Rant Time Again! Why Bro Gamers Ruin Gaming (Warning: Big Wall of Text Incoming)

[twiddler]

I can't help but concur. Been there myself watching founders alter their visions to meet the expectations of the VC involved and many can only imagine how painful and irritating it is for them. I guess optimism can come from video game development companies changing the pricing models. I believe Epic is going to be offering UDK4 at something like $50/mo. + 5% royalty which can defeat hiring a few engineers at $60-$70k a year.

[Manabomb]

first bro gamers didnt play video games
then bro gamers played sports games. we all remember this, every time a sports game came out thats all they did, then that died out alot.
then bro gamers moved onto guitar hero and thats all they played, then that like completely died out
then bro gamers moved onto call of duty and call of duty is kind of dying out right now but they all kind of still stick in the fps range right now with their battlefieds and there whatevers.

i dont know whats next but i dont want no damn bro gamers in my jrpgs

Do I have to be a dude bro gamer to be capable of enjoying Battlefield, or is it a common circumstance that dudebro gamers and I share a common interest?

Also, OP, markets grow and expand. Lowest common denominator is companies are out to make money, they develop something in the "safe room" of video gaming stereo types so it guarantees profit, mass produce 2 or 3 times for maximum effectiveness. Rinse repeat.

Remember when games had expansion packs that you could run separately from the vanilla game? I do miss the days of being able to choose whether or not I wanted to play Commander and Conquer Generals, or Command and Conquer Generals: Zero Hour.

[Deleted]

All I can say is, I feel you OP. And while I mostly agree with your post, I don't really think we should hate all these "bro" gamers. Games are for everyone to enjoy, not only the super-dedicated. What really pisses me off about the gaming industry though, this money-milking, DLC trend. I don't know where it came from and it most likely won't be going anywhere anytime soon. Game devs nowadays pour DLC's down your throat way before the game is even released, just to make you pay more for their games. Another trend which is gaining ground is that "Early Alpha Access" trend. You know what. I'm talking about. "Hay guyz, look at this game we're working on! Isn't it awesome? Give us more money so we can finish it." And if someone pays 19$ for Early Alpha, only to find a broken half-assed game, all they get for their criticism is "Wut did u xpect? It's alpha nab". What people don't seem to realise is that these "early alpha" games ALWAYS stay in alpha, once the devs get their money, they're out of the picture. -.-

[Delekii]

This is one of those posts where the person types a few names and a few concepts into a page and it prints out 20 paragraphs of total babbel, right?

ALA: http://www.pakin.org/complaint/


Right?


Wait, it's real?

Lol.

[Chelly]

And if someone pays 19$ for Early Alpha, only to find a broken half-assed game, all they get for their criticism is "Wut did u xpect? It's alpha nab".

Well duh? You're paying to play a game during it's alpha status, why are you surprised if you get a broken unfinished game?

What people don't seem to realise is that these "early alpha" games ALWAYS stay in alpha, once the devs get their money, they're out of the picture. -.-

No, not all of them. Yes there are some scumbag devs/publishers but most of them did get out of their alpha status.

[Vespian]

...Indeed...

Nice write-up. I once explained the same thing you did, but slightly shorter and I never came up with this bro-gamer definition. I personally feel we crossed the line between gamers (people that understand gaming and how development processes work, who give feedback and don't expect things to be delivered instantly. People who still understand they have to compete to obtain) and consumers (Instant gratification, throwing a fit when it turns out they're not entitled to all content unless they learn to play, couldn't care less about feedback, giving it or receiving it, and in general are just entirely unpleasant to deal with), which is entirely caused by the popularization of gaming.

And I actually think WoW was a big turning point in the industry. One of the few games even grandmothers play(ed) and they generally don't have that same affection for gaming.

[Ferocity]

Issue, described in original post, can be summarized in very easy way.

Blizzard made WoW, and after merge with Activision, they decided to monetize WoW by streamlining it, mass-advertizing (I saw WoW ads in many of our local shops, not much of other games) and changing it in a way, so it could be more like social network game - minimum intricacies, maximum users.

Other companies, seeing success of Blizzard, decided to copy-paste WoW under different sauce, and they were copy-pasting all the bad sides instead of copy-pasting something really good. Linear dungeons, primitive character progression systems, raid-centered game with everything else as a filler for "social" "players" - this can be applied to nearly every WoW-clone.

If someone is missing WoW as it was before (seeing it being one of main points in OP), missing good community, they can always check on EQ 1/2. EQ2 imo is what WoW was supposed to become (EQ1 might look way too dated and slow for some people, but still a very good MMO too). Seriously, after trying EQ2 you will laugh at countless WoW posts "Any new race?/Is housing coming?/New talent system rocks!!!oneone!eleven!". Game is more oriented around thinking and exploring than around godmode and rush factors, thus making barrier against all those moba/CoD people and having healthy community (EQ1's Vox has some dicks, but it is f2p server and it is still miles better than what is happening in WoW).

[1001]

Bro gamers will make a beeline for Star Citizen when it comes out, it has all aspects of gameplay they will love, it has the advertising that will draw them in like moths to a flame.

