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  1. #841
    Quote Originally Posted by Beelzebull View Post
    Still I am bummed that we need to use a talent for Gladiator Resolve. It should be built in imo and you do a quest for it at level 15 I never find a need to switch to battle stance as protection warrior when I need to tank. I see no point in that stance.

    It would be built in with all the restrictions as it currently is. Make it happen
    Quoting my self i know but it seems like we getting it baseline from the patch notes??? Weeeeeeee
    Created on the 25th April 2005.
    Protection Warrior since the old days of UBRS.

  2. #842
    Quote Originally Posted by Beelzebull View Post
    Quoting my self i know but it seems like we getting it baseline from the patch notes??? Weeeeeeee
    Yeah man, I am super interested to know WTF is going on there... I will be pretty excited if we get it baseline. It should also mean a nice DPS increase for Glad Warriors too, as they'd be able to pick up one of the other lvl 100 DPS talents, like Ravager.

  3. #843
    As I said in another thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by Warriorsarri View Post
    This is simply a tooltip change, this is already on live.

  4. #844
    I'm currently maining monk and want to sometimes play warri at a decent level too(mb reroll too ^^). with my warri i have fury spec and prot as OS. my guildmates use fury/arms, actually i think arms more often. unfortunatly i don't have a 2H weapon to try arms atm (unless 620 acc weap...) so fury/prot is the best choice atm.

    now to my question:
    is arms a must have for warri atm? i remember when i checked several logs where i see like only arms in top100
    where are the strengths for arms and where is fury better? is glad warri an viable option too? if yes, when?

    i guess there is allready an answer on this class forum but i couldn't find it yet. sry for "requestion" :P

    e: i just checked top 10 of HM logs for warriors and every single #1 log is an arms and most top 10s are arms > fury
    if i would draw a conclusion from that point of view.. all i need is arms?
    Last edited by philsndude; 2015-01-28 at 02:40 PM.

  5. #845
    Anyone else sticking with gladiator in BRF?

  6. #846
    Scarab Lord Bigbazz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by philsndude View Post
    I'm currently maining monk and want to sometimes play warri at a decent level too(mb reroll too ^^). with my warri i have fury spec and prot as OS. my guildmates use fury/arms, actually i think arms more often. unfortunatly i don't have a 2H weapon to try arms atm (unless 620 acc weap...) so fury/prot is the best choice atm.

    now to my question:
    is arms a must have for warri atm? i remember when i checked several logs where i see like only arms in top100
    where are the strengths for arms and where is fury better? is glad warri an viable option too? if yes, when?

    i guess there is allready an answer on this class forum but i couldn't find it yet. sry for "requestion" :P

    e: i just checked top 10 of HM logs for warriors and every single #1 log is an arms and most top 10s are arms > fury
    if i would draw a conclusion from that point of view.. all i need is arms?
    Gladiator - Does decent single target damage, and great Cleave damage, decent enough sustained AOE damage but not great burst AOE damage. Of course you could take Bladestorm for burst AOE but then you sacrifice greatly on your single target/cleave damage, and Bladestorm is not as powerful for Gladiator as it is for Fury/Arms. The Execute phase for Gladiator does represent a dps increase but it's very minimal compared to Arms/Fury, and can even lead to a dps loss if not executed well. Still, the spec can do well on pretty much all fights if you plan ahead, it also has great personal survival even though Defensive Stance is not available.

    Arms - The no1 logs of Arms are probably not representitive of a realistic situation, and are also plagued with logs from before Arms mastery got nerfed (the original buff left it hilariously overpowered and Arms Warriors shot to the top of the ranks). Arms Does decent single target (worse than Gladiator in my experience unless the execute phase is kind/long) but the main reason people use Arms is due to amazing sustained AOE in addition to strong burst AOE, and better 2 target cleave than Gladiator. On top of that, if you have adds with low health that sit around you can Execute them for massive damage, even executes with Sweeping Strikes active. Ko'ragh for example is amazing for Arms (and Fury) because of the multiple execute phases and the burst AOE on the adds.

