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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I read it.

    And you know, it could have been a a thought-provoking read because I think you do make a couple of good points. But when you pull statistics out of your ass in order to bolster your argument/seemed more informed than you actually are, you tend to put sensible people in eyeroll mode. Meaning stuff like the '80% of all gamers are bro gamers' comment.

    Really? So of the hundreds of millions of people who play video games, you've went around and polled them and discovered that for every 5, 4 of them are lazy 'bros' who want spoonfed easymode? Wait, no you didn't do that? Then how exactly are you qualified to make that analysis?

    Easy answer: you aren't.

    Yes, some of the stuff you mentioned are things which are actually happening in the gaming market. But its just a little obnoxious when people like you declare anything that doesn't cater to their specific tastes to be a terrible and unjust thing.

    Me for example, I generally dislike 'jprgs' like Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest. Generally speaking I don't care for FP games (though some, like Bioshock, are excellent) and frankly I hate MMOs as a rule (WoW being the exception).

    But the difference between people like you and me, I think, is that I understand that those are *my* preferences. I respect that there are people who LOVE Final Fantasy with the kind of passion that could set fire to a couch. I understand that, at least until recently, FPS games were a HUGELY popular genre. I understand that the MMO is a genre of gaming that is never, ever going away.

    Similarly I don't sit around getting mad about the way other people want to play their games, or whining that they want it easy while 'real gamers' play hard games in hardmode. I don't sit around making topics like this one pulling numbers out of my ass to seem like I've got some understanding that I don't actually have. You don't know if 80%, 5%, 12% or 66.6% of gamers fit the criteria you describe.

    Nor should you care. We're fucking playing video games. This is not some badge of honor against which your life will be measured. It doesn't make you more of a badass to play Bioshock 2 in Hard difficulty than some other gamer who plays it in normal. You aren't saving lives, you aren't putting out fires. You aren't solving real-world problems. You're sitting on your ass, clicking a mouse or mashing your ABXYLR buttons.

    Seriously, find some shit that MATTERS to be so hung up about. Drop annoying walls of text about stuff with actual, honest-to-God significance... like starving children. Putting an end to racism and bullying and intolerance. Equal rights.

    In short: go get some sun and worry more about yourself, and a whole hell of a lot less about other people.
    Pretty sure I just heard Jesus say amen to that.

  2. #62
    I am Murloc! Valyrian Stormclaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valyrian Stormclaw View Post
    You need to watch this: http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1017784...alue-of-Player

    Skip to the marketing breakdown on the two types of gamers who purchase video games.
    For all the "Bro Gamer 80% Figure is False" people.

  3. #63
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Alright, I watched that one part.

    First, from the video, it's 65%, not 80%. You're just flat out lying, assuming you were pulling that data from the video.

    Second, you misunderstood the video (which is where I think you're attempting to make a case from).

    The "Bro Gamer" they refer to are people who don't have a lot of time to commit to games, and want to have a fun experience quickly, and easily. Usually winning equates to fun, most of the time. This has nothing to do with CoD, kids, or whiny highschoolers. You pretty much just made that part up.

    All I really got from watching that is that you misinterpreted some useful information on marketing.
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  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Alright, I watched that one part.

    First, from the video, it's 65%, not 80%. You're just flat out lying, assuming you were pulling that data from the video.

    Second, you misunderstood the video (which is where I think you're attempting to make a case from).

    The "Bro Gamer" they refer to are people who don't have a lot of time to commit to games, and want to have a fun experience quickly, and easily. Usually winning equates to fun, most of the time. This has nothing to do with CoD, kids, or whiny highschoolers. You pretty much just made that part up.

    All I really got from watching that is that you misinterpreted some useful information on marketing.
    Yeah, and IIRC the average game consumer age is ~30, so it makes sense for people at that age to want a fun experience quickly, due to a lot of people at that age having kids

  5. #65
    I am Murloc! Valyrian Stormclaw's Avatar
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    What I said was that the CoD kids were apart of said crowd. I wasn't saying that all Bro's were stirring up discontent; the people in general I was addressing was but a small part of the whole.