[Deleted]

What the hell are bro gamers?

[Zharradan]

"bros" are still people, and they pay for games, just like real nerd rpg fans, also, i didn't read your post op, title says it all

just because the call of duty crowd exist, doesn't mean we don't get dark souls games

[Danifilth]

I don't know how kids are getting suckered into buying 60$ unfinished games and release more DLC on launch when it suppose to be included with the game. The users report bugs on what ever broken game it is so the company doesn't have to pay testers. Then comes along a game that you have to pay 190$ dollars in dlc's deluxe more weapons more maps and so on for 1 single game. And the other problem is how are people fine with a 60$ game that you beat in 2 hours when you can watch a movie for 5 dollars that's over 2 hours? Games are starting to become less game play more scenes. Im still playing free DRM games from 1989-2002 that will last me 50-200 hours per play through. Splinter cell 2 hours per mission on hard mode tropico 50 mins to 2 hours per mission deus ex 1 39 mins per map and you get the idea. I made a mistake buying bioshock infinite after beating that game under 2 hours on hard and i see dlc's for 15 dollars for more chapters i was like no thanks im only buying games from gog from now on.

[Deleted]

It was an age...an age long gone; forgotten by the generation of today. An age where quality was held over quantity.

What are you talking about? The age of pong? Cause since the atari 2600 there has been tons of totally shitty games for any console.

What happens when you give in? Skyrim. There used to be planning involved in developing your character. Before you started an ES character, you planned out all his skills. You gave thought to it, and when you selected his skills and created the char, you committed yourself to that line of skills. And you had to actually walk to places. You had to actually journey to those places. But now, it's just a 5 minute run up the mountain to slay the dragon.

You know you can beat Morrorwind and Oblivion way faster than Skyrim? And if youre rushing the main story in any ES game and then complain you definitly bought the wrong game.

[zealo]

What the hell are bro gamers?

The term bro gamer usually refers to the kind of player that primarily plays on consoles and only buys perhaps 1 to 2 games per year to play with friends very casually, i.e things like fifa or CoD.

I think its a derogatory term when you can simply call them casuals but heh, that's how it is.

[Ferocity]

What are you talking about? The age of pong? Cause since the atari 2600 there has been tons of totally shitty games for any console.

I think he meant that earlier there were not only bad games but good ones as well. 1990-2005 was considered golden age of video-gaming because there were many great games released at that time. In 2005+ you can count good games on the fingers. Some subgenres almost completely died.

You know you can beat Morrorwind and Oblivion way faster than Skyrim? And if youre rushing the main story in any ES game and then complain you definitly bought the wrong game.

TES games were simply world simulators and never anything bigger than that. I know that Skyrim had a lot of systems' streamlining. I wouldn't call it as improvement to the series. Tbh, I wouldn't even agree with OP about planning in TES games, it was always about staying at lowest level possible without resting (except for Morrowind - there you wanted to rest once but just for expansion quest).

[Kathandira]

The term bro gamer usually refers to the kind of player that primarily plays on consoles and only buys perhaps 1 to 2 games per year to play with friends very casually, i.e things like fifa or CoD.

I think its a derogatory term when you can simply call them casuals but heh, that's how it is.

Hmmm, dunno If I am a "bro gamer". I do play primarily on consoles. I don't play FPS's really, there are only 2 i've ever owned. I just don't like being shoved in a corner of a room hunched over a computer desk for several hours a night. I do enough of that at work.

Mainly, my reasons for playing on consoles is 1 they don't require upgrades. Meaning I don't have to buy a $1,000 video card every 5 years just to keep up with the latest and greatest. And I really enjoy co-op at home. I have friends over every night to play games, on a PC, it would require they bring their rig with them, or we play a network game. Both have a physical separation factor.

Mostly I play RPG's and Action/Adventure games...and Forza..cause I love cars. lol.

As for the 2 games a year thing, I buy many many more than 2 a year. I already have 8 for my Xbox One that I bought 2 months ago. The 2 games a year could mean more than just people who don't want to invest, it could also mean parents. We as older people, tend to forget that a good portion of gamers, are kids between the ages of 8 - 16. Of coarse you see them on CoD and other online games, but there are plenty who are out there playing Skyrim and Tales Games and Tomb Raider and such. Since they are under the legal working age, they don't have money they can spend on their own. These kids get their games as gifts from parents or other family. That is how I was raised, until I was able to feed my gaming addiction on my own, my library was small. Once I was able to pay for games myself, well...lets just say I'm running out of places to put things as my library is taking over.

- - - Updated - - -

TES games were simply world simulators and never anything bigger than that. I know that Skyrim had a lot of systems' streamlining. I wouldn't call it as improvement to the series. Tbh, I wouldn't even agree with OP about planning in TES games, it was always about staying at lowest level possible without resting (except for Morrowind - there you wanted to rest once but just for expansion quest).

Funny enough, I don't do any planning in any game the first time around. I like to make mistakes (much like the OP stated is part of the fun) Living with the consequences of your actions and dealing with the results.

