posted by Wowpedia
    With their savage weapons and horrific faces, the doomguard is a terrible foe to confront and behold. These monstrous, fiery warriors are nearly immune to magic and can defeat entire armies with their sheer strength alone.
    ... to dogs, cats, foxes, bears? I mean, from a lore-perspective, there's nothing stopping a warlock from literally annihilating any hunter or hunters pet by virtue of a summoned demon alone, based off of the power described in that lore. :P
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  10. #410
    Quote Originally Posted by Lovestar View Post
    Thoughts?
    Not realistic. It would work as a ability for Demo in general to great for the scope of a talent.
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  11. #411
    How about something very simple but very demo, allow you to summon a pitlord.
    Pitlord will do the same dps as GoSup pets and have the same fury generation.
    And Demonic Servitude just enhances the pitlords abilities and damage to be an equill dps/utility gain (just like doomguard->terrorguard) and slaps on the Brutalus skin or something rather then the "normal" Mannoroth/Azgalor/Magtheridon skin.
    Slap on the abilities based on the greenfire quest pitlord or from various pitlords we've encountered and adjust the numbers/abilities a bit.

    Wouldn't be hard to tune or to make atleast.
    Would be more demo like then GoSyn.

    For the lazy peeps the abilities that could work (with some of my own tweaks):
    - Fel Drain (Mannoroth): drains life from the target, the healing is split between the pitlord and the warlock.
    Demonic Servitude: drains more health.
    - Fel Firestorm (Mannoroth): pretty much green rain of fire.
    Demonic Servitude: deals more damage.
    - Cleave: like the warrior cleave.
    Demonic Servitude: deals more damage.
    - Doom (Azgalor and Warcraft 3): does damage over time like ours but when the target dies or the effect expires or is dispelled a lesser doomguard appears (not doing nearly as much damage as our normal one ofcousre).
    Demonic Servitude: less doomguard is a less terrorguard instead.
    - Howl of terror (Warcraft 3): reduces the damage done by all targets around the pit lord (does not work on bosses).
    Further increases the damage reduction.
    - Stomp (Brutallus): deals damage and knocks the target down.
    Demonic Servitude: deals more damage and the knockdown lasts longer.
    - Blast Nova (Magtheridon): pulse of fire coming from the pitlord, doing to all effected targets.
    Demonic Servitude: deals more damage.
    - Charge (green fire): like the warriors charge, roots.
    Demonic Servitude: root becomes a stun.
    - Demonic Siphon (green fire): life is drained from the pitlord and given to the warlock.
    Demonic Servitude: drains more.
    - Fel Flame Breath (green fire): channeled cone of fire, affected enemy targets take damage and are slowed and friendly targets are healed.
    Demonic Servitude: more damage and healing and enemy targets are rooted rather then slowed.

    Not give all of them ofcourse but some damage, some utility.
    And change the names of some abilities perhaps.
    Last edited by Porkisyum; 2014-07-30 at 10:10 PM.

  12. #412
    It would have to be a mini pit-lord, and still how would it mix with level 100 servitude?
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  13. #413
    How about replace Synergy with Grimoire of Subservience - gives you a Pitlord guardian with its own cd, but cannot be up same time as your other guardians. Would not be affected by Servitude, meaning if you take Servitude you could have a permanent Doomguard/Infernal and still have a Pitlord cd.

    Would kinda suck for the other specs, but I think it would be fitting for Demonology.
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  14. #414
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    It would have to be a mini pit-lord, and still how would it mix with level 100 servitude?
    Yeah propably the size of a devilsaur during bestial wrath, shouldnt have to be all that miniature tbh.
    How it's mixed with demonic servitude is explained, would work like GoSup does for other pets but only applies to the pitlord.
    The normal effect of demonic servitude obviously doesn't apply then.

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by Count Zero View Post
    How about replace Synergy with Grimoire of Subservience - gives you a Pitlord guardian with its own cd, but cannot be up same time as your other guardians. Would not be affected by Servitude, meaning if you take Servitude you could have a permanent Doomguard/Infernal and still have a Pitlord cd.

    Would kinda suck for the other specs, but I think it would be fitting for Demonology.
    I vote for this.
    Simple, with flavour, works well with lvl 100 talent.
    Hope someone blue read this forum.

  16. #416
    Titan Nerraw's Avatar
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    There's no way in hell they're gonna give us a pit lord, despite how exceedingly cool it would be.

  17. #417
    I love the grimoire of synergy as a concept. It fits with demo and functionally is quite similar to sacrifice for the other two specs - it pulls some of the power of your pet into your own casts.

    The other reason I've enjoyed playing with it so far on beta is that it is reactive. I'm a fan of our current 2-set, and playing around the Grim:Synergy buff is bringing back some of the more fun aspects of the spec which will be removed (Snapshotting Doom, Shadowflame weaving).

    Going into WoD and with Mythic - I'm probably completely wrong in hoping for it but hey - there is potential for a raid mechanic where we get to finally use enslave demon? It felt great on the green fire quest. Please?

  18. #418
    They stated fairly early on that one of the main reasons they were going with a fixed Mythic Raid size was so that they could design encounters around niche class abilities like in Vanilla and BC. We'll just have to wait and see if that actually happens.

  19. #419
    And while stating that they nerfed gate so it won't be 'required' for encounters and effectively removed Healthstones (nerf + making health pots not share cd with combat pots).

    Don't hold your breath, at best you will may see marginal use of Banish.

  20. #420
    Quote Originally Posted by Orloth View Post
    They stated fairly early on that one of the main reasons they were going with a fixed Mythic Raid size was so that they could design encounters around niche class abilities like in Vanilla and BC. We'll just have to wait and see if that actually happens.
    Erm, pretty sure that's completely false. It was so they didn't have to balance 10 man, vs 25 man. That's always been a huge pain, and with one size, it's now not a problem. The other more forgiving difficulties are all flex, too. So all those problems have gone.

    You did say 'one of' the main reasons, but i've never heard that. What does that actually mean? Niche class abilities? Warlock gate ways?

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