    And apparently yes, I got the exact figures wrong. Editing

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyese View Post
    Supergiant Games has put out 2 extremely amazing titles in spite of the "genre conventions" you're talking about. Transistor has easily surpassed almost every game I've played in the past couple of years, and I've done a lot of gaming. In fact, I give it an 11/10. Other developers are taking this path as well, albeit with smaller, less risky titles and IPs. Far Cry Blood Dragon is a great example of a game that was crafted out of passion and a genuine sense of fun. Borderlands 2, although many could say it's pretty much a retread, is a game that had a lot of its creative energy channeled into making a dystopian world where guns shot guns that shot other guns. X-Com Enemy Unknown is a tribute to the super old 90's games WHILE still managing to evolve with the current times. You forget the "gaming bubbles" that existed long ago (the Survival Horror explosion after the success of Resident Evil, the RPG over-saturation with the success off FF7, the music gaming bonanza that stemmed from Guitar Hero, the current FPS cornucopia thanks to Halo/Modern Warfare, now MOBA/ARTS boom that was fathered by the DOTA WC3 mod.), and honestly, it's just another shift in the evolution of the gaming industry. Except, this time, you were one of the people left behind.

    EDIT: Others that were left behind: Flight Sim/Dogfighting style gamers, city/worldbuilding gamers (that aren't into 3X), true adventure gamers (King's Quest, Grim Fandango), arguably traditional JRPG gamers, classic survival horror gamers (Fatal Frame, Dead Space, Silent Hill), classic FPS gamers (Duke Nukem 3D, Wolfenstein although the new one is decent, Half-Life). The list goes on.
    I can't tell whats worse. The utter attempt to try and sound hip and cool or the cow towing to shitty mass produced games and calling them great. Here is a hint babe.

    FF7 didn't start of the over-Saturation of RPGS.

    Bioware and Oblivion did.
    "What do you seek within the mountain?"

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Valyrian Stormclaw View Post
    There used to be a time when developers didn't make games with the sole intent of making money. They didn't just go, "Hey! I wanna make money. I'm gonna make a video game. I'm gonna steal all these other ideas, looks back into the 'Great Book of Stock Video Game Essentials the Supposedly Everyone Must Get', put up a big, huge advertizing campaign and 'wow' people by pushing all their buttons with nice sounding lines.
    That time has never existed. There has been shovelware as long as there's been software.

  8. #68
    Stupid kids with terrible taste have always been a large part of the gaming market. You just never noticed before because YOU USED TO BE ONE OF THEM.

    Welcome to getting old
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
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    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Valyrian Stormclaw View Post
    For all the "Bro Gamer 80% Figure is False" people.
    does cod make up 80% of video game sales?

    no?

    then bro gamers dont fucking make up 80% of video game sales.

    bro gamers are the type of people who walk into a gamestop and are like
    "uuuuh you got da new call of duty"

    "theres no new call of duty yet"

    "well uhhh whats a game id like thats like call of duty"

    "well theres lots of fps games can you be more descriptive about what you like"

    "I LIKE CALL OF DUTY BRO IM HARDCORE YOU TRYNA SAY IM NOT A HARDCORE GAMER JUST GIVE ME SOMETHIN LIEK CALL OF DUTY GAAWWWD NERD"

    bro gamers are like a pack of idiots who just beat their heads against the same genre over and over and over and over again until the herd moves on to the next genre. its been fps for awhile now.

    they are in no way "80% of gamers"

    its not even fair to call them gamers at all because when it comes to any genre or even seperate game series they stick their heads in the sand and try to pretend it doesnt exist. you either like cod or battlefied and if you dont like the one they'll like they will try to get in a fight about it.

    their like console fanboys but even more retarded
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  10. #70
    Casuals do ruin video games but they also fund them. That's the problem. I don't care as long as there are different difficulty modes of gaming like Heroic and Mythic in WoW and etc and they express that these harder difficulties aren't meant for the casuals. Leave my fun alone since 95%+ of video games are made for you. That's all I care about.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    does cod make up 80% of video game sales?

    no?

    then bro gamers dont fucking make up 80% of video game sales.