    Fury - The best single target, though in my experience it's very close to Gladiator here. Fury gains great benefits from the Execute phase (though not quite like Arms) and also has great burst AOE, in addition to pretty good sustained AOE (better than Gladiator). My experience with the 2 target cleave of Fury show it to be poor, but I don't have enough experience to comment with much accuracy as I've mostly played Arms/Glad in these situations.



    If you play them well then all 3 specs will do you more than good enough for a non-world first progression guild. For reference, at Ilvl673 my last weeks Butcher kill I played Gladiator and did 33k. On Kargath I took Bladestorm to clear the stands as Gladiator (our tank wanted Mocking Banner) and was able to pull 50k on that fight, and could realistically do much better with a clean kill. Same Ilvl on Brackenspore I did 38k one week as Gladiator (40k as Arms week before that). It's capable, but it's not really the best at anything.
    Last edited by Bigbazz; 2015-02-07 at 01:22 PM.
    I7 2600k @4.5ghz : 16GB DDR3 : GTX670 : Firestudio : Naga : G27

  7. #847
    Did heroic Foundry last night and killed Gruul, Beastlord, Arnies and attempted Trains. Wasn't what I expected if I'm honest, on Gruul I was second highest melee to a very skilled rogue and on the Arnies I was top dps. However on Beastlord I was getting beaten by two fury warriors who were ~5K ahead of me, on Trains they were ahead again so I ended up using my arms offspec for the extra cleaveyness.

    Does this tally with others experience? Or am I doing something wrong?

  8. #848
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Did heroic Foundry last night and killed Gruul, Beastlord, Arnies and attempted Trains. Wasn't what I expected if I'm honest, on Gruul I was second highest melee to a very skilled rogue and on the Arnies I was top dps. However on Beastlord I was getting beaten by two fury warriors who were ~5K ahead of me, on Trains they were ahead again so I ended up using my arms offspec for the extra cleaveyness.

    Does this tally with others experience? Or am I doing something wrong?
    You're not going to beat anyone with Ravager when you're getting addwaves every minute on the dot ( beast/trains ). This should be expected.

  9. #849
    Quote Originally Posted by Polondor View Post
    Anyone else sticking with gladiator in BRF?
    I just started! Granted in my guild, we have only downed 2 mythic bosses in BRF

  10. #850
    Just skimming the PTR notes, Glad stance is getting a flat +30% mastery buff, and the new ledge ring increases versatility by 10%, causes 10% of damage taken to be redirected and split between other wearers of the ring and copies 10% of healing received splitting it between other wearers of the ring.

    By comparison the new STR DPS ring has a damage buff that bounces around all wearers of the ring (10s per jump) which increases damage by +10% for every person in the group with the ring.

    My thoughts:

    1: +30% to master buff is nice, wonder if it will now surpass crit?

    2: The new armour ring not increasing damage is /meh, however it may prove to give u some raid utility if having us in raid reduces the damage the MT will take (unless it kills us).

    3: The STR DPS ring sounds cool, but its basically saying "the bigger the raid group the better this buff is" in big letters (the AGI/INT ones are the same) so the is 0 chance of it making it to live once blizzard receive the fury of <30m groups lol.

  11. #851
    So trying to run the numbers on the 30% mastery buff for Gladiators.

    Here is the breakdown for stat weights currently

    Scale Factors for Reck_Active Damage Per Second
    Wdps Str AP BonusArmor Haste Crit Mult Vers Mastery
    Scale Factors 7.27 6.27 5.77 5.77 4.48 3.64 3.31 2.84 2.61
    Normalized 1.16 1.00 0.92 0.92 0.72 0.58 0.53 0.45 0.42
    Scale Deltas 95 315 315 315 315 315 315 315 315
    Error 0.32 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10
    Gear Ranking wowhead
    Optimizers askmrrobot
    Ranking Wdps > Str > AP ~= BonusArmor > Haste > Crit > Mult > Vers > Mastery

    So with mastery being at 0.42, and buffing it by 30% puts it at 0.546, on par slightly above multistrike.