My first save is always my hybrid build. I like to test out how character building works and what works well and what doesn't. I can easily go to a guide and figure it out, but I save that for the second play through. For example, in Skyrim, I started out as a 1/2 1H sword, 1/2 Destro mage. It became very clear early on that this was a mistake for my first play through. Once at level 20, I decided to start a new game. I hit the talent calculator and did some planning. Ended up with a super efficient archer which I enjoyed a whole hell of a lot.

The same goes for WoW as well. When I used to play, I would always take the manual route first. Even when I led raids. We weren't racing for server firsts or anything, but did keep up with the content. We would first spend about 2-3 attempts dry. No video's, no guides. If players wanted to do that on their own, that was fine, but I wanted everyone to see the boss as it was intended first. After those 2-3 tries, we would all break to watch the video or read a guide then discuss. Next night would be real attempts. This offers the chance to beat the boss without having to rely on the info of others. It gives you the chance to say, I did it without anyone's help. After all, those who wrote the guides and beat the boss on their own, did exactly that. Why let them have all the pride?

[Ferocity]

Funny enough, I don't do any planning in any game the first time around. I like to make mistakes (much like the OP stated is part of the fun) Living with the consequences of your actions and dealing with the results.

I use same approach. I like to learn from my own mistakes and explore game this way rather then use premade guides (which I use but at the point when I am done with main part of the game).

The same goes for WoW as well. When I used to play, I would always take the manual route first. Even when I led raids. We weren't racing for server firsts or anything, but did keep up with the content. We would first spend about 2-3 attempts dry. No video's, no guides. If players wanted to do that on their own, that was fine, but I wanted everyone to see the boss as it was intended first. After those 2-3 tries, we would all break to watch the video or read a guide then discuss.

I was lucky with having similar guild in WoW during TBC/WotLK. I mean - what's the point in playing and discovering things on your own if you just watch videos/guides? Needless to say we had best progress on server and had our own special tactics on many bosses (which probably would be counted as "clever use of game mechanics" nowadays...). We had feral druid tank through all TBC content (and he tanked whole preTBC content), meanwhile a lot of people blindly repeated same bullsh1t - "druids are only good as resto, only warriors can tank". But when our guild collapsed with Cata (due to raid changes), my new guild was all about watching videos before each fight and knowing raid inside out before it is even released. That guild had so much drama inside and in the end it collapsed too but for different reason - lack of satisfying progress. People wanted everything and now. They were too used to guides and videos and thought everything should be 1-2-shotted after just watching video, and raids moving to dance system didn't help either. Well, I guess that was the "bro" mentality in context of OP.

[Wilian]

This thread needs more Doritos, Mt. Dew and loud dubstep so we can sell it better for bro-gamers to comment on

[Realsykes]

first bro gamers didnt play video games
then bro gamers played sports games. we all remember this, every time a sports game came out thats all they did, then that died out alot.
then bro gamers moved onto guitar hero and thats all they played, then that like completely died out
then bro gamers moved onto call of duty and call of duty is kind of dying out right now but they all kind of still stick in the fps range right now with their battlefieds and there whatevers.

i dont know whats next but i dont want no damn bro gamers in my jrpgs

I was unaware you get to decide what people play base don their personality.

Also, jrpgs? NERDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

[Dispraise]

I'm not going to read your entire dissertation, but I did read enough to catch the gist of it.

You wanna know my take? "bro gamers" are a hard demographic to pass up. Not just because they outnumber "true gamers", though that is a perfectly legitimate reason in itself. Thing is, it actually has so much more to do with the fact that they are the much more reliable consumers. Devs know they can safely pour millions into developing "bro" games, because they know that their loyal fanbase will buy up their titles and play them through. If they fail to deliver on quality, the bros will let them know, but will still remain loyal fans into the next installment.

"true gamers", however, are fickle. More damning than that, they are disingenuous. They promise they will reward innovation, then they slam anybody who tries something new. They cry out for creativity, even praise those few titles that meet their high standards. Those titles then sit, unplayed, unpurchased, and unwanted. Sure, some gamers really do appreciate the effort, but many others simply act like petulant children. Why would anyone willingly choose to develop for them, when developing for "bros" is so much more rewarding?

[Bullettime]

I'm not going to read your entire dissertation, but I did read enough to catch the gist of it.

You wanna know my take? "bro gamers" are a hard demographic to pass up. Not just because they outnumber "true gamers", though that is a perfectly legitimate reason in itself. Thing is, it actually has so much more to do with the fact that they are the much more reliable consumers. Devs know they can safely pour millions into developing "bro" games, because they know that their loyal fanbase will buy up their titles and play them through. If they fail to deliver on quality, the bros will let them know, but will still remain loyal fans into the next installment.

"true gamers", however, are fickle. More damning than that, they are disingenuous. They promise they will reward innovation, then they slam anybody who tries something new. They cry out for creativity, even praise those few titles that meet their high standards. Those titles then sit, unplayed, unpurchased, and unwanted. Sure, some gamers really do appreciate the effort, but many others simply act like petulant children. Why would anyone willingly choose to develop for them, when developing for "bros" is so much more rewarding?

Also the fact that bro gamers will buy up the annual generic crap game with little to no changes from the previous years' or games with on disc DLC. Very little effort required and immensely profitable.