    bro gamers are the type of people who walk into a gamestop and are like
    "uuuuh you got da new call of duty"

    "theres no new call of duty yet"

    "well uhhh whats a game id like thats like call of duty"

    "well theres lots of fps games can you be more descriptive about what you like"

    "I LIKE CALL OF DUTY BRO IM HARDCORE YOU TRYNA SAY IM NOT A HARDCORE GAMER JUST GIVE ME SOMETHIN LIEK CALL OF DUTY GAAWWWD NERD"

    bro gamers are like a pack of idiots who just beat their heads against the same genre over and over and over and over again until the herd moves on to the next genre. its been fps for awhile now.

    they are in no way "80% of gamers"

    its not even fair to call them gamers at all because when it comes to any genre or even seperate game series they stick their heads in the sand and try to pretend it doesnt exist. you either like cod or battlefied and if you dont like the one they'll like they will try to get in a fight about it.

    their like console fanboys but even more retarded
    You do realize bro gamers play other games too right?

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Lesalia View Post
    That time has never existed. There has been shovelware as long as there's been software.
    this. even when games were like 90 quid and were super niche there was still plenty of crap. and back then you couldnt just google and find a video explaining that the game was crap you had to find a magazine and hope somebody talked about it in it and if not you had to take a chance and if it wasnt good fuck you guess your stuck with shit for however long it takes you to have the money to buy another one

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Marika View Post
    You do realize bro gamers play other games too right?
    very rarely do bro gamers play other games. they occasionally will pick up the hyped up games that try to attract them like watchdogs and grand theft auto and batmans and whatnot but for the most part bro gamers dont buy alot of games

    alot of them also bought skyrim but i hope that doesnt happen again. dont want bro gamers fucking up rpgs like they fucked up fps games
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  13. #73
    While there is some truth in the "bro gamer" thing, I find the division between "casuals" and "true" gamers to be snobbery and stupid clique politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lyese View Post
    Supergiant Games has put out 2 extremely amazing titles in spite of the "genre conventions" you're talking about. Transistor has easily surpassed almost every game I've played in the past couple of years, and I've done a lot of gaming. In fact, I give it an 11/10. Other developers are taking this path as well, albeit with smaller, less risky titles and IPs. Far Cry Blood Dragon is a great example of a game that was crafted out of passion and a genuine sense of fun. Borderlands 2, although many could say it's pretty much a retread, is a game that had a lot of its creative energy channeled into making a dystopian world where guns shot guns that shot other guns. X-Com Enemy Unknown is a tribute to the super old 90's games WHILE still managing to evolve with the current times. You forget the "gaming bubbles" that existed long ago (the Survival Horror explosion after the success of Resident Evil, the RPG over-saturation with the success off FF7, the music gaming bonanza that stemmed from Guitar Hero, the current FPS cornucopia thanks to Halo/Modern Warfare, now MOBA/ARTS boom that was fathered by the DOTA WC3 mod.), and honestly, it's just another shift in the evolution of the gaming industry. Except, this time, you were one of the people left behind.

    EDIT: Others that were left behind: Flight Sim/Dogfighting style gamers, city/worldbuilding gamers (that aren't into 3X), true adventure gamers (King's Quest, Grim Fandango), arguably traditional JRPG gamers, classic survival horror gamers (Fatal Frame, Dead Space, Silent Hill), classic FPS gamers (Duke Nukem 3D, Wolfenstein although the new one is decent, Half-Life). The list goes on.
    Also the RTS bloom. Remember TA and Dark Reign and all the other games that came out in the wake of the golden age of Warcraft/C&C.

    Duke Nukem 3D is really part of a second or third generation of FPS. First you had the Wolfenstein era, then the DOOM era (once upon a time FPS was referred to as "DOOM clones" haha) then DN3D was kind of a little sub-era at the tail end of that era, then there was the Quake era, and the Half Life era, then graphics really kicked into high gear and there were a few little eras in there until the MFPS era took off (which I think started with Allied Assault or COD, not sure which).
    Last edited by Mormolyce; 2014-06-09 at 01:26 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    very rarely do bro gamers play other games. they occasionally will pick up the hyped up games that try to attract them like watchdogs and grand theft auto and whatnot but for the most part bro gamers dont buy alot of games
    So yes we agree they play other games too, only the most hyped mainstream ones though. Your previous post was just a rant over people who play CoD.