    I think I got something figured out, not sure about the accuracy here, just spit ballin.

    Current dps


    DPS DPS(e) DPS Error DPS Range DPR
    39540.3 39540.3 21.4 / 0.054% 4279.7 / 10.8% 4581.3

    30% more Mastery

    DPS DPS(e) DPS Error DPS Range DPR
    40697.0 40697.0 21.9 / 0.054% 4393.6 / 10.8% 4712.2

    Looks like about a 3% dps buff by my paper napkin math using my character info. It still doesn't move the needle much in the overall class dps rankings.

    Oh well, not all that great after all.

  12. #852
    The legendary rings will not go live as is. There's no chance.

    Funny note about the ring: The entire raid could wear the tanking one and everyone would be nearly invincible.

    Aside from that, it promotes severe class stacking. Top end guilds would literally not bring a single non-int user.

  13. #853
    The Lightbringer Archimtiros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    The legendary rings will not go live as is. There's no chance.

    Funny note about the ring: The entire raid could wear the tanking one and everyone would be nearly invincible.

    Aside from that, it promotes severe class stacking. Top end guilds would literally not bring a single non-int user.
    It's already been said that they won't go live.

    However the rings (as is) don't work like that anyway. You can't get a ring that doesn't fit one of your specializations, so many classes wouldn't be able to get them anyways. Second, there can only be one of each buff active in the raid at the time, so at most you'd have 10 armor rings in raid and one person would have a 100% buff for 12 seconds at a time.

    If you have only 2 tanks and 2 armor rings, that means each will have a 20% buff for half the fight. If you have only 1 str ring in group, that person will have a 100% uptime on a 10% buff.

    Regardless, as previous, it's already been publicly stated that the rings shown were from an older build and have been redesigned.

  14. #854
    Quote Originally Posted by Ularius View Post
    So trying to run the numbers on the 30% mastery buff for Gladiators.

    Here is the breakdown for stat weights currently

    Scale Factors for Reck_Active Damage Per Second
    Wdps Str AP BonusArmor Haste Crit Mult Vers Mastery
    Scale Factors 7.27 6.27 5.77 5.77 4.48 3.64 3.31 2.84 2.61
    Normalized 1.16 1.00 0.92 0.92 0.72 0.58 0.53 0.45 0.42
    Scale Deltas 95 315 315 315 315 315 315 315 315
    Error 0.32 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10 0.10
    Gear Ranking wowhead
    Optimizers askmrrobot
    Ranking Wdps > Str > AP ~= BonusArmor > Haste > Crit > Mult > Vers > Mastery

    So with mastery being at 0.42, and buffing it by 30% puts it at 0.546, on par slightly above multistrike.

    I think I got something figured out, not sure about the accuracy here, just spit ballin.

    Current dps


    DPS DPS(e) DPS Error DPS Range DPR
    39540.3 39540.3 21.4 / 0.054% 4279.7 / 10.8% 4581.3

    30% more Mastery

    DPS DPS(e) DPS Error DPS Range DPR
    40697.0 40697.0 21.9 / 0.054% 4393.6 / 10.8% 4712.2

    Looks like about a 3% dps buff by my paper napkin math using my character info. It still doesn't move the needle much in the overall class dps rankings.

    Oh well, not all that great after all.
    I got the following:

    Str BonusArmor AP Crit Mult Mastery Vers Haste
    Scale Factors 6.19 5.71 5.67 3.29 3.29 2.85 2.74 2.13
    Normalized 1.00 0.92 0.91 0.53 0.53 0.46 0.44 0.34
    Scale Deltas 315 315 315 315 315 315 315 315
    Error 0.11 0.11 0.11 0.11 0.11 0.11 0.11 0.11
    Gear Ranking wowhead
    Optimizers askmrrobot
    Ranking Str > BonusArmor ~= AP > Crit ~= Mult > Mastery ~= Vers > Haste

    Which would put mastery with +30% ahead of everything but STR/AP/BA, what did I do wrong? lol.