  15. #75
    Pandaren Monk solvexx's Avatar
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    Wow, you were seriously bored when you wrote this.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marika View Post
    You do realize bro gamers play other games too right?
    Of course he doesn't, he doesn't realise that he is as much as a casual poisoning the gaming industry as the Bro gamers in the eyes of people like me, who played Video games for a LONG time.
    "What do you seek within the mountain?"

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by The Fiend View Post
    Of course he doesn't, he doesn't realise that he is as much as a casual poisoning the gaming industry as the Bro gamers in the eyes of people like me, who played Video games for a LONG time.
    i have nothing against casual gamers.

    casual gamers are not bro gamers. casual gamers are just people who like to play video games once in awhile, they see something that looks cool or fun or their friends tell them to check something out they go pick it up.

    theres nothing wrong at all with casual gamers.

    bro gamers are a specific type of person who are awful. the thing about casual gamers is that they dont put on a front, they dont act like they are super hardcore or anything and they dont usually care about what other people play.

    bro gamers THINK they are hardcore gamers because they pick up the latest call of duty or battlefront. and they think that gives them the right to act like the rest of gamers are nerds.

    all bro gamers are douchebags, they're the type of people who wish they were jocks so they play these "hardcore" games that they think make them look cool.
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    bro gamers THINK they are hardcore gamers because they pick up the latest call of duty or battlefront. and they think that gives them the right to act like the rest of gamers are nerds.

    all bro gamers are douchebags, they're the type of people who wish they were jocks so they play these "hardcore" games that they think make them look cool.
    Then let them be douchebags if that's what they want. They are a minority and most certainly not the reason why Skyrim was overly simplified.

    You are acting quite elitist yourself and you play/played some pretty mainstream casual games too, WoW being one of them.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Marika View Post
    Then let them be douchebags if that's what they want. They are a minority and most certainly not the reason why Skyrim was overly simplified.

    You are acting quite elitist yourself and you play/played some pretty mainstream casual games too, WoW being one of them.
    i have nothing against casual or mainstream games why would people think that about what i said?

    if anything im a casual gamer myself, i mostly play games for the storylines, im not really in anyway a hardcore gamer gameplaywise.

    im not saying that call of duty and batman and skyrim and watchdogs are all bad games i like some of those games, im not saying all the people who play those games are bro gamers, the majority arent, they just think the game is cool or they like batman or ubisoft sucked them in with the hype.

    im talking specifically about bro gamers. they are a real thing, i have seen them. they are a specific type of person.

    i am in no way insulting casual players
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  20. #80
    Pandaren Monk Lyese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Fiend View Post
    I can't tell whats worse. The utter attempt to try and sound hip and cool or the cow towing to shitty mass produced games and calling them great. Here is a hint babe.

    FF7 didn't start of the over-Saturation of RPGS.

    Bioware and Oblivion did.
    Oh man....I guess SaGa Frontier, Breath of Fire III, Tactics Ogre, Megaman Legends, Tales of Destiny, Xenogears, Lunar, Blazing Blade, Brave Fencer Mushashi, Star Ocean: Second Story, Legend of Legaia, and Suidoken II all didn't come out in between FF7 and 8. Not to mention an RPG came out nearly every month for the rest of the year. It's almost like, A) I play video games and B) I know history. Sad thing is, those are just PS1 titles, not counting the other consoles.

    Bioware and Oblivion are also western RPG companies, for what it's worth. It's nearly a different genre from JRPGs.

    Kow-towing I think is the term you're looking for, as I'm not quite able to tow a cow. Transistor's a good game, you should try it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fiend View Post
    Of course he doesn't, he doesn't realise that he is as much as a casual poisoning the gaming industry as the Bro gamers in the eyes of people like me, who played Video games for a LONG time.
    That's pretty rich.
    Last edited by Lyese; 2014-06-09 at 02:48 AM.
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