  15. #855
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    It's already been said that they won't go live.

    However the rings (as is) don't work like that anyway. You can't get a ring that doesn't fit one of your specializations, so many classes wouldn't be able to get them anyways. Second, there can only be one of each buff active in the raid at the time, so at most you'd have 10 armor rings in raid and one person would have a 100% buff for 12 seconds at a time.

    If you have only 2 tanks and 2 armor rings, that means each will have a 20% buff for half the fight. If you have only 1 str ring in group, that person will have a 100% uptime on a 10% buff.

    Regardless, as previous, it's already been publicly stated that the rings shown were from an older build and have been redesigned.
    Yes you can. It was mentioned on the holy paladin episode of Finalboss. You just need to change the dropdown at the top from "warrior" to "all classes". Also the tank ring didn't have a proc, it was all passive(10% vers, 10% healing and damage received copied and split across other wearers). Then again, it doesn't really matter, Blizzard has confirmed that the datamined effects are an old version.

  16. #856
    The Lightbringer Archimtiros's Avatar
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    Yes you are right, the tank one wasn't a proc, it's shared damage intake and healing; still that doesn't quite equate to invincibility. It would actually end up being very mediocre with excess rings, since it only splits 10% of the damage without any sort of stacking.

    With 2 people with the ring, one person takes 90% damage and the other takes 10%. With 3 people with the ring, the primary still takes 90% while the other two take 5% each. If 11 ring wearers, the primary would still take 90% and everyone else would take 1% of the remaining 10 each. Not exactly game breaking by any means, and a serious DPS loss from not having the DPS ring procs floating around in the raid.

    And you may recall I did say multiple times that they were being removed. Almost the moment they were discovered.
    Last edited by Archimtiros; 2015-04-15 at 09:08 AM.

  17. #857
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    Yes you are right, the tank one wasn't a proc, it's shared damage intake and healing; still that doesn't quite equate to invincibility. It would actually end up being very mediocre with excess rings, since it only splits 10% of the damage without any sort of stacking.

    With 2 people with the ring, one person takes 90% damage and the other takes 10%. With 3 people with the ring, the primary still takes 90% while the other two take 5% each. If 11 ring wearers, the primary would still take 90% and everyone else would take 1% of the remaining 10 each. Not exactly game breaking by any means, and a serious DPS loss from not having the DPS ring procs floating around in the raid.

    And you may recall I did say multiple times that they were being removed. Almost the moment they were discovered.
    It'd basically be a 10% damage reduction(because if the whole raid has the ring, the split 10% damage is going to be pretty much unnoticeable with leech and random healing going around), 10% healing increase and the versatility. Which could be strong in some situations, but the DPS loss would probably make it not worth doing(as you said)
    Last edited by Tradu; 2015-04-15 at 09:14 AM.

  18. #858
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    And you may recall I did say multiple times that they were being removed. Almost the moment they were discovered.
    The updated procs Blizzard posted today don't look much better for Glad, maybe the mastery buff is because if this goes live we will have to swap to the non-BA ring?

  19. #859
    The Lightbringer Archimtiros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    The updated procs Blizzard posted today don't look much better for Glad, maybe the mastery buff is because if this goes live we will have to swap to the non-BA ring?
    The code on those effects is already so convoluted they would either have to create a new ring for Bonus Armor/DPS or add a DPS component to the tank one, neither of which seems likely.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tradu View Post
    It'd basically be a 10% damage reduction(because if the whole raid has the ring, the split 10% damage is going to be pretty much unnoticeable with leech and random healing going around), 10% healing increase and the versatility. Which could be strong in some situations, but the DPS loss would probably make it not worth doing(as you said)
    But the tank is already getting that 10% reduction regardless of whether one or a hundred other people have the ring on. Their damage is only reduced to 90%. Extra rings just spread out that 10% damage more. Even on a ridiculously strong hit, 10% (spread to 5% or less) is going to end up inconsequential.

    Regardless, it isn't worth debating further.

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